Failed Suicide Bomber Talks to Yalda Hakim

[BarakzaiAbdali]

Lol scimitar I cited the main dictionary admin khan posted at this pf site. It's the only way assal ki is defined when the two are affixed. He never once says anything of the sort with respect to pak folks being in afg because muhajirs from of Afghanistan in Pakistan permit for this. Ask even my detractors on here... Ask maseed ask lavanaay ... He is almost half joking that paki Taliban are less capable, able, and determined. He doesn't evade and only refuses to answer questions about technique.

Ask din lala what he is saying...

I'm gave you the exact page number and the mods can bring it up. I used almost verbatim the words zeeya pashtun used for asl KI

That's all hand waving BA


the other statements he makes about the percentage of Pakistanis was in contexts of the muhajiran, it seemed like he was saying afghans cross into our borders, why can't we cross into theirs...... the alleged animosity with Pakistan wasn't apparent; it seemed that he was just saying why did they specifically attack the Taliban when OBL was in Pakistan seemed more to be about dancing around the question of why these guys are meddling in Afghanistan's affairs rather than trying to topple Pakistan.


In fact he constantly evades the question. since you're taking liberties at placig interpretations. How else could such evasions be interpreted?

Asal ki doesn't just mean basically in this case "ki" is being used like "chi" so it can be used as origin. Which means the translator was saying what he saying except the grammatical tense was wrong. since he used "yoo." and not "ze....yum". Also he doesn't say Prata, he says PratAAAAI, a verbal noun, if he was speaking of prata in reference to themselves they would say "prot" from what I recall. pratai is referring to the border.

also Shadowgovernor has been sillent the whole day since I pointed this out to him and he's a Pashtu speaker allegedly better than I am, he wouldn't be so silent if that point wasn't clearly illustrated. LOL

Also if what you were saying was in the dictionary; you'd have cited it directly as you usually do with other references. It seems to me you're banking on the fact none of us have the time to laboriously check these things.


The rendering is he is saying they're originally from Pakistan, further confirmed by his explanation of why Pakis go to Afghanistan.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

Also you are dead wrong about his variations between plural and singular making a difference to the overall meaning. In the earlier interview question he utilizes plurality and couples it to his verbage and will go back and forth between za and monzh. Most of us do the same even here... Sometimes we say za and sometimes monzh moong etc.

[کیش]

Mehmoud Jan,

I am disappointed. Have you run out of logic that after listening to this golden interview/ debate your biggest argument is "he says he's Pakistani, that means he works for ISI."

cmon bro,

[BarakzaiAbdali]

Here is the Ziyaa Pashtun definition of the utilization of Prataa; which is the exact word he CORRECTLY uses:

"Prate: Masculine PLURAL of proot"
pashto letters: pe re aleph the heh
page 128

With respect to the asal ki:
THE ONLY TIME ZEEYA defines the linkage of the two words
"Pa Asl ke": "In essence, in substance, in actuality, factuality"
Pa asl ki, da Pakistan khwa, da afghanistan pa poola bandey prathaa yew
"Actually, we are gathered on the Pakistani side of the Afghan border."
If you were to directly insert Ziya's words.

In any regard, it wouldnt matter Scimitar as I have no reason to make this up. I have already accepted that the Afghan Taliban utilize Pakistanis. There is no need to have a 20 page long debate about that at all. There have been many many Wazirs and Mehsuds, zalmee, caught. In fact Hamid Karzai pardoned one:

http://www.smh.com.au/news/world/all...559704063.html

There have been many cases like this which is why I wondered prior to seeing the video as to what word was used for border as sarhad is commonly used for the FATA tribes since a large number of these folks are from FATA which is why the Khost Protection Force and other "special ops" style ANA units targerts there and not Quetta.

So trust me, Im not at all trying to argue in a 100% Afghan national comprisal as Pape and others have shown that a great number of cross border events both ways are nationals from each side.

But I am 100% sure that you are wrong about this interviewee and what he is conveying.

However, to err is human, and I think we can let Abbass and Din way in... though I can confirm for you that Graveyard's Kunari Pashtu is very very pure in its derivation and he is 100% fluent and literate...

[BarakzaiAbdali]

http://www.pashtunforums.com/showthr...hto+dictionary

Link to the dictionary ^

[RevolutionThroughReason]

but he's saying pratai, not prata, it wouldn't apply anyways.

could you print screen the zeeya pashtun dictionary pages relevant for this discussion?

[RevolutionThroughReason]

thank you BA ..


well here is what the page writes



1.4 is within the scope of the the rendition of pa asal ki, and in context, it makes more sense for him to be saying "in origin" rather than "in essence" or "basically".

[RevolutionThroughReason]

yep after reading the dictionary; he's saying that he's Pakistan on the border areas

and Kais.....given the fact we have so many independent sources of the Taliban connections to the ISI, and that they're from Pakistan, then putting two and two together is wholly reasonable.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

thank you BA ..


well here is what the page writes



1.4 is within the scope of the the rendition of pa asal ki, and in context, it makes more sense for him to be saying "in origin" rather than "in essence" or "basically".

You are wrong again and using Zeeya's dictionary incorrectly.
He uses common phraseologies followed IMMEDIATELY by the meaning attached.

Take for instance the phrase he uses as an example above:
Da Masdar Asl:
"the stem of the verb" it stops there. Once 1.2 hits that is another meaning of the general whole asl. So you cannot assume that "da masdar asl" means statute as that is not at all a meaning of it and masdar is "verb."

So when he uses "pa askl ki" his definition of what this covers stops BEFORE
"origin, race, family etcetc" that is it terminates at and does not include 1.4

My friend, lol, once again, Im telling you I use this phrase so much that this should be my nickname...

As I said, have the natives who were born there give us there interpretation:
Din, Abbassina, even DaMalakandGhar/Lavanaay to spice things up. Mostafa and Maseed can also offer their translation.

So once again your translation is incorrect in both technical sense and within the context of his demeaner and words. He also uses other words specific to Afghan enclaves raised in Pashtunabad and other regions right across the border.

As noted though, it matters little to me one way or another. You can believe what you want about him as I have nothing to prove with respect to your general point (i.e. refer to the waziri boy article above).

[BarakzaiAbdali]

Another good example is on page 270 where he uses
Chun:
"Da Tukar Chun na khwaree: This cloth will not wrinkle"

But that ends before the definition associated with chun alone: Pivot starting at 2

[RevolutionThroughReason]

what can I say other than you're clearly ignoring your own reference.

It includes 1.4 because it begins another tense there after.

there's really no other rendering that fits.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

yep after reading the dictionary; he's saying that he's Pakistan on the border areas

and Kais.....given the fact we have so many independent sources of the Taliban connections to the ISI, and that they're from Pakistan, then putting two and two together is wholly reasonable.

Or it does wrong to someone who legitimately may derive from a country and represent an actual opinion within a group if you are wrong.

I think that Miss Hakimi conducted a rather poor quality interview and I think the young guy was not very knowledgable about history and facts to answer her cogently.

As I said, there is far more evidence to show cross border infiltration near the Waziristan region. H Mehsud clearly orchestrated a cross border attack against Central Intelligence a few years ago.

As far as I see it, I agree with Kais, what does incorrectly labeling him a Pakistani do for your argument as you already have some information that I just provided above that is open source and has a picture of Karzai pardoning a kid whose Wazir dad's name is used?

[R3SISTANC3]

He says muzh alta pra'teh yu

Proot means to land/laying, he used alta pra'teh yu means they are displaced and has landed there = Pakistan. Because he used that word, pra'teh, is an indication that he is an Afghan who grew up in Pakistan where he/they have "landed" due to migration.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

what can I say other than you're clearly ignoring your own reference.

It includes 1.4 because it begins another tense there after.

there's really no other rendering that fits.

As I said, you are wrong. Look at the masdar asl.

Masdar has no other meaning nor association with "principle" as seen 1.3.

Try using that particular phrase "da masdar asl" to reflect the definitions in 1.2/1.3 and no one will know what you are saying or they will think you are saying "root of the verb" again and again.

"asl ki" has never in any Pashto poetry of old or in any modern sentence been used in the way you are saying.

In fact go right to the next word he defines:
"Pa asl" he has a and b following that phraseology
and then goes on to 1.5 and then 1.6 etc.

If he was denoting 1.4 with "asl ki" he would have done the same (actuality in def a and origin in b).

Im sorry but you are ensared by the two phrases around it and exactly how he deals with them.

Until you can somehow make "da masdar asl" mean statute and not simply root of the verb, you are wrong.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

He says muzh alta pra'teh yu

Proot means to land/laying, he used alta pra'teh yu means they are displaced and has landed there = Pakistan. Because he used that word, pra'teh, is an indication that he is an Afghan who grew up in Pakistan where he/they have "landed" due to migration.

Thats a good idiomatic point as well.
I have heard "zama kor dagha zay sara prooth deh"
Zamonsh kor hughaltha prooth deh
Zamonsh tarboraan hure prathe dhee. (kinsmen are sleeping there)