Wahabis and Sharia

[randolph85]

In secular developed countries we have democracy, rule of law , justice, progress, prosperity and all this is because of politics which is a reality not a drama.

Yes Islam or any other religion if applied to politics is a real drama because religion is for the life after death not for this life and in this life only for morality. Read Qur'an. What is mentioned more? Akhirat not this world.

prosperity is based on economic factors, not the religious orientation of the government or society. prosperity being relative and assuming we are talking about a society whose lives and property are protected. look at democratic afg vs a uae dictatorship, communist china vs democratic liberia. in fact, liberia is a great example of what economic disparity has on the effect of prosperity considering the nation was modeled on the american system and founded by americans.

if islam was not meant to administer over the lives of muslims then there would be no divine legislation in the quran. if someone steals, who cuts off their limbs? street mobs? who's courts determines the guilt of adulterers? did the prophet preside over a secular state when in power?

[Badlun]

prosperity is based on economic factors, not the religious orientation of the government or society. prosperity being relative and assuming we are talking about a society whose lives and property are protected. look at democratic afg vs a uae dictatorship, communist china vs democratic liberia. in fact, liberia is a great example of what economic disparity has on the effect of prosperity considering the nation was modeled on the american system and founded by americans.

if islam was not meant to administer over the lives of muslims then there would be no divine legislation in the quran. if someone steals, who cuts off their limbs? street mobs? who's courts determines the guilt of adulterers? did the prophet preside over a secular state when in power?

I agree that prosperity is based on economic factors not the religious orientation. Religion is for grave and afterwards not for wealth or prosperity.
UAE has one thing that is prosperity for the ruling elite and few selected ones and those who invest but there are no human rights, democracy, freedom of expression, fundamental rights, human rights.

In Liberia there is a kind of democracy but no development. This is why I cited the example of developed world not developing world. But where democracy is nascent , there is more probability of prosperity one day than dictatorships.

China like UAE has some good aspects as free market economy but no democracy and human rights. Still it is better than monarchies and dictatorships.

Injunctions in Quran about robbery, adultery are moral in nature not legal as Quran is not a penal or criminal code. Just cutting of limbs is not enough for a legal system. It requires many minor and major legal acts and codes.

Many also think that such injunctions are figurative and preventive otherwise if we start cutting hands for few dollars then the whole Muslim population will turn into handicaps. This is the reason all these Quranic punishments are nowhere implemented as a system neither in past nor in present.

[randolph85]

I agree that prosperity is based on economic factors not the religious orientation. Religion is for grave and afterwards not for wealth or prosperity.
UAE has one thing that is prosperity for the ruling elite and few selected ones and those who invest but there are no human rights, democracy, freedom of expression, fundamental rights, human rights.

In Liberia there is a kind of democracy but no development. This is why I cited the example of developed world not developing world. But where democracy is nascent , there is more probability of prosperity one day than dictatorships.

China like UAE has some good aspects as free market economy but no democracy and human rights. Still it is better than monarchies and dictatorships.

Injunctions in Quran about robbery, adultery are moral in nature not legal as Quran is not a penal or criminal code. Just cutting of limbs is not enough for a legal system. It requires many minor and major legal acts and codes.

Many also think that such injunctions are figurative and preventive otherwise if we start cutting hands for few dollars then the whole Muslim population will turn into handicaps. This is the reason all these Quranic punishments are nowhere implemented as a system neither in past nor in present.

china and uae are dictatorships btw.

many also think the earth is flat. who cares what "many" think when the proof is in the book? first you are trying to dismiss the law of god as some figurative fairy tale but then trying to justify its real world application by your handicap quip. the taliban ruled afghanistan after they took kabul for 5 years, is the whole of afghanistan handless? you know as well as i do that crime was almost non existent during their rule and today there are not 10s of thousands or 100,000's walking around handless.

the quranic punishments were well implemented in the time of the prophet, one point you didn't address. you are implying that the prophet did not rule by islamic law during his rule or his companions afterwards.

5:38. As to the thief, Male or female, cut off his or her hands: a punishment by way of example, from Allah, for their crime: and Allah is Exalted in power.

5:39. But if the thief repents after his crime, and amends his conduct, Allah turneth to him in forgiveness; for Allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful.


how are those verses not legal in your sick head?

[Badlun]

china and uae are dictatorships btw.

many also think the earth is flat. who cares what "many" think when the proof is in the book? first you are trying to dismiss the law of god as some figurative fairy tale but then trying to justify its real world application by your handicap quip. the taliban ruled afghanistan after they took kabul for 5 years, is the whole of afghanistan handless? you know as well as i do that crime was almost non existent during their rule and today there are not 10s of thousands or 100,000's walking around handless.

the quranic punishments were well implemented in the time of the prophet, one point you didn't address. you are implying that the prophet did not rule by islamic law during his rule or his companions afterwards.

5:38. As to the thief, Male or female, cut off his or her hands: a punishment by way of example, from Allah, for their crime: and Allah is Exalted in power.

5:39. But if the thief repents after his crime, and amends his conduct, Allah turneth to him in forgiveness; for Allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful.


how are those verses not legal in your sick head?

Even Taliban did not implement cutting off hands proves further my point that the so called islamic punishments are not legally implementable but advisory, moral and preemptive in nature. Do you think there were dearth of thieves in Afghanistan in those 5 years.

Security is always good in dictatorial regimes as we see in Saudi, North Korea or even China but the safest place on the surface of the earth is a jail but there are no liberties and basic human rights. Afghanistan was a big prison in Taliban's time. Apart from security we need many other things also.

Muhammad was a prophet of religion but at the same time an Arab ruler and leader. His actions of legal nature were not religious acts. He married 12 wives, accepted a child in his marriage, claimed to split the moon into pieces, claimed to visited all the celestial world in seconds, married wife of an adopted son, liked one kind of clothes, had sexual power of hundreds of men, fought many wars, enslaved men and women etc etc but all these are not part of religion otherwise we all have to practice these Sunna!

What is religion is the set of beliefs, modes of worship and moral injunctions which are in conformity with international standards. If prophet said that one should not tell lie, we must practice but if he was quoted saying than women are less intelligent then this is not to be accepted as it is against science.

I do not know how many times he ordered to cut off hands of thieves. We need to do a research if really these punishments were ever practiced except by some barbarians as today's Taliban.