Destroy the myth

[DSM0305]

There have been countless statements by Pakistanis, both in this forum and others. One in particular bothers me the most and should be addressed asap. That particular statement is, that Pakistanis are helping Pashtuns in Afghanistan or as some rephrase it and said; Taliban in Afghanistan are Pashtuns who fight the ''oppressive'' northern alliance.

First of all, lets analyze how Taliban are the one who keeps Pashtuns away from power.

Taliban have been active mostly in Pashtun dominated south and east. The soldiers, officials, police etc. everyone who got killed by far are mostly Pashtuns. Civilians who got caught in cross fire or killed by suicide bombs are all Pashtuns. All the property destroyed are mostly Pashtun owned. Roads, bridges and other infrastructure destroyed or in general prevented being built at all, are all in Pashtun dominated areas. Population prevented gaining education are all in Pashtun dominated areas. Governmental jobs prevented by the insurgency are all in Pashtun dominated areas. War refugee are mostly Pashtuns.

So can anyone tell me, how in god name are the Taliban or Pakistanis supporting Pashtuns in Afghanistan... Pashtuns in Afghanistan were the elites, the most educated and the richest people in Afghanistan before the wars. Now Pashtuns are probably the most miserable people in Afghanistan, not because we are weak, but because Pashtuns have been caught between a wall and a hard place. Pashtuns are certainly not weak, despite all the odds and insurgency who constantly making the life miserable for them, despite other ethnicities constantly nagging them, many still manage to hold big positions in the government. Pashtuns still manage to be equally represented in the government.

Basically what Pakistan have done by supporting Taliban is damaging Pashtuns in Afghanistan. There have never been any bigger obstacle for Pashtuns than the insurgency in Afghanistan. Pashtuns have been damaged literally in every field by the insurgency; education, economy, business, jobs opportunities, military, governmental, society in general.

Do you guys know that Pashtun areas are worth less land wise than other areas. Do you guys know that business wise there are far more opportunities in non-pashtun areas than Pashtun areas. Do you guys know why? It because the Pashtun areas are insecure and are in constant threat. Due to insurgency there are far less government activities in those areas, which not only make it insecure, but also gives free access to criminals for their activities. Most killings and kidnappings are done there, because police have limited access there.

I am not here to burst bobbles, but want to inform people that Pakistanis are by no means any help to Pashtuns, they're the biggest obstacle for Pashtuns.

I am not here to debate Pakistani vs afghan thing. I posted this to rebuke the myth that Pakistanis are somehow helping/supporting Pashtuns in Afghanistan. Pakistanis have done nothing but support an obstacle for Pashtuns. Even if you as a Pakistani support Taliban, at least have the decency to not fool yourself and others, by saying that you're supporting Pashtuns.

[Elite Pakhtun]

Are the Taliban not mostly Pashtun themselves?

[DSM0305]

Are the Taliban not mostly Pashtun themselves?

This is exactly what I mean. It is a very cheap way to look at things at.

TTP are also Pashtuns, what good did they bring to KPK. Daesh is also native Syrians, Iraqis and Sunnis to top it off. What good did they bring to Syria and Iraq or Sunnis for that matter.

Looking at things through the linse of ''hey, they are Pashtuns, so obviously they're helping Pashuns'', wont exactly thrive Pashtuns to glories.

What people need to know is that Taliban aren't ethnic based movement. It just happens to have a Pashtun majority. They're not looking for the interest of Pashtuns or any other ethnicity for that matter. They're not fighting for Pashtun ''rights'', they aren't fighting for promotion of Pashto language or culture. A Taliban said once, we don't care if it is even a Russian Muslim, as long he is fighting for our cause.

BLA is an ethnic based movement who fights for Baloch freedom. Peshmerga is an ethnic based fighters for Kurds. People can agree or disagree with them, but their cause is based on ethnicity. Taliban in the other hand isn't. The sooner people realize it, the better it is.

[Porus]

But to what extent is support for Taliban even remotely popular in Afghanistan? Don't the Afghans hate the Taliban?

[Peshawer_222]

This is exactly what I mean. It is a very cheap way to look at things at.

TTP are also Pashtuns, what good did they bring to KPK. Daesh is also native Syrians, Iraqis and Sunnis to top it off. What good did they bring to Syria and Iraq or Sunnis for that matter.

Looking at things through the linse of ''hey, they are Pashtuns, so obviously they're helping Pashuns'', wont exactly thrive Pashtuns to glories.

What people need to know is that Taliban aren't ethnic based movement. It just happens to have a Pashtun majority. They're not looking for the interest of Pashtuns or any other ethnicity for that matter. They're not fighting for Pashtun ''rights'', they aren't fighting for promotion of Pashto language or culture. A Taliban said once, we don't care if it is even a Russian Muslim, as long he is fighting for our cause.

BLA is an ethnic based movement who fights for Baloch freedom. Peshmerga is an ethnic based fighters for Kurds. People can agree or disagree with them, but their cause is based on ethnicity. Taliban in the other hand isn't. The sooner people realize it, the better it is.

You cannot compare BLA and Taliban . BLA have a few dozen fighters left . Rest have either laid down their arms or have been shot dead by forces . TTP also has been dismantled from KP and Fata and currently hold no ground on our territory .

Talibans case is different because it is kind of a parallel government to Ashraf Ghani's. It holds 35 % area of all Afghanistan , has significant support amongst the locals because of rampant corruption in Afghanistan . Justice is not given hence people prefer going to Taliban jury for settlements .

David Cameron is only half right about Afghanistan and Nigeria being the 'most corrupt countries in the world' | The Independent

Somalia , Noth Korea and Afghanistan were the most corrupt countries in the world . Solve this problem and 50 % of your problems will be solved . Courts are corrupt to the core , Your governers take money and give land to Taliban , Rampant corruption in your army means that they lack any professionalism . When they see an approaching talib they vacate their posts . Guardian is quoted as saying even if tap water is to be set up it gets politicised . If the country and government is corrupt to this end how do you blame people swinging towards talibs?

Solve your internal issues instead of Blaming Pakistan for everything

[dawn]

But to what extent is support for Taliban even remotely popular in Afghanistan? Don't the Afghans hate the Taliban?

99% of Afghan pashtuns IN AFGHANISTAN support Taliban.

[DSM0305]

You cannot compare BLA and Taliban . BLA have a few dozen fighters left . Rest have either laid down their arms or have been shot dead by forces . TTP also has been dismantled from KP and Fata and currently hold no ground on our territory .

Talibans case is different because it is kind of a parallel government to Ashraf Ghani's. It holds 35 % area of all Afghanistan , has significant support amongst the locals because of rampant corruption in Afghanistan . Justice is not given hence people prefer going to Taliban jury for settlements .

David Cameron is only half right about Afghanistan and Nigeria being the 'most corrupt countries in the world' | The Independent

Somalia , Noth Korea and Afghanistan were the most corrupt countries in the world . Solve this problem and 50 % of your problems will be solved . Courts are corrupt to the core , Your governers take money and give land to Taliban , Rampant corruption in your army means that they lack any professionalism . When they see an approaching talib they vacate their posts . Guardian is quoted as saying even if tap water is to be set up it gets politicised . If the country and government is corrupt to this end how do you blame people swinging towards talibs?

Solve your internal issues instead of Blaming Pakistan for everything

I don't know whether you're in propaganda spree, whose sole purpose is to copy and past the same thing over and over again, or you're actually an idiot with comprehension problems. My conclusion is that you're both. Basically a mental unstable idiot who repeat the same thing over and over again, with no comprehension skill to comprehend what other posters write.

Debunking your statements are quite easy, but this topic isn't about your mental unstable state of mind.

This topic is about the fact that Pakistanis assumes they're supporting Pashtuns in Afghanistan, which I showed that they don't. And I knew some idiot like you would come and turn this topic into an Afghan vs Pakistani thing, so I made sure to mention that it is not. I just didn't expect a complete retard like you to still turn this off topic.

[DSM0305]

99% of Afghan pashtuns IN AFGHANISTAN support Taliban.

Do you have a source regarding that or are you another retarded Pakistani, who pulls things out of his back door.

[DSM0305]

But to what extent is support for Taliban even remotely popular in Afghanistan? Don't the Afghans hate the Taliban?

Finally someone who isn't gone off topic.

Most Afghans indeed doesn't support Taliban, but an insurgency this size who have support from a foreign country, will be difficult for Afghans to tackle with limited resources and intern problems.

[Elite Pakhtun]

[MENTION=8995]DSM0305[/MENTION], very interesting. What do you think of the northern alliance? Is there a concern that afghan government is overrepresented by Tajiks? Is there not an ethnic "battle" of sorts to determine who's going to be in power in Afghanistan?

[Peshawer_222]

I don't know whether you're in propaganda spree, whose sole purpose is to copy and past the same thing over and over again, or you're actually an idiot with comprehension problems. My conclusion is that you're both. Basically a mental unstable idiot who repeat the same thing over and over again, with no comprehension skill to comprehend what other posters write.

Debunking your statements are quite easy, but this topic isn't about your mental unstable state of mind.

This topic is about the fact that Pakistanis assumes they're supporting Pashtuns in Afghanistan, which I showed that they don't. And I knew some idiot like you would come and turn this topic into an Afghan vs Pakistani thing, so I made sure to mention that it is not. I just didn't expect a complete retard like you to still turn this off topic.

There you go with your abuse and name calling . You guys need to learn how to talk and discuss topics with people from other backgrounds without your hatred in full flow . No Pakistani assumes they are helping Pashtuns . Every Pakistani is mature enough to understand that their government is meddling in Afghanistan for its own strategic interests .

[Peshawer_222]

Finally someone who isn't gone off topic.

Most Afghans indeed doesn't support Taliban, but an insurgency this size who have support from a foreign country, will be difficult for Afghans to tackle with limited resources and intern problems.

Don't kid yourself or insult everyone's intelligence here . Vast majority of afghans do support Taliban .

Afghan support for Taliban plunging, poll finds - CBS News

The survey found that an overwhelming majority of Afghan adults, 82 percent, back reconciliation and reintegration efforts with insurgent groups. It said that the number of people who said they sympathized with the aims of Taliban had dropped to 29 percent compared to 40 percent last year and 56 percent in 2009.

[DSM0305]

DSM0305 , very interesting. What do you think of the northern alliance? Is there a concern that afghan government is overrepresented by Tajiks? Is there not an ethnic "battle" of sorts to determine who's going to be in power in Afghanistan?

I am no fan of northern alliance or any other warlords.

At the beginning the government was indeed overrepresented by Farsiwans, but that was due to absence of Pashtuns. Things have slowly turned into a more stable representation of every ethnicity in the government, so today Pashtuns do have their share in the government.

I wouldn't Per se say that it is an ethnic battle, but rather some warlords who struggle to hold power in the government. To keep themselves in power, they turn the politics into an ethnic based ''battle''. To give you an example, when there were presidential election, each candidate had their team completely mixed to make sure every representation of major ethnicity were there. Yet, when things went sour, it turned into an ethnic struggle rather than political. Basically something along the line of what happening in Pakistan, with Imran khan and Nawaz sharif, but Afghans are more outspoken about it.

Basically what is hurdle for Pashtun representation is the insurgency, rather than other ethnicities or other factors for that matter.

[DSM0305]

Don't kid yourself or insult everyone's intelligence here . Vast majority of afghans do support Taliban .

Afghan support for Taliban plunging, poll finds - CBS News

The survey found that an overwhelming majority of Afghan adults, 82 percent, back reconciliation and reintegration efforts with insurgent groups. It said that the number of people who said they sympathized with the aims of Taliban had dropped to 29 percent compared to 40 percent last year and 56 percent in 2009.

This is exactly what I mean by comprehension problems. From your own source.

It said that the number of people who said they sympathized with the aims of Taliban had dropped to 29 percent compared to 40 percent last year and 56 percent in 2009.

[Peshawer_222]

This is exactly what I mean by comprehension problems. From your own source.

It said that the number of people who said they sympathized with the aims of Taliban had dropped to 29 percent compared to 40 percent last year and 56 percent in 2009.

And you dont think 29 % is alarming ? 29 % Of your population means 8-9 million Afghans sympathise with them .