To havisultan and Pakistani members co

[afghanis_hehe]

During khilafat movement, it were millions of hindostanis, not lar pashtuns, who tried to enter into afghanistan after ulema called hindostan "dar-ul-harb" due to british occupations. The idea was migration of "all" hindostani muslims to afghanistan. Wow. These pusies have always run from hindus in fear like this. They wept for our help when marahatas were close to capturing of all india.
Thanks God afghan king did'nt open doors to hindostanis muslims, they would have fate like sindhis. And farts could have been echoing throught afghanistan.

hahah man u lie like a real scholar .hindustani muslims haha included u aswell as british india included frontier too. ok and i know pakhtuns migrated to afghanistan from kp , my relatives from my mother side (which is predominantly pashtiun and speaks pashto) was kicked from there . so plzz stop and u urself have exposed urself to be afghhan from afghanistan . so stop saying that u tr pakistani

[haviZsultan]

well u r a dumb person . and i guess a person who respect a women then shouldnt even be called a person . pshyco why dont ur mother be shot for making a mistake of giving u birth. so mind u language next time.
what dal eater , i have seen u guys eating dal and even eating garbage here in pakistan. well dall is a food , i dont care if u call me dall eater or whatever. it shows how desperate u r .
we have a country names pakistan and it is present on the map . think whatever u want nobody wants to listen to u.

You should report that comment. I will too.

[afghanis_hehe]

Your point I understand nought. Detective.

Wonder what you are doing on a Nationalist forum, Luffy. Good question isn't it. Call Pakistan a mistake then defend the same Nation?

No one in my direct family is in the army. Distant relatives yes.

I joined this site for many reasons-initially yes it was the promotion of my book. However another reason is to disprove what you're getting at... that a proud Pashtun cannot be patriotic Pakistani. He has to give one up.

Quaid E Azam was right. Extreme pride in ethnic identity would always be detrimental, similarly extreme pride in religion to the point of hating other religions and bashing Hindus would do nothing to strengthen the social fabric of Pakistan. So in reality Quaid had a remedy to both our religious and ethnic issues. Pity we didn't follow his path. Quaid E Azam meant that we are Pakistanis first before anything and our land means a lot to us. Its not really smart to assume that Quaid E Azam even thought that these racial identities would completely disappear.

He understood their existence and applied specific solutions to specific ethnic groups.

Ethnic pride is never a problem unless it comes in the way of Pakistan. Unfortunately many of the ethnic nationalists do not understand that they do not have to be anti Pakistani to think about the betterment of their race. That their races future is forever joined with Pakistan.

The point is, is Jinnah's purpose successful. Is my love for Pashtuns coming in the way of my Nationalism. Is it making me hate Punjabis and the others? If it is not Quaid E Azam would not mind my dedication to Pashtuns.

Lets put it this way. The cause of Pashtuns and the cause of Pakistan is one-at least the cause of Pakistani Pashtuns anyway who are far more in number than Toramana etc.

You are trying to drive me and Afghani-hehe apart. I wish I had a better name for him. Me and this guy are brothers from the state of Pakistan and we love our country. This inevitably brings us closer.

I have never BASHED Afghans. They have always bashed me and my country. When someone shows the Afghans the mirror they obviously do not take it pleasantly. You just came. You don't know how they treated us before this.

Initially I expected proud Pakistani Pashtuns would be on this forum and Afghan Pashtuns would be peaceful in nature, not stubborn. I thought they would welcome the book with open arms and I would build a large market for my book. After all the book was about Pashtuns. Initially that was the reason. But after noticing how great the racism is now I am here for more reasons than that. One of which I have stated before.

Have you seen how empty the site is? I posted similar articles and got no responses. Big deal. The fate of Pashtuns and Pakistanis is forever intertwined. I have been explaining why all day and cannot elaborate on this further.

Lets focus on you. You are treating me better than the racist crowd in the hopes you can win me over which you can't.

And Luffy, please I told Toramana the same thing. Please don't try to teach us. I appreciate you are not like Toramana but I recognize that you are on the edge. The only one who is confused is these people who want to break Pakistan and you too are slightly confused. You don't know what you are advocating by supporting these people who will gladly discard you once you've been used. Just because of history which the Afghans forgot in one day when they gave us over to the British you are forgetting how the Pakistani Pashtuns struggled alone without Afghan support against the British, fought and died and then with their blood built Pakistan. (Toramana is probably really an Afghan not from Pakistani side.)

Pashtuns made Pakistan. I still maintain this. 3 people in now or never movement, Abdur Rab Nishtar, thousands of Pashtun soldiers. Why do you guys discount that as a part of our history. What greater crime can you commit on the souls of these departed?

This history of Pashtuns is what makes us different or apart from the Afghans.

There is no guarantee that if the mod was not a Pashto speaker he was also not Pashtun.

Many Pashtuns in Pakistan speak Urdu, Punjabi and Kashmiri and have only a Pashtun background though they still identify for the most part as Pakistani Pashtuns. Now the census in Pakistan is done on the basis of language which means there may be a few Million or so more Pashtuns in Pakistan that are not being counted.

Now being a Pashtun Nationalist you should be working to have an ethnic census to ensure all Pashtuns are counted and as a result get a proper share of the economy. This is what annoys me sometimes about Toramana too... you guys simply are not focused on the right issues. Instead all you want is to break Pakistan is if by some magic the disappearance of Pakistan will solve our problems. You don't know what you are doing and when you will destroy the chances for Pakistani Pashtuns you will eventually feel guilt. Right now you are not understanding you are taking us to suicide.

Toramana made a similar claim that Amir Abdur Rehman was a hero. Only a fool of a Pashtun Nationalist could have made such a ridiculous claim because he is the reason for the divide between Northern and southern Pashtuns today. I don't like repeating, my views on that are discussed here:

Why what Abdur Rehman Khan did partitioned Pashtuns forever.

Instead of misleading Pashtuns to believe Pakistani and Pashtun interests are separate if you guys managed to do something useful and focus on real issues such as language, poverty, intolerance and fanaticism we would be a much better society. But some people are intent on making sure Pashtuns lose what little they have.

Luffy, by leading Pashtuns on a head on collision course with the state

False broken logic again. I refuse to agree at all. Its clear they were Southern Pashtuns-Pakistani Pashtuns or below the Durand line Pashtuns. What people like you will never understand is that the history of Pakistan is the history of all races within it. Its not the history of a race because Pakistani is not really a race. What is Pakistani Pashtuns history (70% of all Pashtuns are Pakistani) is Pakistani history which makes our countries all the more complex.

I don't know why you have a problem with this. Shouldn't our culture be accepted within Pakistan. Doesn't this mean Pashtun culture is being recognized. Isn't that what you want or do you want to prove that Pakistan and Pashtun are different paths.

Luffy I can only advise you not to listen to the Afghan. Please. I don't have to tell you about the biases which you already know about.

One of the primary purposes of me being on this forum is to PROVE that a Pashtun Nationalist does not have to be a traitor to motherland. I will prove that a Pashtun Nationalist can also be a diehard Pakistani.

This is the truth. My views on the topic are explained in full in this post. Pashtuns and Afghans are always separate:
Why Pakistani Pashtuns and Afghans are different

bro the person who keeps maulana azad superior to jinnah is not a pakistani . this luffy is a confused person who cant compete with me in history so he has started attacking punjabis bcz he knows my father is punjabi so m i . he is afghan from afghanistan . he is lying that he is pakistani , well thats what i concluded from his thoughts

[afghanis_hehe]

You should report that comment. I will too.

yes bro i have already reported that comment . thanx but a advice from me to u is that dont teach this scholar luffy who is extremely confused and i have really started hating him due to one of his statements that he holds abdul kalam superior to jinah

[haviZsultan]

Afghanis_hehe may be a half Pashtun but he has every right to act as a representative of Pashtuns. I salute your resilience in the face of such hatred.

yes bro i have already reported that comment . thanx but a advice from me to u is that dont teach this scholar luffy who is extremely confused and i have really started hating him due to one of his statements that he holds abdul kalam superior to jinah

I would still advise you to go easy on him. He is much better than what these other guys are. When he came some of the abuse and direct hatred for Pakistan reduced a little. He is a confused person who doesn't know whether he is Pashtun, Afghan, Pakistani or what but he can be won over.

These other guys have gone so far over the edge I fear they are on the point of no return.

You saw abassins comments. Thats how most Afghans act.

[randolph85]

the fact that you guys somehow equate the idea of pakistan to near idol worship of jinnah is laughable. the guy couldn't even control his own daughter, do you think he would of had much luck with pakistan if he hadn't died so soon?

[Michin Khel]

Havi sultan i have read your post, i respect your point of view but please dont thank the posts of afghani-hehe , the troll who is here to mock our history. Dont indulge yourself in childish e-gang wars.

[randolph85]

Afghanis_hehe may be a half Pashtun but he has every right to act as a representative of Pashtuns. I salute your resilience in the face of such hatred.

the guy who's sn is mocking afghans has the right to act as a representative of nearly 50 million pashtuns? what the

thats gone as well as the sales numbers for your book will after its released.

[BLS_1919v2.0]

Well governement of afghansitan was uninterested right to entertain their muslim brothers .thanx its nice to hear brother when people sell all their properties and all what they had and moved to afghansitan to gain help and what they gained was rejection.
my mothers family tried to go there and my grandmother tells me that when they went there even though they were pashtuns they were cooking and some local ladies kicked their food pot and asked them in a bad manner to go back and stop sitting in their fields. thats the love we all muslims have for each other.

Well that is very sad to hear this happened to your family. However, Luffy is right, overwhelming majority were muslims east of the Indus river. This event is recollected in Pak studies books, but in other material it is hard to find. As I told you Lar Pashtuns were not kicked out of Afghanistan, many who moved were able to join the government, get education, get land in the north. Of course, as with the case when dealing with humans, you don't get 100% cordial treatment all the time.

BTW you didn't answer the other questions...then again it is hard when Randolph hit the the bulls eye with his post.

[Michin Khel]

hahah man u lie like a real scholar .hindustani muslims haha included u aswell as british india included frontier too. ok and i know pakhtuns migrated to afghanistan from kp , my relatives from my mother side (which is predominantly pashtiun and speaks pashto) was kicked from there . so plzz stop and u urself have exposed urself to be afghhan from afghanistan . so stop saying that u tr pakistani

I respect your mother as i have also a mother. But i find it hard to believe that your mother is turi and she married a sunni man and then converted to sunni. I know turis, they are very hardcore shias and they dont marry with sunnis. Also you dont know some pashto even though your mother is pashtun, why?. I have seen cases like you, they always know little bit pashto.

[afghanis_hehe]

Havi sultan i have read your post, i respect your point of view but please dont thank the posts of afghani-hehe , the troll who is here to mock our history. Dont indulge yourself in childish e-gang wars.

yes i m a troll ok . if that makes u happy . what u r doing is called gaddari . i m a troll but i m nt a gaddar .well u r

[Michin Khel]

the fact that you guys somehow equate the idea of pakistan to near idol worship of jinnah is laughable. the guy couldn't even control his own daughter, do you think he would of had much luck with pakistan if he hadn't died so soon?

Good point. A man whose family life was messed up, who was unable to prevent his daughter from marrying a parsi (just to protect his political reputation among his followers), yet he was baba of pakistani nation, a baba who was desi englishman , with disturbed family life.

[haviZsultan]

Havi sultan i have read your post, i respect your point of view but please dont thank the posts of afghani-hehe , the troll who is here to mock our history. Dont indulge yourself in childish e-gang wars.

Yaar, look at the posts of abassinaafghan. How would we Pashtuns like it if someone came around and insulted Rehman Baba, Khushal Khan Khattak and others.

Jinnah is a national leader of all Pakistanis regardless of race or religion. Why Afghans don't respect us?

What you guys are doing with this guy just because he has divergent views from the majority is very wrong. Debate with him instead of abusing him in every post.

[Michin Khel]

yes i m a troll ok . if that makes u happy . what u r doing is called gaddari . i m a troll but i m nt a gaddar .well u r

Yes may baghi hun, may baghi hun...all ghairatmand balochs are also gaddar for punjabis like you...

[haviZsultan]

Good point. A man whose family life was messed up, who was unable to prevent his daughter from marrying a parsi (just to protect his political reputation among his followers), yet he was baba of pakistani nation, a baba who was desi englishman , with disturbed family life.

The message that sent was very noble. Nothing can be forced down the throat of anyone. Anyone belonging to a different faith has a right to practice his own faith and if anyone wants to convert or marry of his choice its his or her choice.

If he would have forced her he would have gone down in history as a monster and a jihadi. Something the Afghans would have been very pleased about.

It was a remarkable message for communal harmony and peace between religions given the chaotic times when each religion was involved in massacring the other. Quaid E Azam understood that religious and ethnic harmony was at the heart of any strong nation.

We forgot his message unfortunately.