Why Afghans hate Pakistan?(a logical discussion)

[Karachi]

Hahah...We have kicked your uncle altaf out its more then enough..
Are you Indian ? living in PAKSITAN ? When you will go back to your land ?

Idiot you didn't do that anyways, he left himself, you can't even hold your shalwars together, this is how dumb you are

[Karachi]

Oink oink

seriously though, what good have pakis ever done in this world, just name once thing.

[Elite Pakhtun]

seriously though, what good have pakis ever done in this world, just name once thing.

Largest refugee recipients in the world for many years. That's 1.

[Peacelove]

Idiot you didn't do that anyways, he left himself, you can't even hold your shalwars together, this is how dumb you are

The land of pure is purified ..He will not be able to come again..I know it hurts but you have to deal with it
By the way did India accept you ?or you ran away to canada or south africa sectors of MQM

[~Zarlakhta~]

I'm sorry, up until now your points have been sensible; but you've lost a major amount of credibility

Please don't trivialize his zalum as simply 'flaws' he was not just flawed but outrightly a tyrant and corrupt and more watanfarosh than even Taliban are. Taliban are Pakistani proxies, but Najib was Russia's puppet who actually gave Russians military authority in Afghanistan. This is well documented and verified by historical consensus, He was complicit in the rapes and massacres of more Afghans than the entire rapes and massacres of the Mujahideen.

Support or endorsing tyrants is never justified whether they come in the form of Theocrats or secularists. Najib is pure garbage. the worst of them all if you go by the lives he's ruined.

I'm giving my opinion here, not facts. Not sure how opinions should prove its credibility. And by the way, it wasn't Najibullah who invited te Soviets into Afghanistan. The Russian invitation was part of the mess created by Daud Khan, which might have been in innocence or out of lack of understanding to its danger, but the difference here was that Najibullah favoured a Communist regime over Islamic or Democratic regime. Afghanistan was in war for a good decade, it'll be silly to keep count of how many people got killed at Najib's or Massoud's or anyone else's hand. Najibullah was brutal against his enemies, no doubt. But his long term vision, the aftermath of when Soviets left, and his co-operation with Mujahideen Hebzs were more mature than everything else that followed.

He was known as Najib-e Gaw due to ongoing conflicts in Kabul, but visit Kabul today and speak to any Kabuli abroad who's fully studied Najibullah's vision. Their reasons won't be any more different, nor surprising. There's a reason why most Kabulis, and most Afghans who've been highly educated and progressive themselves, wish Najibullah could've stayed in power longer.

[~Zarlakhta~]

You are entitled to your views.
The three reasons(A,B,C) that you stated for Najibullah seem to be true.I also feel that he was sincere towards Afghanistan in general and Pashtuns in particular according to his own understanding and ideas.
But man, was he a brutal dictator.I mean, the violent suppression of opposition that he (first as head of KHAD and then as president) enforced was unmatched.The killings, torture etc. Not to mention the fact that he was on the side of the Soviets while they were rampaging the country.

Let me mention something that I find funny.By his looks and facial expressions, Najibullah appeared to be a kind and compassionate man.How kind and compassionate he was really, I have no need to elaborate upon.

Najibullah's targets were his rivals, not the innocent. Dostum was known as purchasable dictator who could convert an entire province into his favour within days, which caused Najibullah to send him down South to weaken the Mujahideen fighters. However, when reports came up of Dostum plundering and harassing ordinary citizens of the South, he was expelled from the post by Najibullah. That's why Dostum sought alliance with Massoud, which also got rejected. And his alliance with Hekmatyar didn't last too long either.

What we're missing out on is that Najibullah was a communist, whether that was a Russian regime or American wasn't the point. He was in favour of his alliance with Pakistani Pashtuns, but he didn't want any involvement of the Pakistani government for very valid reasons. That's why he had to choose between Russian communism, or American/European/Pakistani Mujahideen.

You need study the incidents between Mujahideen, Taliban and everything that happened during Soviet occupation and after its withdrawal. Najibullah felt the only way to bring stuff under control is to eliminate opposition and create one standing, unified government. Najibullah's policies were larger and brighter than what occurred WHILST the country was going through external wars. Najibullah is being shamed for being part of a Kafir KHAD regime, but it's being ignored that the Islamic Mujahideen or Taliban couldn't bring unity and equality between different tribes, religions, regime, genders, and you name it.

[~Zarlakhta~]

You have narrated the Afghan perspective.As far as Pakistani Pashtuns' hatred for Afghans(and Afghanistan) is concerned, I would say that it is relatively new.It has grown on to this scale only in the last couple of years.The reasons for it are:
1- The media is potraying Afghanistan as a Pakistan-hating, India-loving country.
2- The belief that terrorist attacks that occur in Pakistan are planned and sourced from Afghanistan.
3- Afghan refugees in Pakistan are involved in various criminal activities.
4- Afghans in Pakistan are a burden on local economy and provide competition to local businessmen, servicepeople, labour etc.

Afghanistan is an India loving country and its true, BUT that isn't at the cost of their hatred for Pakistan and this is a perspective Pakistanis need to get rid off. Every single Swatay I've met KNOWS the terrorist activities in Swat and other parts of Pakhtunkhwa were imposed by Pakistani government, and they also stated reasons why they're convinced that's the case. Most Pashtuns I know respected Afghan refugees in Pakhtunkhwa, and respect them now too.

Those Pashtuns who depend on media to form their opinion are in denial of reality. But I'm not surprised. I've seen so many Pashtuns being ignorant about their history and political facts that nothing about what Pashtuns say or think surprises me.

[toughpashtun]

Najibullah's targets were his rivals, not the innocent. Dostum was known as purchasable dictator who could convert an entire province into his favour within days, which caused Najibullah to send him down South to weaken the Mujahideen fighters. However, when reports came up of Dostum plundering and harassing ordinary citizens of the South, he was expelled from the post by Najibullah. That's why Dostum sought alliance with Massoud, which also got rejected. And his alliance with Hekmatyar didn't last too long either.

What we're missing out on is that Najibullah was a communist, whether that was a Russian regime or American wasn't the point. He was in favour of his alliance with Pakistani Pashtuns, but he didn't want any involvement of the Pakistani government for very valid reasons. That's why he had to choose between Russian communism, or American/European/Pakistani Mujahideen.

You need study the incidents between Mujahideen, Taliban and everything that happened during Soviet occupation and after its withdrawal. Najibullah felt the only way to bring stuff under control is to eliminate opposition and create one standing, unified government. Najibullah's policies were larger and brighter than what occurred WHILST the country was going through external wars. Najibullah is being shamed for being part of a Kafir KHAD regime, but it's being ignored that the Islamic Mujahideen or Taliban couldn't bring unity and equality between different tribes, religions, regime, genders, and you name it.

One thing that got my attention was that you wrote " Dostum was known as purchasable dictator who could convert an entire province into his favour within days, which caused Najibullah to send him down South to weaken the Mujahideen fighters. However, when reports came up of Dostum plundering and harassing ordinary citizens of the South, he was expelled from the post by Najibullah."

1- How come Dostum would convert entire province into his favour?by using force?what do you mean exactly?
2- In which era/year approximately did the incident of Najib sending Dostum to the South take place?During Soviet period?After Soviet withdrawal?

[toughpashtun]

Afghanistan is an India loving country and its true, BUT that isn't at the cost of their hatred for Pakistan and this is a perspective Pakistanis need to get rid off. Every single Swatay I've met KNOWS the terrorist activities in Swat and other parts of Pakhtunkhwa were imposed by Pakistani government, and they also stated reasons why they're convinced that's the case. Most Pashtuns I know respected Afghan refugees in Pakhtunkhwa, and respect them now too.

Those Pashtuns who depend on media to form their opinion are in denial of reality. But I'm not surprised. I've seen so many Pashtuns being ignorant about their history and political facts that nothing about what Pashtuns say or think surprises me.

I'll elaborate on two points you mentioned.
1-- The view that terrorists in Swat and other parts of Pakhtunkhwa(Pakistan) were imposed by the Pakistan govt is the view of ANP. They think that the Paki govt sent militants to finish off ANP. I have two counter arguements to this :
a- If the Paki govt did impose these terrorists , WHY did they do it?
b- If the Paki govt did impose these terrorists , then why did they later on carry out effective military operations and wiped these areas clean off these terrorists?

2-- The more educated and mature Pakistani Pashtuns even today have feeling of respect for Afghan refugees.But there is a large segment of society who in recent years have turned against Afghans and Afghan refugees due to the reasons I mentioned earlier.

[Karachi]

Largest refugee recipients in the world for many years. That's 1.

Thats because that was a devious plan by paki military to take over Afghanistan, it was all part of that plan, it wasn't really to help Afghans

[khushal]

The hate for Pakistan is a new phenomenon. It is mostly carried out by the Afghan media to legitimize its own kleptocratic corrupt gov against a popular insurgency. It labels the insurgency as Pakistani to deflect the legitimate blame and shorcomings of the kleptocratic afghan gov. They are copying the kleptocratic corrupt paki gov policy towards India which is why all pakis hate india.

Satanic govs create fitna so they can stay in power at the expense of the people.

[єѕαρχαι]

The hate is justified. Pakistan's support for terrorists in Afghanistan is not hidden from anyone.

[Azmal]

The hate for Pakistan is a new phenomenon. It is mostly carried out by the Afghan media to legitimize its own kleptocratic corrupt gov against a popular insurgency. It labels the insurgency as Pakistani to deflect the legitimate blame and shorcomings of the kleptocratic afghan gov. They are copying the kleptocratic corrupt paki gov policy towards India which is why all pakis hate india.

Satanic govs create fitna so they can stay in power at the expense of the people.

Afghanistan must recognized Durrand line Kushal,
Stop playing god with labeling Afghans Satanic....Your own Pakis are admitting the truth.


https://www.facebook.com/AzadPakhtoo...3914955050756/

[~Zarlakhta~]

1- How come Dostum would convert entire province into his favour?by using force?what do you mean exactly?
2- In which era/year approximately did the incident of Najib sending Dostum to the South take place?During Soviet period?After Soviet withdrawal?

Yes, by force against the opposition. Communists were in two groups, Khalqi and Parchami. Najibullah was Parchami and Dostum was on the side of whoever paid him more. His force was a very strong one physically and military wise. The incidents in South happened a couple of years before Soviet withdrawal, not sure whether you've heard of 'Fall of Arghandab' but that was one of the areas Dostum failed miserably and the locals sides Mujahideen due to the plunder spread by Dostum.

The book I quoted earlier name of, 'Afghanistan', and a Farsi history book called 'Hezbe Natakmeel' state the conflicts around larger part of control over Southern provinces.

[~Zarlakhta~]

a- If the Paki govt did impose these terrorists , WHY did they do it?
b- If the Paki govt did impose these terrorists , then why did they later on carry out effective military operations and wiped these areas clean off these terrorists?

Those were claims by those escaping the violence in Pakhtunkhw, not me. But as for your questions, it's politically a very naive question wrora. Before I answer it straight away, lemme ask a counter question:
A- do you know why 9/11 happened, who's done it and why it was carried out?
B- do you know why the London attacks happened, who's done it and why it was carried out?

This questions should give you your own answer, but if you're still unsure then I'll explain why I'm asking these, and why I for a big part agree with the arguments of my friends from Pakhunkhwa.