Tribal elders vow to fight alongside Pak Army

[Shapur]

How much of that do you agree with? .. If we narrow it down a little more and think about the scenario of a man that has been taught that he should fight for his land then what's his mindset??. What do these anti-Pakistan guys think - that people from KP will say "come Hindu's drop your bombs, we took all your nuclear threatening to obliterate us a joke" "don't worry fucck our economy and destroy our means to eat, farm, go to school" .. What do people expect?? .. They all have citizenship to a country that lets them free travel to any province, work live and be involved in police, politics and look eye to eye with anyone else from any corner of the country and say I'm Pakistani as much as you are. Why wouldn't they fight to keep stability in that system or should they live up to the requirements of afghans and join them
In being wartorn OR up to the requirements of Indians that don't really give a Damn thing about them or their welfare. India is guna be at war with Pakistan and KP people regardless of their love or hate for the state are going to twiddle their fingers and pray the Indians don't venture that far north west?? NO CHANCE, they will be first to fight invaders and secure the wellbeing of their lands and peace for their families.

To be honest my opinion is not that relevant since I am not a Pakistani citizen. I am just trying to give Afghans a perspective on how Pakistanis see things because I have had the advantage of being around all kinds of Pakistanis (pashtuns, punjabis, kashmiris etc) and have been to Pakistan. I have seen first hand what is taught in their history books in schools and what their media says.

What I will say is that everyone regardless of where they live have a right to defend themselves when they are being attacked and oppressed. This is a fundamental human right that no one can argue with. We Pashtuns have too much on our plate to really be even thinking about starting wars with India over Kashmir or other issues. I just don't want Pashtuns to be used to serve the goals of others because Pashtuns can easily be manipulated in the name of ghairat and Islam. When the people of Waziristan became IDPs in their own country, why weren't they allowed in Punjab, Sindh etc? What I am saying is Pashtuns need to concentrate on getting their rights inside Pakistan rather than fighting in wars started by the army to keep themselves relevant.

[Manzareh]

To be honest my opinion is not that relevant since I am not a Pakistani citizen. I am just trying to give Afghans a perspective on how Pakistanis see things because I have had the advantage of being around all kinds of Pakistanis (pashtuns, punjabis, kashmiris etc) and have been to Pakistan. I have seen first hand what is taught in their history books in schools and what their media says.

What I will say is that everyone regardless of where they live have a right to defend themselves when they are being attacked and oppressed. This is a fundamental human right that no one can argue with. We Pashtuns have too much on our plate to really be even thinking about starting wars with India over Kashmir or other issues. I just don't want Pashtuns to be used to serve the goals of others because Pashtuns can easily be manipulated in the name of ghairat and Islam. When the people of Waziristan became IDPs in their own country, why weren't they allowed in Punjab, Sindh etc? What I am saying is Pashtuns need to concentrate on getting their rights inside Pakistan rather than fighting in wars started by the army to keep themselves relevant.

Fair enough. When you say Pashtuns get their rights in Pakistan what things/rights do you mean?

[Shapur]

Fair enough. When you say Pashtuns get their rights in Pakistan what things/rights do you mean?

There are so many things but just off the top of my head
- Getting rid of FCR in tribal areas
- Uniting Pashtuns into one cohesive unit instead of being split into Balochistan, FATA, PATA etc
- Fairer allocation of resources, (CPEC western route, electricity generated from Dams located in KPK e,g Tarbela Dam etc)
- Implementation of Pashto language in all spheres of life, its not enough to teach pashto up to middle school, Pashto needs to be used in all areas to stay relevant

I am sure those who live in Pakistan can come up with more, I am just going by what I see in Pashto media such as Mashaal radio etc.

[Manzareh]

There are so many things but just off the top of my head
- Getting rid of FCR in tribal areas

Abbreviation?

- Uniting Pashtuns into one cohesive unit instead of being split into Balochistan, FATA, PATA etc

This is a job for the Pashtuns to do. Don't you think? .. Pashtuns are cohesive as a unit just as much as the other ethnics are

- Fairer allocation of resources, (CPEC western route, electricity generated from Dams located in KPK e,g Tarbela Dam etc)

Still looking into this, CPEC is a very recent one and not set in stone yet, this is why there is demos. Pashtun politicians need to stand firm.

- Implementation of Pashto language in all spheres of life, its not enough to teach pashto up to middle school, Pashto needs to be used in all areas to stay relevant

Again this is on the heads of Pashtuns themselves. From what I'm aware of there isn't any core subjects that teach Punjabi, patwari etc either, the national language is compulsory, there is a certain curriculum that the school system uses its not tailor made for each province.. It's not illegal to teach Pashto in literacy either - truth is it's never been a 'shawaq' of Pashtuns to take written Pashto seriously, everything was done orally. The first book by Byazid Roshan was not long ago at all.

I am sure those who live in Pakistan can come up with more, I am just going by what I see in Pashto media such as Mashaal radio etc.

But a lot those that live in Pakistan are also patriotic 'Pakistani Pashtuns' big time that have elaborate justifications for standing under the flag. It's not like they won't be able to express any views for their loyalty. People are painting a big picture of Pashtun persecution by the racist state, but when those allegations are closely dissected all you're left with is the usual political differences that you see all over the world in rival party's. See for people to want to sway these proud pakis away from calling themselves Pakistani it is something major, life changing to be a separatist people. something major needs to be demonstrated not just those points you mentioned, it's bad but not enough for a Pakistani Pashtun to landlock himself in pashtunistan or join Afghanistan because they most probably won't coexist, there own afghans returning to Afghanistan from being refugees are seen with hostility so what about anyone else. What is the other option for pashtuns in Pakistan once they disassociate themselves from the state? Is there even one..?

[Porus]

Would love to see things from that perspective but I can't manage to go that far up my rectum. But then again, it's your opinion. I just don't believe that you should help people who mock you behind your back, and then willingly go and fight for them under the notion of "brothers in Islam".

I don't really agree with this view that Punjabis are just out there to 'mock Pashtuns'. There's racist people everywhere and Punjab is no exception. I've seen more racism on this forum than any Pakistani forum, I'll tell you that much.

Again this is on the heads of Pashtuns themselves. From what I'm aware of there isn't any core subjects that teach Punjabi, patwari etc either, the national language is compulsory, there is a certain curriculum that the school system uses its not tailor made for each province.. It's not illegal to teach Pashto in literacy either - truth is it's never been a 'shawaq' of Pashtuns to take written Pashto seriously, everything was done orally. The first book by Byazid Roshan was not long ago at all.

I don't think Pakistan should have a national language. Official can remain as English since it is the language of international communication, aside from that every province should speak their own language, they're free to use Urdu as a lingua franca, like how India does with Hindi, but Urdu shouldn't be compulsory. At best it should be limited to Karachi, or areas in Sindh where it is spoken as a mother-tongue.

[Aryana]

I don't really agree with this view that Punjabis are just out there to 'mock Pashtuns'. There's racist people everywhere and Punjab is no exception. I've seen more racism on this forum than any Pakistani forum, I'll tell you that much.



I don't think Pakistan should have a national language. Official can remain as English since it is the language of international communication, aside from that every province should speak their own language, they're free to use Urdu as a lingua franca, like how India does with Hindi, but Urdu shouldn't be compulsory. At best it should be limited to Karachi, or areas in Sindh where it is spoken as a mother-tongue.

An ethnic group doesn't exist solely to mock another ethnic group. It's just in general that most of the Poonjabis I've seen have a negative view of Pashtuns in their country.

[HazarAfghanistan]

Abbreviation?


This is a job for the Pashtuns to do. Don't you think? .. Pashtuns are cohesive as a unit just as much as the other ethnics are



Still looking into this, CPEC is a very recent one and not set in stone yet, this is why there is demos. Pashtun politicians need to stand firm.



Again this is on the heads of Pashtuns themselves. From what I'm aware of there isn't any core subjects that teach Punjabi, patwari etc either, the national language is compulsory, there is a certain curriculum that the school system uses its not tailor made for each province.. It's not illegal to teach Pashto in literacy either - truth is it's never been a 'shawaq' of Pashtuns to take written Pashto seriously, everything was done orally. The first book by Byazid Roshan was not long ago at all.



But a lot those that live in Pakistan are also patriotic 'Pakistani Pashtuns' big time that have elaborate justifications for standing under the flag. It's not like they won't be able to express any views for their loyalty. People are painting a big picture of Pashtun persecution by the racist state, but when those allegations are closely dissected all you're left with is the usual political differences that you see all over the world in rival party's. See for people to want to sway these proud pakis away from calling themselves Pakistani it is something major, life changing to be a separatist people. something major needs to be demonstrated not just those points you mentioned, it's bad but not enough for a Pakistani Pashtun to landlock himself in pashtunistan or join Afghanistan because they most probably won't coexist, there own afghans returning to Afghanistan from being refugees are seen with hostility so what about anyone else. What is the other option for pashtuns in Pakistan once they disassociate themselves from the state? Is there even one..?

I dont see Pashtuns breaking from Pakistan, but Baluchistan will very likely become its own country in the future....

[Porus]

An ethnic group doesn't exist solely to mock another ethnic group. It's just in general that most of the Poonjabis I've seen have a negative view of Pashtuns in their country.

Afghan nationals* and even hate for Afghans is more common in KPK and Balochistan.

[Shapur]

Abbreviation?

The regulation was found to be inadequate to contain Pashtun opposition to British and government rule. So new acts have been added to it from time to time. The regulation took their present form primarily through the Frontier Crimes Regulation of 1901. In 1947, the then Dominion of Pakistan added the clause that residents can be arrested without specifying the crime.

Frontier Crimes Regulations - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This is a job for the Pashtuns to do. Don't you think? .. Pashtuns are cohesive as a unit just as much as the other ethnics are

That's what I am advocating, Pashtuns need to work on both sides for their rights in their respective countries.

Still looking into this, CPEC is a very recent one and not set in stone yet, this is why there is demos. Pashtun politicians need to stand firm.

Agree that Pashtun politicians need to properly represent the people in parliament and fight for their rights. Although we can't always rely on corrupt politicians who only worry about filling their own pockets to do the right thing. Pashtuns need social awareness so they understand what their rights are according to the constitution.

Again this is on the heads of Pashtuns themselves. From what I'm aware of there isn't any core subjects that teach Punjabi, patwari etc either, the national language is compulsory, there is a certain curriculum that the school system uses its not tailor made for each province.. It's not illegal to teach Pashto in literacy either - truth is it's never been a 'shawaq' of Pashtuns to take written Pashto seriously, everything was done orally. The first book by Byazid Roshan was not long ago at all.

Who cares if Punjabis or other ethnic groups don't care about their language. That doesn't give Pashtuns the excuse to imitate the bad qualities of others. We should only copy good things from others.
I am not saying Pashtuns shouldn't learn other languages for whatever reason. What I am saying is to put your language first. Pashto is spoken by almost 50 million people, its not some minor language which can be ignored.
In Afghanistan there are Farsi and Pashto medium schools depending on what ethnic group lives in that area, why can't the same be done in Pakistan?

Regarding the interest of Pashtuns in their own language. We always hear "mong yu de khayber zalmi, pukhto zamonga shan dai". What are these empty slogans for? If you look at history, it is always a few individuals who bring about a change. The majority of the people are sheeps in most cases and they will follow the trends. We just need to provide people with the facilities and they will join in.

But a lot those that live in Pakistan are also patriotic 'Pakistani Pashtuns' big time that have elaborate justifications for standing under the flag. It's not like they won't be able to express any views for their loyalty. People are painting a big picture of Pashtun persecution by the racist state, but when those allegations are closely dissected all you're left with is the usual political differences that you see all over the world in rival party's. See for people to want to sway these proud pakis away from calling themselves Pakistani it is something major, life changing to be a separatist people. something major needs to be demonstrated not just those points you mentioned, it's bad but not enough for a Pakistani Pashtun to landlock himself in pashtunistan or join Afghanistan because they most probably won't coexist, there own afghans returning to Afghanistan from being refugees are seen with hostility so what about anyone else. What is the other option for pashtuns in Pakistan once they disassociate themselves from the state? Is there even one..?

Pashtuns or their ancestors have been here for thousands of years and during that time our religions and our boundries have changed and they will change again. We just have to keep in mind if present status quo serves the best interests of Pashtuns or not? At the end of the day, people get what they deserve. It is for Pashtuns in Pakistan to decide what they want and which direction they want to go.

Once again, I would say given the current state of Afghanistan and Pashtuns in general. The best way to go about our progress is to work within the framework of both countries to advance our interests. All these talk of seperation, Loy Afghanistan at the moment are futile. I agree that a free Pashtunistan or Loy Afghanistan without free Balochistan is not an option but there are many other landlocked countries who have done well. Being landlocked is not the end of the world.