Do you want a united Pashtunistan, Pukhtunistan, Loy Afghanistan?

[Da Bannu Mazdigar]

So you're saying that Khazakhstan, Uzbekistan, Tajikstan, Kyrygyzstan should be part of Russia again to get access to warm waters too?

Not really,Afghanistan case is different from the countries mentioned above.They can get access to sea through russia way too easily and they also have hell alot of natural resources and already under extractions from decades.

Non of the CAR countries has any sort of problem with Russia while incase of Afghanistan,Their relations with Pakistan are not Good while iran doesnt give access to sea without charging many time more than the UN convention of giving duty free access to land locked countries.


If Afghanistan does has a plan of expansion,than the top priority should be either the sistan of Iran or Balochistan or Pakistan,The merger of KPK,FATA won't provide any sort of benifit to Afghanistan apart from a 50% illeterate Population with no resources at all.

Access to sea has its own strategic importance

[DSM0305]

Access to sea is useless unless you want world domination. Pakistan, Iran had it and they use is very limited. Why do you think China is interested in Pakistan's sea access and Pakistan giving it out so easily, simply because China want to expand it reach, while Pakistan have no use for it otherwise. Why do you think Russia went to so much trouble to get it hand on Crimea. Warm sea access is only useful for superpowers and for low or mediocre powers it is completely useless/limited.
One have to pay very small percentage of money to get access for other countries sea, so it isn't exactly effect their economy.

[MostafaM]

Access to sea is useless unless you want world domination. Pakistan, Iran had it and they use is very limited. Why do you think China is interested in Pakistan's sea access and Pakistan giving it out so easily, simply because China want to expand it reach, while Pakistan have no use for it otherwise. Why do you think Russia went to so much trouble to get it hand on Crimea. Warm sea access is only useful for superpowers and for low or mediocre powers it is completely useless/limited.
One have to pay very small percentage of money to get access for other countries sea, so it isn't exactly effect their economy.

You missed the point here.

If a landlocked country is in a territorial dispute with a neighbour who can and will always use the tool of trade blockade against you then access to a sea port is very important.

Untill you want to rely on others regarding your own strategic interests, you will never be able to secure your own national interests and bring peace and stability for your people.

[DSM0305]

You missed the point here.

If a landlocked country is in a territorial dispute with a neighbour who can and will always use the tool of trade blockade against you then access to a sea port is very important.

Untill you want to rely on others regarding your own strategic interests, you will never be able to secure your own national interests and bring peace and stability for your people.

It depends on what kind of dispute you're in. As an example Afghanistan have never recognized Durand line, yet our biggest trading partner is still Pakistan. The difference is that Pashtuns in Pakistan don't have any interest in joining Afghanistan, which makes the whole situation basically undisputed. So I don't see how access to sea is crucial for survival in Pashtun peoples situation.

[Da Bannu Mazdigar]

Access to sea is useless unless you want world domination. Pakistan, Iran had it and they use is very limited. Why do you think China is interested in Pakistan's sea access and Pakistan giving it out so easily, simply because China want to expand it reach, while Pakistan have no use for it otherwise. Why do you think Russia went to so much trouble to get it hand on Crimea. Warm sea access is only useful for superpowers and for low or mediocre powers it is completely useless/limited.
One have to pay very small percentage of money to get access for other countries sea, so it isn't exactly effect their economy.

Access to sea is extremely Important.Afghanistan is not some xyz Country.Afghanistan Population Growth rate is one of the highest in the world.Today Afghanistan Population is 30Million,After 2 decades it might even double.And by 2050 Atleast 100Million.

A Country with 100Million Population can become atleast among the top 20 GDP's.And for this you need access to sea.

Iran is a extremely racist country while Pakistan due to its dirty politics will never let Afghanistan a land case without any Internal Interest in Afghanistan.

A Nationalist from Afghanistan will always want to have Balochistan with Greater Amount of resources and access to sea than having a 40Million population addition with half of them illiterate from KPK and FATA


Whether you agree or not But a Afghanistan with access to sea would had been different from what it is.

[DSM0305]

Access to sea is extremely Important.Afghanistan is not some xyz Country.Afghanistan Population Growth rate is one of the highest in the world.Today Afghanistan Population is 30Million,After 2 decades it might even double.And by 2050 Atleast 100Million.

A Country with 100Million Population can become atleast among the top 20 GDP's.And for this you need access to sea.

Iran is a extremely racist country while Pakistan due to its dirty politics will never let Afghanistan a land case without any Internal Interest in Afghanistan.

A Nationalist from Afghanistan will always want to have Balochistan with Greater Amount of resources and access to sea than having a 40Million population addition with half of them illiterate from KPK and FATA


Whether you agree or not But a Afghanistan with access to sea would had been different from what it is.

Population has nothing to do with access to sea nor does the economy.

Access to the sea is more or less useless, unless you're a super as I have mention before.

I want to be more precise so I ask you a question, what benefits does access to sea have. Give me some crucial benefits that is required for a country, that access to sea gives.

The problem in this forum is that we overestimate the importance of the sea. I mean it is important no doubt about it, but only for countries like USA, China, Russia etc. Basically extremely strong countries that have world scale influence. Mediocre countries don't have any crucial benefits from it.

[Da Bannu Mazdigar]

Population has nothing to do with access to sea nor does the economy.

Access to the sea is more or less useless, unless you're a super as I have mention before.

I want to be more precise so I ask you a question, what benefits does access to sea have. Give me some crucial benefits that is required for a country, that access to sea gives.

The problem in this forum is that we overestimate the importance of the sea. I mean it is important no doubt about it, but only for countries like USA, China, Russia etc. Basically extremely strong countries that have world scale influence. Mediocre countries don't have any crucial benefits from it.

Population does mean more time to reach your Economy at a saturation state.

Take example of USA and Japan.

Japan in 90's had a GDP of almost 4 Trillion dollars While USA was hardly 1trillion More than Japan.But due to 3Times or even more population than Japan,USA today has a GDP of more than 15Trillion dollars and still growing while Because of limited Population,Japan had reached saturation state a decade earlier and is still struck at 5.5Trillion dollars GDP.They cannot absorb More.

China and India growth rate will reach Saturation state by either 2080 or 2090 or may never reach saturation state in this century.

Pakistan and Indonesia will follow the same fate and even Bangladesh.

Whether you agree or not But in long term access to sea is even more important than Oil reserves.

Incase of Afghanistan the importance of Sea or Balochistan

*No dependence on Pakistan of which you claim half of country as disputed territory,
*No Blackmailing from Pakistan over the supply line or even iran
*Investment into industries and easy export route
*Incase of war,No one can stop your energy supply line

I can mention even more with respect to Afghanistan.

If Afghanistan ever had access to sea and no dependence on Pakistan for supply line,Afghanistan would have never allowed ISI to go internal into Afghanistan

[DSM0305]

Population does mean more time to reach your Economy at a saturation state.

Take example of USA and Japan.

Japan in 90's had a GDP of almost 4 Trillion dollars While USA was hardly 1trillion More than Japan.But due to 3Times or even more population than Japan,USA today has a GDP of more than 15Trillion dollars and still growing while Because of limited Population,Japan had reached saturation state a decade earlier and is still struck at 5.5Trillion dollars GDP.They cannot absorb More.

China and India growth rate will reach Saturation state by either 2080 or 2090 or may never reach saturation state in this century.

Pakistan and Indonesia will follow the same fate and even Bangladesh.

Whether you agree or not But in long term access to sea is even more important than Oil reserves.

Incase of Afghanistan the importance of Sea or Balochistan

*No dependence on Pakistan of which you claim half of country as disputed territory,
*No Blackmailing from Pakistan over the supply line or even iran
*Investment into industries and easy export route
*Incase of war,No one can stop your energy supply line

I can mention even more with respect to Afghanistan.

If Afghanistan ever had access to sea and no dependence on Pakistan for supply line,Afghanistan would have never allowed ISI to go internal into Afghanistan

No offense but are you by any chance drunk? First of all as I said earlier and repeat myself again. Sea access doesn't effect your population. Second of all population has very little to do with economy, actually it is far easier to fed less people.

ISI's meddling in Afghanistan affair has nothing to do with sea access. ISI would have interfered in Afghanistan whether Afghanistan had or hadn't sea access.
Sanctions damage a countries economy regardless of sea access. Take Iran as an example, they had and have sea access, yet when the west sanctioned Iran, its economy fall faster than titanic. So sea access has nothing to with energy supplies, blackmailing or anything related. They can be done regardless. And no one invest in a country just because of sea access, investment has actually literally nothing to do with sea access, so I honestly don't see where you got this idea from.
Basically sea access have zero importance. And I to be honest am very surprised why people make so big of a deal out of it.

[Da Bannu Mazdigar]

No offense but are you by any chance drunk? First of all as I said earlier and repeat myself again. Sea access doesn't effect your population. Second of all population has very little to do with economy, actually it is far easier to fed less people.

ISI's meddling in Afghanistan affair has nothing to do with sea access. ISI would have interfered in Afghanistan whether Afghanistan had or hadn't sea access.
Sanctions damage a countries economy regardless of sea access. Take Iran as an example, they had and have sea access, yet when the west sanctioned Iran, its economy fall faster than titanic. So sea access has nothing to with energy supplies, blackmailing or anything related. They can be done regardless. And no one invest in a country just because of sea access, investment has actually literally nothing to do with sea access, so I honestly don't see where you got this idea from.
Basically sea access have zero importance. And I to be honest am very surprised why people make so big of a deal out of it.

When i said sea access affect our Population?What i meant is Bigger Population can give you a bigger room for long term sustainable Growth rate.

Take Example of Iran and the combination of Sancitons and landlocked.With all this they export oil worth 50Billion dollars each year through their own ports.Which has given them room to have reserves of more than 100Billion dollars,GDP is falling from the past few years.But 5years back they were growing with 7% annually.

I stand on my point.Sea access is more important than Even oil reserves in long run.

[DSM0305]

When i said sea access affect our Population?What i meant is Bigger Population can give you a bigger room for long term sustainable Growth rate.

Take Example of Iran and the combination of Sancitons and landlocked.With all this they export oil worth 50Billion dollars each year through their own ports.Which has given them room to have reserves of more than 100Billion dollars,GDP is falling from the past few years.But 5years back they were growing with 7% annually.

I stand on my point.Sea access is more important than Even oil reserves in long run.

I don't get you, you make literally no sense. How can access to sea even remotely effect the population... Even more importantly how do you equal large population with economic growth... there is literally zero logic behind that.
Sea has no significant importance regarding economy nor population. And I don't see how sea access could have changed the situation in Afghanistan or other countries. Economic growth and stable government is all about how one play his cards, and sea access is simply one unimportant card.

[Da Bannu Mazdigar]

I don't get you, you make literally no sense. How can access to sea even remotely effect the population... Even more importantly how do you equal large population with economic growth... there is literally zero logic behind that.
Sea has no significant importance regarding economy nor population. And I don't see how sea access could have changed the situation in Afghanistan or other countries. Economic growth and stable government is all about how one play his cards, and sea access is simply one unimportant card.

This is probably the third time i am repeating that i never meant that Sea can affect your Population.What i meant is Bigger Population will indeed help you in long run to sustain the growth rate.Since your country will be able to absorb the growth.The european countries growth rate is extremely slow because they had already reached a saturation state and the population cannot absorb Higher growth rates

Narrow minded i must say you r.Afghanistan could not backstab Pakistan only because that Afghanistan supply line was through Pakistan otherwise even najeeb knew that ISI was behind the creation of mujahideen in Afghanistan against ussr.

[DSM0305]

This is probably the third time i am repeating that i never meant that Sea can affect your Population.What i meant is Bigger Population will indeed help you in long run to sustain the growth rate.Since your country will be able to absorb the growth.The european countries growth rate is extremely slow because they had already reached a saturation state and the population cannot absorb Higher growth rates

Narrow minded i must say you r.Afghanistan could not backstab Pakistan only because that Afghanistan supply line was through Pakistan otherwise even najeeb knew that ISI was behind the creation of mujahideen in Afghanistan against ussr.

What in the gods name are you talking about. Your sentences doesn't make any sense...
- Population doesn't effect the economic growth rate
- Growth rate doesn't effect population
- A state/country can sustain increased population as long they have money to buy food
- The reason Europe have low population rate is because they use condoms
- The reason they use condom is because Europeans aren't fan of parenthood and nor do they have time for that

When a country is in a civil war, they cannot attack other countries, even if other countries are the direct cause of it. Israel as an example fired a few rockets into Syria, yet Syria couldn't retaliate because of civil war.

Afghanistan's supply line in that time was directly from soviet union. Pakistan couldn't cut of Afghanistan even if it wanted. The reason Afghanistan couldn't retaliate was simply because of the devastating civil war. So your statements are baseless.

[waterbear_waterbear]

So the only reason you want to annex Balochistan is because it's next to the sea?

Give me a break.

Balochistan belongs to the Baloch people and it's up to them whether they prefer independence, Pakistan, Loy Afghanistan etc. Similarly, NW Pakistan belongs to the people who live there, and they have the right to self-determinism.

Get out of your computer chairs and start being realistic.

Exactly!

we should go outside and meet baloch people and see what they're interested in,
but many of us also live in the west, there are barely any balochis that emigrated man, seriously...

[کیش]

No offense but are you by any chance drunk? First of all as I said earlier and repeat myself again. Sea access doesn't effect your population. Second of all population has very little to do with economy, actually it is far easier to fed less people.

ISI's meddling in Afghanistan affair has nothing to do with sea access. ISI would have interfered in Afghanistan whether Afghanistan had or hadn't sea access.
Sanctions damage a countries economy regardless of sea access. Take Iran as an example, they had and have sea access, yet when the west sanctioned Iran, its economy fall faster than titanic. So sea access has nothing to with energy supplies, blackmailing or anything related. They can be done regardless. And no one invest in a country just because of sea access, investment has actually literally nothing to do with sea access, so I honestly don't see where you got this idea from.
Basically sea access have zero importance. And I to be honest am very surprised why people make so big of a deal out of it.

do you know anything about Economics? access to the sea means you have shipping ports. when you have shipping ports you could export/import goods to and from any country(ies) in the world.

access to the sea also means the chance to develop a navy. When hasn't having a navy hurt a country in-development?

[Kushan Prince]

What in the gods name are you talking about. Your sentences doesn't make any sense...
- Population doesn't effect the economic growth rate
- Growth rate doesn't effect population
- A state/country can sustain increased population as long they have money to buy food
- The reason Europe have low population rate is because they use condoms
- The reason they use condom is because Europeans aren't fan of parenthood and nor do they have time for that

When a country is in a civil war, they cannot attack other countries, even if other countries are the direct cause of it. Israel as an example fired a few rockets into Syria, yet Syria couldn't retaliate because of civil war.

Afghanistan's supply line in that time was directly from soviet union. Pakistan couldn't cut of Afghanistan even if it wanted. The reason Afghanistan couldn't retaliate was simply because of the devastating civil war. So your statements are baseless.

Give it a break, you know he's right. Sea access means everything which is why the soviets invaded Afghanistan to get through pakistan for warm water.