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  • Taliban to Meet With Northern Foes

    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...09546514.html?


    Taliban to Meet With Northern Foes




    By YAROSLAV TROFIMOV and NATHAN HODGE

    KABUL—Afghanistan's Taliban have reached out to their historical enemies in the Northern Alliance, opening initial contacts to discuss the country's future once the U.S.-led forces depart and President Hamid Karzai steps down in 2014.
    In the first such meeting between authorized representatives of Taliban leader Mullah Omar and the key leaders of the Northern Alliance, which fought a losing war against the Taliban before the 2001 U.S.-led invasion, more than a dozen senior Afghan politicians are scheduled to travel to France this month.

    The meeting, sponsored by a French think tank, is unlikely to produce immediate results, and might ultimately fail to prevent a breakout of a renewed civil war after 2014. But it would allow the two sides to feel out each other's stance, and possibilities for an eventual compromise, after more than a decade of rejecting the very idea of direct negotiations.
    "Let's see what the Taliban say when we talk to them face to face. It is very important that we know what is the position of the Taliban," said Ahmad Zia Massoud, the brother of Northern Alliance leader Ahmad Shah Massoud, who was assassinated by al Qaeda in 2001. "We seek an understanding between us and the Taliban, to know their views and finally to pave the way to reaching peace."
    Mr. Massoud, who served as Afghanistan's vice president under Mr. Karzai and now heads the National Front alliance of opposition groups, is one of the expected participants. All the parties to the conflict were increasingly exhausted after 11 years of fighting, he said: "The Taliban got tired of this war. And the Afghan government and the international community are also tired of this war."
    More




    The U.S., which has held separate talks with the Taliban this year, is endorsing the process of Afghans talking to Afghans, as are the United Nations and European nations. As part of their negotiations with the U.S., the Taliban this year began to establish a political office staffed with authorized representatives of Mullah Omar in the Gulf emirate Qatar.
    Officials involved in the process say that the contacts between the Taliban and the U.S., which involve negotiations about swapping Taliban detainees at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, for a U.S. Army sergeant held captive by the Taliban, are likely to resume in coming weeks after being suspended by the insurgents in March.
    Though agreeing to talk with the U.S. and Northern Alliance politicians, the Taliban have repeatedly rejected the idea of negotiating with Mr. Karzai, describing him as a powerless stooge of foreign invaders. Afghanistan's presidential elections are scheduled for April 2014, and under the constitution Mr. Karzai isn't allowed to run again.
    Still, at least two of Mr. Karzai's senior advisers are expected to attend the Paris meeting, including his point man on reconciliation, Mohammed Masoom Stanekzai, other invitees said.
    "These are not peace talks, just an exchange of views among Afghans—but it's a very good opportunity for both sides to learn about each other," said Wahid Muzhda, a former Taliban foreign ministry official who has been involved in mediating between the Taliban and Northern Alliance politicians. As part of these contacts, Mr. Muzhda shuttled in recent months between Kabul, Peshawar, Dubai and Qatar.
    While Mr. Karzai has in the past expressed hostility to the Taliban establishing an office in Qatar, and to any talks that bypass him, the Afghan government endorsed the planned meeting in France. "Any dialogue about the future of Afghanistan, any exchange of ideas—we welcome this because it is about peace and stability," said Mr. Karzai's spokesman, Aimal Faizi.
    Similar meetings in France previously brought together Afghan politicians and the so-called Kabul Taliban—senior officials of the former Taliban regime who are no longer involved in the insurgency and don't represent the Taliban high command.
    In the meeting planned for this month, however, the Taliban delegation is expected to be headed by Shahabuddin Dilawar, a senior member of the Taliban political branch that began operating out of Qatar, other invitees and diplomats said. Mr. Muzhda confirmed Mr. Dilawar's planned attendance.
    A former Taliban ambassador to Riyadh and Islamabad who served as deputy head of the Taliban Supreme Court in 2001, Mr. Dilawar is on the United Nations sanctions blacklist, and his travel to Paris would require a special waiver from a U.N. committee. While the waiver hasn't yet been granted, diplomats in Kabul said they expected it would be issued in time for the meeting.
    The U.N., diplomats say, plans another seminar uniting Afghan politicians and authorized representatives of the Taliban high command sometime early next year, probably in the central Asian republic of Turkmenistan.
    Mr. Karzai, like the Taliban's key leaders, is an ethnic Pashtun from the southern city of Kandahar. The Northern Alliance unified the mostly non-Pashtun power brokers and warlords from the country's ethnic Tajik, Uzbek and Hazara minorities that dominate the country's northern and western provinces.
    Some of these power brokers serve in Mr. Karzai's administration—such as the influential governor of the northern Balkh province, Mohammed Atta. Others, such as Mr. Karzai's former challengers in the presidential elections, Abdullah Abdullah and Yunus Qanooni, belong to the opposition. Most of them, to one degree or another, are preparing themselves for the possibility of a civil war after 2014, with allied militias stockpiling weapons and ammunition, diplomats say.
    Mr. Qanooni, the former speaker of Afghanistan's parliament, is also planning to attend the meeting in France. In an interview, he hailed the Taliban's willingness to reach out to their Northern Alliance foes. "It is a positive view that accepts the realities of this country," he said. "The forces that fought the Taliban in the past represent the huge majority of the nation, and therefore no reconciliation will happen without an understanding with them."
    Northern Alliance leaders bitterly criticized Mr. Karzai for beginning his own outreach to the Taliban three years ago, accusing him of selling out to the insurgency and of trying to strike a deal at the expense of the non-Pashtun minorities.
    Even now, not all of the expected participants in the planned encounters in France are optimistic. "The Taliban's views are not civilized views, and until they change their thinking it's difficult to have hopes," said Mohammed Mohaqeq, a former leading Hazara warlord. "But we will not close the dialogue."
    Pakistan, which shelters the Taliban's top leadership and finances the insurgency, has long opposed any negotiations that it doesn't control, jailing the Taliban's second-in-command, Mullah Abdul Ghani Baradar, in 2010 for unauthorized contacts with Kabul.
    These days, however, Pakistan appears to have softened its stance, issuing Taliban officials with passports so they could set up the Qatar mission. In recent weeks, Pakistan agreed to long-standing Kabul requests and freed some Taliban detainees. It also agreed to hold in Kabul a joint conference of Islamic scholars that's expected to condemn the use of suicide bombings.
    Following a visit to Islamabad last week by Afghan Foreign Minister Zalmai Rassoul, the two governments issued a joint statement backing an "Afghan-led and Afghan-owned peace and reconciliation process."
    Diplomats and Afghan officials, however, are unsure whether Pakistan's overtures are sincere. "There will not be peace in Afghanistan without the honest cooperation of Pakistan," Mr. Qanooni said. "We see a change of tactics from Pakistan. We need a change of Pakistan's strategy toward Afghanistan."
    The establishment of a Taliban office in Qatar "will protect from Pakistani influence those Taliban who favor this reconciliation," he added. "This is a chance, not a challenge."
    Corrections & Amplifications
    Yunus Qanooni is the former speaker of the Afghan parliament. An earlier version of this article incorrectly referred to him as the current speaker.
    Write to Yaroslav Trofimov at yaroslav.trofimov@wsj.com and Nathan Hodge at nathan.hodge@wsj.com

  • #2
    propaganda!
    There are people today who think that admitting God’s absolute greatness decreases the value and importance of humans in the creation, as if God and mankind are rivals competing in greatness and power. Meanwhile I feel that whenever our perception of God’s greatness increases, with it we become greater, because we are the creation of a great God.

    Sayyid Qutb

    Comment


    • #3
      So the taleban and the northern alliance leaders are going to sit down .. have a cup of tea.. and discuss issues in Afghanistan..

      HA!

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by JAMALUDEEN View Post
        So the taleban and the northern alliance leaders are going to sit down .. have a cup of tea.. and discuss issues in Afghanistan..

        HA!
        what do you suggest?
        Afghans kill eachother?

        Comment


        • #5
          it goes against unknownprinces previous opinion that the taliban had nothing to worry about from the NA and could easily defeat them. by mentioning that the northerners were arming themselves, i was labeled as out of touch lol
          There are people today who think that admitting God’s absolute greatness decreases the value and importance of humans in the creation, as if God and mankind are rivals competing in greatness and power. Meanwhile I feel that whenever our perception of God’s greatness increases, with it we become greater, because we are the creation of a great God.

          Sayyid Qutb

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by randolph85 View Post
            it goes against unknownprinces previous opinion that the taliban had nothing to worry about from the NA and could easily defeat them. by mentioning that the northerners were arming themselves, i was labeled as out of touch lol
            its not because of them arming themselves.
            you really think they could keep up a fight?

            it is just that Afghans want to make peace through dialogue.
            they are obviously fed up with war.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by ډګروال View Post
              its not because of them arming themselves.
              you really think they could keep up a fight?

              it is just that Afghans want to make peace through dialogue.
              they are obviously fed up with war.
              yes i do think they could keep up a fight, they have been using their power to arm themselves, why else would the taliban be talking to them if the northerners were weak? if the taliban knew they could completely defeat the NA, then there would be no need for talks. on the same note if the taliban were defeated, then the NA wouldn't be talking to them either. all sides realize that they are all there for good, the NA is not going anywhere, neither are the taliban.

              ironically, the only thing they have in common is their distrust for karzai and his government.
              Last edited by randolph85; 12-07-2012, 08:09 PM.
              There are people today who think that admitting God’s absolute greatness decreases the value and importance of humans in the creation, as if God and mankind are rivals competing in greatness and power. Meanwhile I feel that whenever our perception of God’s greatness increases, with it we become greater, because we are the creation of a great God.

              Sayyid Qutb

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by randolph85 View Post
                yes i do think they could keep up a fight, they have been using their power to arm themselves, why else would the taliban be talking to them if the northerners were weak? if the taliban knew they could completely defeat the NA, then there would be no need for talks. on the same note if the taliban were defeated, then the NA wouldn't be talking to them either. all sides realize that they are all there for good, the NA is not going anywhere, neither are the taliban.

                ironically, the only thing they have in common is their distrust for karzai and his government.
                again you are yapping some bias ****.
                Northerners? this is talking about northern alliance and that too to end the conflict. the very reason northern alliance is threatening is because they want to be included in talks as they have been sidelined thus far.

                northern alliance cant keep up a fight,and fighting taliban is not in their interest.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by ډګروال View Post
                  again you are yapping some bias ****.
                  Northerners? this is talking about northern alliance and that too to end the conflict. the very reason northern alliance is threatening is because they want to be included in talks as they have been sidelined thus far.

                  northern alliance cant keep up a fight,and fighting taliban is not in their interest.

                  northerners as in the northern alliance, the national front or whatever they want to call themselves these days, yes. if the NA can't keep up a fight then the question is why are the taliban meeting with them? if the taliban are sure of victory, then they have no incentive to talk to the northern leaders. all this shows is weakness on both sides, the NA knows they can't beat the taliban and the taliban knows they can't fully take afg and beat the NA. like i said before, the only real thing they have in common is their distrust of the karzai regime.
                  There are people today who think that admitting God’s absolute greatness decreases the value and importance of humans in the creation, as if God and mankind are rivals competing in greatness and power. Meanwhile I feel that whenever our perception of God’s greatness increases, with it we become greater, because we are the creation of a great God.

                  Sayyid Qutb

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Sometimes war cannot solve every problem.
                    High achievement always takes place in the framework of high expectation.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Look at this brainwashed slaves, when there were articals about taliban talking whith US, nobody belived that and sayd its propaganda, but now when they talk whith NA all of sudden, taliban want peace and dialog and no more war LOL

                      Why didn't taliban talked to US first? Ins't NA not the same kafir infected bunch of infedels that don't folow the true Islam? The Islam of taliban monkeys, and NA came to power becuase of US, its like talking inderectly to the US actualy.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        It is choice of the Northern Alliance,war or peace,they know a war would mean,that every single of their men will be hunted down and killed.

                        This time if iran supports them (NA),iranian can awaite a war too,taliban are in a different position today than 1998.
                        High achievement always takes place in the framework of high expectation.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by randolph85 View Post
                          northerners as in the northern alliance, the national front or whatever they want to call themselves these days, yes. if the NA can't keep up a fight then the question is why are the taliban meeting with them? if the taliban are sure of victory, then they have no incentive to talk to the northern leaders. all this shows is weakness on both sides, the NA knows they can't beat the taliban and the taliban knows they can't fully take afg and beat the NA. like i said before, the only real thing they have in common is their distrust of the karzai regime.
                          First of all, this is a think tank that has proposed talks between the two to end the ongoing war between the Taliban and the Northern Alliance.

                          If a NATO alliance of 50+ nations have failed in Afghanistan (http://www.armedforcesjournal.com/2012/02/8904030), and lost, then what makes you think that their Northern Alliance supporters can win on their own or with NATO support?... If they have not been winning for the last decade?

                          The 50 nation NATO alliance is the most advanced military alliance the world has ever seen, and they have been defeated in Afghanistan. Are you telling me that the Northern Alliance is stronger force than the NATO alliance?

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            [QUOTE]
                            Originally posted by randolph85 View Post
                            yes i do think they could keep up a fight, they have been using their power to arm themselves, why else would the taliban be talking to them if the northerners were weak?
                            So you think the 'Northerners' can keep up a fight? Care to explain what you mean by 'Northerners?'

                            It is actually a Paris based think tank that has proposed this conference to talk about the solution to the war. It has nothing to do with the Taliban wanting to talk to the 'Northerners' as you term this group.

                            In fact, I could ask why the 'Northerners' want to talk? Arent they going to pick up the fight where the US-NATO-Pak alliance has dropped off? Or are they going to continue oppressing people and dealing in drugs, pimping and prostitution- their Mode of operations?

                            if the taliban knew they could completely defeat the NA, then there would be no need for talks. on the same note if the taliban were defeated, then the NA wouldn't be talking to them either. all sides realize that they are all there for good, the NA is not going anywhere, neither are the taliban.
                            As it is mentioned in the article, it is a Paris based initiative to discuss peace in Afghanistan.

                            What NA are you referring to?

                            It is highly doubtful that after a decade of getting rich and building mansions in Dubai (by supporting the US/NATO/Pak war) that anyone is going to respond to their leaders call to arms.

                            ironically, the only thing they have in common is their distrust for karzai and his government.
                            For completely different reasons. The Karzai government has been supportive of the NA, and made many of their leaders ministers in 'government positions.' It has also supported the US/NATO war which focus predominantly in the Pashtun heartland. The Amarulleh Salehs, Zia Masoods, Fahims, etc, etc have been satisfied in this regard. They in fact want more war, and are only angry with the talks of peace. I can past a long list of quotes from all the aforementioned about how they want the US/NATO war to go on forever..

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              redlamp makes sense although what he says has little sense.

                              Comment

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