Hamid Karzai: Hypocrite and Murderer

[BarakzaiAbdali]

Another parting shot at Hamida Karzai Bibi on his way out.

In this discussion I want to focus on a trait that I see in Hamida and her supporters. It is naked and brazen hypocrisy.

To get to the point, one of their major criticisms of the Taliban era was that the Taliban would use aggressive measures and the deprivation of human rights as a means to their ends. Despite admitting that these ends were pacification and stabilization of the countryside, Hamida and his lackey supporters here have little to say when their own trousers are off and the same charge is leveled at them.

Lest one believes the antics of this schizophrenic and mentally retarded installed puppet (i.e. his pertending to be an "independent" Afghan leader by not signing the BSA) we should analyze his words and deeds.

Here is a key part of his exit interview:

http://www.theatlantic.com/internati...karzai/373199/

REPORTER:

The one idea, the pacifism that I have difficulty reconciling is your support for certain characters emerging in Afghanistan—say General Abdul Raziq in Kandahar—[who are] not even close to being pacifists. [Raziq] takes pride in killing Taliban.

HAMIDA BIBI KARZAI:

But he is a police chief.

REPORTER:

He is a police chief, yet he emerged with the support of a pacifist president.

HAMIDA BIBI KARZAI:

Well, he is a police chief. He is appointed by the Ministry of Interior, he is doing his job. It goes back against the first remark that you made—the soldiers giving their blood to defend this country against terrorism—in that he is active, and Kandahar is a lot more peaceful. What do we want: peace, or the continuation of instability and conflict? If he’s done a good job, that I appreciate. What I don’t appreciate is perpetuating conflict in the name of fighting the Taliban—that I don’t see as real. What I see is a conspiracy where both the Taliban as Afghans are dying and our soldiers as Afghans are dying and I want to end that.

For more about the activities of Aburrazziq Achakzai and his confirmed and investigated murdering of innocent Afghans with no affiliations whatsoever with the Taliban, read here:
http://harpers.org/archive/2009/12/t...f-spin-boldak/

Where the evidences of an investigation that link Abdurraziq to the murder of even the young boy accompanying the Noorzai folks he captured is displayed in all its gory detail.

Additionally, an excellent article by Anand Gopal detailing fresh abuses against civilians was posted here earlier today:

http://www.pashtunforums.com/showthread.php?t=44788

Yet let us for a moment focus on Hamida Bibi's key statement:

, and Kandahar is a lot more peaceful. What do we want: peace, or the continuation of instability and conflict?

Interesting bit of a hypocrisy isn't it you son of a bi-tch? And when I say that I mean your father Abdul Ahad Karzai since the biggest insult one can give your mother is knowing that she had to see your donkey face day after day after day and think: "There is my loser good for nothing son who has to live on hand-outs."

So on the one hand, you fault the Taliban and the militias for bringing about a brutal peace, but when your own man Abdul Razzaq:

1) Decides to kill innocent members of another tribe, or innocents of one he had a personal badi with
2) Continues to kidnap villager family members and torture and kill them
3) Utilizes non Pashtun ethnics for his brutality against Pashtuns of Kandahar, refer here for this tid bit of proof to back that:

Two wore navy blue uniforms, two full black, with various lapel pins and Afghan flag patches, and they were all Hazaras from Kabul or northern Af-ghanistan. While the others checked the vehicle, the youngest-looking one approached and asked where I was from. I was wearing local clothes and can sometimes pass for an Afghan, but I knew my accent would give me away. When I told him I was an American journalist, his eyes widened. He con-ferred with the others and then or-dered us out of the car. Nasir and I were searched and told to wait while they summoned their superior. Nasir, who overheard part of their conversa-tion, leaned to me and whispered, “They are Jajo’s people.”

4) Utilizes rape

Well then all is good and well right since its your sick bas-tards doing the "pacification" at the barrel end of a gun?

Its rather obvious you and your kin have been living the high-fly life, eating up properties and lands around the city and acting like mob king pins in emulation of your favorite movies (e.g. your recent deceased cousin Hashmat and his bestiality lion fetish), but save us the bull-sh-it for another day.

Basically, you are no different than any of the people you derided previously since your objectives have simply been power and glory and your belief in your place in history under the guise of being a "pacifist' president.

Instead, you are a two-faced scheming rendition of a technocrat caricature, assuming that your own version of "Karzai shariat" has to be imposed by the likes of Abdurraziq and that this somehow differentiates or makes you better than your prior adversaries.

No no Hamid, history and Afghans will remember you as the man that sold their country and was one of Afghanistan's greatest conmen.

[tripledouble]

he's also a closet Punjabi

[Shah-i-Kot]

he's also a closet Punjabi

Ignoring your sarcasm, Karzai was actually installed in Kabul by the Punjabi establishment and Pakistan military when Pervez was dictator. A Pakistani military chopper flew him into Afghanistan. The Pakistani NATO supply routes propped up the NATO forces that kept Karzai and the whole conflict going on.

[tripledouble]

Ignoring your sarcasm, Karzai was actually installed in Kabul by the Punjabi establishment and Pakistan military. A Pakistani military chopper flew him into Afghanistan. The Pakistani NATO supply routes propped up the NATO forces that kept Karzai and the whole conflict going on.

LOL then why does he always talk crap about pakistan and threaten us?He is closer to India and if anything supports their agenda, so he certainly isn't some shady ISI agent working for the 'Punjabis' -btw when Karzai came to power, Mushy was incharge of the Pak army and he wasn't a Punjabi.....

Mush never got along with Karzai

[jankhan]

LOL then why does he always talk crap about pakistan and threaten us?He is closer to India and if anything supports their agenda, so he certainly isn't some shady ISI agent working for the 'Punjabis' -btw when Karzai came to power, Mushy was incharge of the Pak army and he wasn't a Punjabi.....

Mush never got along with Karzai

pak is not run by one man lol. it is a group of gangsters and their parasites.

[tripledouble]

pak is not run by one man lol. it is a group of gangsters and their parasites.

you can say that about any military establishment, that's what armies and intell agencies do, it's a dirty job

[jankhan]

you can say that about any military establishment, that's what armies and intell agencies do, it's a dirty job

Thanks you call it dirty job but your isi and army call it jihad and highly pure service to the nation. that is munafiqat and this munafiqat is drowning the whole nation.

[DaZahroJaam.]

see you all in this thread next year this day. hala ba poey ye chi d sera so pakhegi.

[Al-Afghani]

Keep in mind that Abdul Raziq's father was murdered by the Taliban. The son is now taking revenge, which is called Badal in Pashtunwali.

Afghanistan is such a miserable country because of outdated Pashtun tribal values.

[DSM0305]

One can resurrect Ahmad shah Baba himself and you guys will still find something to complain about.

Out of all the people in the Afghan government, you chose to complain about the one who have done the most effort to ensure Afghanistan's prosperity.

No wonder Afghanistan will never prosper. We got mindless people who will rather hail suicide bombing Taliban, than acknowledge the effort of a man who kept Afghanistan together.

[Khostai]

Keep in mind that Abdul Raziq's father was murdered by the Taliban. The son is now taking revenge, which is called Badal in Pashtunwali.

Afghanistan is such a miserable country because of outdated Pashtun tribal values.

lol and your farsibans never take revenage????

[BarakzaiAbdali]

One can resurrect Ahmad shah Baba himself and you guys will still find something to complain about.

Out of all the people in the Afghan government, you chose to complain about the one who have done the most effort to ensure Afghanistan's prosperity.

No wonder Afghanistan will never prosper. We got mindless people who will rather hail suicide bombing Taliban, than acknowledge the effort of a man who kept Afghanistan together.

Ahmad Shah Baba and Hamid Karzai are two entirely different figures with two entirely different trajectories and two entirely different intellectual capacities and two entirely different levels of honesty and worth.

Ahmad Shah Baba:
1.Word to Deed ratio: 1:1
2. Understood war because he led it from the front and did not direct it from some safe haven
3. Was a Muslim through and through and like Mir Wais Neka who bristled at the presence of Gurgin (who he suspected of being a crypto Christian) he did not compromise this most important of values and instead made sure to bend his other sets of values towards that most important of compasses
4. Was astute enough to leave local tribal leaders in charge of their destiny (which is why in Bannu they still call him Abdali Baba) and why other tribal leaders remembered him fondley and ridiculed his grandson who reversed this trend in favor of nepotism

Hamid Karzai:
1. Nepotist ---> Has family has benefited immensely off this war and was so greedy so as to chase money, power, and opulence to their own demise (Hashmat Karzai e.g)
2. Arm chair leader who was being schooled in the art of subversion and installation even before 2001 and who was a gopher for the Mojadedi crew in the 80s and donned a zoot suit and creamed up his soft hands while his countrymen bled for their nation
3. Takes directives from outsiders and pretends not to (this is why to date not a single one of his faux emotional outburts about civilian deaths has ever resulted in justice for Afghans)
4. Extraordinarily hypocritical as we see above in his backing of a well known murderer
5. Abysmal word to deed ratio... as proven by his inability to live up to his supposed dictating to NATO what the parameters of an Afghan War looks like.

Regarding the Taliban and suicide bombing, this tactic is one that renowned sociologists have proven correlates to assymetric warfare. Robert Pape PhD has the largest suicide bombing data base to date in the world with a universal data set. He is the doyen and the leading academician on this issue:

http://political-science.uchicago.edu/people/faculty/pape.shtml

This is the only scientific study done to explain the correlations and potential causes of this tactic.

Pape says:

What about Afghanistan, this is nearly the opposite story... In Afghanistan before 2001, there were again, when we toppled the Taliban, there were ZERO suicide attacks in that country in its whole history. They start in Fall 2001. For the first few years there are tiny amount of suicide attacks. And then in 2006: UP. Suddenly there is a spike and it stays high.

Why? Why 2006?

Well, first the targets, who is being struck? The green bars are US and NATO troops... who are sustaining the lion's share of suicide attacks. Why are suicide attacks so suddenly occurring in 2006?

Well, who is doing them? We can identify and corroborate the identify and corroborate the identities of 93 of the suicide bombers. 90% are Afghan nationals. A few percent are from the border regions. Only 5% are from outside the region of conflict. This is not some global holy war swirling around the world. This is local opposition to US and Western military presence.

But once again, why 2006? It has to do with ground forces but its not that simple. Here is the curve of us putting ground forces in the country. And first thing you will notice in 2010 (This is the Obama Surge) is that we have been surging 20,000 troops each of the last 4 years. Obama's surge was just the last round of this.

Why 2006? As that is actually a steady slope. The Key thing you need to know is that in those early years we only had a few thousand troops in the country and they were occupying Kabul... Not spread around the country. Basically defending Karzai. Until October 2003 when the UN gave us a mandate to spread around the rest of the country. And then, like a good military staff, ISAF developed a plan. And this is ISAF's actual plan (the map is ISAFs) for spreading our forces around the rest of the country.

First we went north, our friends the northern alliance, then West more friends. And then starting 2006, the south and east. Thats when the suicide attacks explode against our troops in the south. Those suicide attackers are NOT just Afghan nationals, they are PASHTUNS from the south and the East.

And by the way, 6 months later we an explosion of suicide terrorism in Pakistan (in its western regions), which are also Pashtun. Because while we are directly occupying the Pashtun homeland in Afghanistan, at the same time we put pressure on Musharraf to take 100,000 Pakistani Army troops, move them from the Eastern part of the country to the Western part of the country to essentially indirectly occupy the other half of the Pashtun homeland. Over 75% of those hundreds of suicide attacks in Pakistan have been against the Pakistani Army in Western Pakistan. Part of our indirect occupation of that part of the Pashtun homeland.

So even with this abhorrent tactic, Karzai is responsible for by being the sponsor, face, and aggressor on behalf of Kharijaan on Afghan land to enrich himself and his now deceased mentally retarded King Pin Brother, Ahmad Wali.

I am sorry, but you have not an evidence based leg to stand on and are resorting to emotional jargon and non fact based assessments. Unless you have some data, logic, or truth to show me please do not inject commentary that is generally baseless and purely based on your wants and needs and not the data. Additionally, your historical comparison is far from accurate since Ahmad Shah Baba did not do as Raziq did and gouge out people's eyes and rape their women. In Herat Shah Rukh rebelled against him three times and he still forgave him three times.

The Pape data and quote are shown here in this presentation to the New America Foundation and Military officials from24 minutes to minute 27:44. The data on Iraq also concords to this phenomena:

Cutting the Fuse - Robert Pape and Gov. Thomas Kean - YouTube

[BarakzaiAbdali]

Keep in mind that Abdul Raziq's father was murdered by the Taliban. The son is now taking revenge, which is called Badal in Pashtunwali.

Afghanistan is such a miserable country because of outdated Pashtun tribal values.

You are foolishly only quoting half the history. A bosom buddy of the prior Kabul government int he 1980s was Esmat Muslim... an Achakzai drug runner and warlord. Raziq's father and uncle helped Muslim murder many people who had no hand or association with the rebellion against the central government. Muslim would murder land owners and seize their land under the guise of redistribution, but interestingly enough distributed it to himself. He was such a vice ridden fellow and so obnoxious that even Najibullah had to distance himself from that piece of trash. Raziq's father and his uncle, like their toady nephew/son were responsible for atrocities that gave rise to the militias that eventually dealt with Esmat's own personal lashkgaar.

Therefore, they are literally reinstalling the most brutal and repugnant people to ever grace the map of Afghanistan and who were providing the impetus for the rise of the proto-Taliban like militias in the initial.

Some will, as Hamida Karzai Bibi has above, pipe in and shed crocadile tears and claim that a sort of peace has descended on Kandahar thanks to the likes of Jajo and Raziq. They are foolishly doing the same thing he is and justifying the thugs that they personally like after years of crying about their adversaries using even lighter touch tactics than these.

I remind them of the now famous quote from the Roman historian Tacitus in his Agricola regarding this logic that the Roman imperialists used when committing massacres and atrocities against the native tribes of Britons centuries ago:

Ubi solitudinem faciunt pacem appellant.

Which translates to:

They created a desolation and call it peace!

[DSM0305]

Last time I checked, under Ahmad shah Baba there weren't any 17 trillion dollars GDP country who were attacked by cavemen. Not to mention 20+ trillion(not even counting USA) dollars GDP NATO alliance. Nor was his neighbors 1 trillion dollar and 700 billion nations. Did I forget to mention, there weren't any globalization either.

You may wonder why I mention this. To put it simple, the political situation is quite different. I mention the 'revival' of Ahmad shah Baba to show the illogical mentality people like you have. People like you, don't take the political situation into account and just spit nothing but nonsense.

It is easy to start columns and start pointing fingers
- Taliban are responsible for the majority of the civilian casualties
- Taliban are responsible for cutting ear and noses for something that cant even be considered crime
- Taliban are responsible for more than 3000 thousands civilian Hazara deaths, including women and children.
- Taliban are responsible for the underdevelopment in Pashtun dominated areas
- Taliban have partnership with druglords, which is where their major income comes from

This is just to mention a few things.

And I don't see how your link justifies suicide bombs.

And just to be clear. It wasn't a historical comparison I did, but rather an analogy to demonstrate how unreasonable you're. I don't know how you got a ''historical comparison'' out of it, since it was written quite straightforward.

Other countries are planning Mars landings, while Afghanistan can't even make its own toilet paper. And it will be kept that way, if cavemen get their hands inside Afghanistan.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

Last time I checked, under Ahmad shah Baba there weren't any 17 trillion dollars GDP country who were attacked by cavemen. Not to mention 20+ trillion(not even counting USA) dollars GDP NATO alliance. Nor was his neighbors 1 trillion dollar and 700 billion nations. Did I forget to mention, there weren't any globalization either.

That in no way excuses watan faroshee and selling off autonomy which is priceless. These same excuses historically are what lured Daud Khan and others to try the ludicrous approach of balancing acts with super powers to devastating effects. Their notion was that they could take trillion dollar nations and use them like force vectors to milk them for funds and commodities while playing dangerous games of military chicken. Additionally, these trillion dollar partners have not actually in way balanced each other but have all still pursued their own interests on Afghan soil while riding rough shod over the Afghan people and their dignity. So irrespective of globalization or whatever justification people use these days to enrich their families and justify their familial involvement in selling off their nation, all their logic boils down to them having a stake in it somehow applying pseudo logic to break with their traditions, religion, and freedom.

You may wonder why I mention this. To put it simple, the political situation is quite different. I mention the 'revival' of Ahmad shah Baba to show the illogical mentality people like you have. People like you, don't take the political situation into account and just spit nothing but nonsense.

It is easy to start columns and start pointing fingers
- Taliban are responsible for the majority of the civilian casualties

Caveat: You ignore assymetric warfare and as Pape makes clear, civilian deaths also rise commensurate with the presence of NATO and ISAF... who your kith and kin invited in, not theirs. Blaming a rag tag guerrilla force with Korean era weaponry who have to rely on self-death tactics is like blaming the Kindergartner going up against the world heavy weight boxing champion for using a kick to the balls. Karzai fomented and created the environment and then he cries about it (including the night raids).

- Taliban are responsible for cutting ear and noses for something that cant even be considered crime

Really and the rapes and worse done by Jajo and Co is like giving flowers out huh? Not to mention the fact that a man who used to ride tanks over Pashtun villagers not involved in any militancy and who used to, according to a multitude of human rights groups, allow his militia to rape northern Pashtun women is now a VP. Please do not lecture on crime and not crime until you get your standards straight.

- Taliban are responsible for more than 3000 thousands civilian Hazara deaths, including women and children.

You are ignoring the prior history and the very acts of Hezb-e- Wahdat leading to these action and reaction episodes. Quit acting like a NATO propaganda machine assuming you are talking to people who do not know history prior to 1992.

- Taliban are responsible for the underdevelopment in Pashtun dominated areas

No, put simply, Taliban is a response to the inept leadership moves of a number of supposedly enlightened Afghan governments who thought they knew their people and their traditions and though they were smarter than they really were. They bought devastating war after war onto their people and the Taliban are the manifestation of what results.

- Taliban have partnership with druglords, which is where their major income comes from

And Ahmad Wali was the King of drug lords

This is just to mention a few things.

And I don't see how your link justifies suicide bombs.

It explains their pathology and causes linking them as clear as day and as dark as night to the action reaction paradigm of assymetric warfare hoisted on the Pashtun peoples by the outside world and the likes of their inept leaders like Hamida Karzai Bibi. He was the very leader that justified the ISAF moves that Pape discussed and the very leader that cried foul when ISAF did what military forces are meant to do, and then shed more crocadile tears when the villagers affected said that this government did not get them the justice they deserved.

The suicide bombings do not need any justification since they are the result of a massively assymetric war where men with Korean era weaponry are fighting the most sophisticated forces to ever exist. They are the end result of this. In the 1980s when they had stinger missiles and ways to balance their super power opponent they did not turn to these measures. Pape definitively proved the point and the correlation very well. If you choose to ignore the fact that Hamida and his collaborators are the ones introducing the impetus for these acts, then you my friend are blinder than the blind.

And just to be clear. It wasn't a historical comparison I did, but rather an analogy to demonstrate how unreasonable you're. I don't know how you got a ''historical comparison'' out of it, since it was written quite straightforward.

Other countries are planning Mars landings, while Afghanistan can't even make its own toilet paper. And it will be kept that way, if cavemen get their hands inside Afghanistan.

There are cavemen and then there are retards. Even Cavemen spawned the rise of humanity by building things that were all their own. What do we call Karzai who cannot build anything viable and whose governmental gains are merely paper gains? Is there a term for less than caveman? Perhaps amoeba or cockroach??

Here is a an example of who even in a decade in a half he basically turned Afghanistan's economy into a parasitic economy dependent on the very powers that break down Afghan doors and decide where night raids go and do not go against his "orders" emphasis on the quotes unquotes:

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/21/opinion/afghanistans-economic-challenges.html?_r=0

The numbers are staggering. According to the World Bank, an estimated 97 percent of Afghanistan’s roughly $15.7 billion gross domestic product comes from international military and development aid and spending in the country by foreign troops.

And these Karzai cockroach personal actions that contribute to this being a sustained problem?

The government has been unable to generate enough revenue to cover more than a fraction of its budget. Billions of dollars have been transferred to Dubai and elsewhere as Afghans with huge caches of cash bet against their country’s future and sabotage its ability to grow.

So in the battle between cavemen and cockroaches all we can say is that the cockroaches (Karzai and Company) have only proven their ability to merely parasitze, subsist, and survive (the last two being time honored cockroach traits).