A united Pakistan and Afghanistan

[Nadir Shah]

Honestly,


you were given the choice.

If you are Pashtun living in Pakistan and you consider yourself Afghan.. because, you know you fled there from Afghanistan, that is perfectly fine. Khoday mu rawala wrono au Khoando, Khoday de Azaadi darkih, inshAllah.

If you are Pashtun living in Pakistan and you consider yourself Pakistani..
Pakistanyyat mu mubarak!! It's also perfectly fine, your life and your choice. Just because we Afghans disagree with it, doesn't mean we can stop you from.. you know, selling your souls to the enemy etc.

BUT if you consider yourself Pakistani, kindly stay out of Afghan affairs and please refrain from telling us how to run our country - the country that you have deliberately turned your back to, the country you badmouth and the country you insult by announcing your Pakistanitob. As a Pakistani, you should have other concerns.. rather than worrying about what language our president communicates with us in. =)

I dont think it is beneficial for us Afghans/Pashtuns to play a blame game among ourselves. The tides and currents of geo-strategic forces have dictated our destiny ever since the death of Ahmed Shah Baba. Circumstances forced Amir Sher Ali to sign the Gandamak treaty in 1879 and Amir Abdurrehman to sign the Durand treaty. But we should not blame the Afghan state for abandoning us. Ghazi Amanullah Khan and Gen Nadir Shah fought the British for Pashtunkhwa. It is a great achievement of the Afghan State that despite the ups and downs of the history, they have never reliquished their just claim over Pashtunkhwa.
On the other hand, we cannot blame the Pashtuns/Afghans of Pashtunkhwa either. Faqir of Ipi and others fought for re-unification. I believe it would have been the logical end of the struggles of Baacha Khan. Khan Shaheed Abdul Samad Khan Achakzai was always a promoter of Afghan Milli Wahdat. There are some among us who are ignorant of the just position of Pashtuns/Afghans among the commity of nations, but they, as |I said earlier are the product of massive state propagnada and indoctrination.
So, I think we should see things and percieve and propagate things in a way that benefits our cause and creates a force that drives us towards attainment of that cause, not in a way that divides us further.

[Mayana]

Oh I want unity more than anything and I admit that history has just gone wrong in many instances.

But just because I want unity among Pashtoons.. it doesn't mean that I will accept everything they argue and it doesn't mean that I want to unify with every single individual that considers himself Pashtoon. I have no wish and no desire to unify with someone who deliberately considers himself part of our enemy. Shoot me.. but I cannot find a desire in myself to unify with this person or to even consider them my sibling.

And I understand that this does not apply to all Pashtoons living in Pakistan and that this is rather an exception. Hence is why I wrote that people were given a choice and either way I'm ok with however they decide. I just don't have a desire to unify with certain groups of people.

As for the badges.. some things just don't work, worora. You can't be Zionist and Pro-Palestine at the same time. You can't be water and fire at the same time. You can't be Pakistani and Afghan at the same time. Yes, we as Pashtoons have joint interests but I am addressing those people who support groups that have interests other than the Pashtoon interests (e.g. people who support US invasions, people who support the Pakistani government etc.). I have no desire to unify with such people because it is not in the best interest of Pashtoons. Certain patterns of reasoning just don't make sense. You can't be an Afghan Pakistani Pashtoon. Oxymoron.
I fully understand that those people are most likely a minority and those internet personalities most likely aren't even Pashtoon. But I have to give them benefit of the doubt and it can't be denied that those people do exist.


Bottom line is: If you want to be part of this society, you're welcome.
If you don't, go ahead. I don't mind at all.. I am not gonna go running after people tryna clarify their misunderstandings and their confusion about their own identity. If you want to be Muslim, be a Muslim, behave like one and publically announce that you're a Muslim. Likewise, if you want to be Pashtoon, act Pashtoon and announce that you are Pashtoon. =)

[Mayana]

And I don't blame Pashtoons of Pashtoonkhoa.. I don't blame anyone for that matter.
This is about personal choices, all I'm saying is we have to unify but we can't go running after people who deliberately do not share the same interests as us and who disrespect us by being more loyal to our enemy than us.

[BLS_1919v2.0]

Oh I want unity more than anything and I admit that history has just gone wrong in many instances.

But just because I want unity among Pashtoons.. it doesn't mean that I will accept everything they argue and it doesn't mean that I want to unify with every single individual that considers himself Pashtoon. I have no wish and no desire to unify with someone who deliberately considers himself part of our enemy. Shoot me.. but I cannot find a desire in myself to unify with this person or to even consider them my sibling.

And I understand that this does not apply to all Pashtoons living in Pakistan and that this is rather an exception. Hence is why I wrote that people were given a choice and either way I'm ok with however they decide. I just don't have a desire to unify with certain groups of people.

As for the badges.. some things just don't work, worora. You can't be Zionist and Pro-Palestine at the same time. You can't be water and fire at the same time. You can't be Pakistani and Afghan at the same time. Yes, we as Pashtoons have joint interests but I am addressing those people who support groups that have interests other than the Pashtoon interests (e.g. people who support US invasions, people who support the Pakistani government etc.). I have no desire to unify with such people because it is not in the best interest of Pashtoons. Certain patterns of reasoning just don't make sense. You can't be an Afghan Pakistani Pashtoon. Oxymoron.
I fully understand that those people are most likely a minority and those internet personalities most likely aren't even Pashtoon. But I have to give them benefit of the doubt and it can't be denied that those people do exist.


Bottom line is: If you want to be part of this society, you're welcome.
If you don't, go ahead. I don't mind at all.. I am not gonna go running after people tryna clarify their misunderstandings and their confusion about their own identity. If you want to be Muslim, be a Muslim, behave like one and publically announce that you're a Muslim. Likewise, if you want to be Pashtoon, act Pashtoon and announce that you are Pashtoon. =)

Dear anyone can be the citizen of any x y z state regardless of their identity. Palestinians can be citizens of Israel (in fact they are). One of the cruelest of ironies is that in the sole jewish state, Arab israelis are an increasing demographic. Similarly, in Pakistan all Pashtuns have Afghan on their NIC and domicile. They can't stop being a part of a nation, just because certain realities of history led to their division. This is an outcome. Now politically such a thing looks like oil and water, but realistically it exists. We have to accept that part. There is no point in indulging in such arguments. Rather we should work on improving our situation. Let us work on the things that bring our unity. The more we strive for it, eventually the natural aspect aka the unification will come.

[MazloomyarMaseed]

I dont want any Pashtun Unity under the banner of ANP. If Taliban stop being the little slaves of ISI that they are but instead promote Pashtun Unity on the grounds of Mirza Ali Khan Faqir of IPI then i would be the first one to support it, but sadly that is not reality but a dream but things can be unpredictabe and you never know what the futures holds for us Pashtuns.

Kind Regards

[erlangner]

I dont want any Pashtun Unity under the banner of ANP. If Taliban stop being the little slaves of ISI that they are but instead promote Pashtun Unity on the grounds of Mirza Ali Khan Faqir of IPI then i would be the first one to support it, but sadly that is not reality but a dream but things can be unpredictabe and you never know what the futures holds for us Pashtuns.

Kind Regards

Unity will never come under any one umbrella. It will come because it will come, but to have such fanatic Mullas as leaders and rulers, will be another tragedy for Pashtoons.

[Mayana]

Dear anyone can be the citizen of any x y z state regardless of their identity. Palestinians can be citizens of Israel (in fact they are). One of the cruelest of ironies is that in the sole jewish state, Arab israelis are an increasing demographic. Similarly, in Pakistan all Pashtuns have Afghan on their NIC and domicile. They can't stop being a part of a nation, just because certain realities of history led to their division. This is an outcome. Now politically such a thing looks like oil and water, but realistically it exists. We have to accept that part. There is no point in indulging in such arguments. Rather we should work on improving our situation. Let us work on the things that bring our unity. The more we strive for it, eventually the natural aspect aka the unification will come.

Yes, I agree, wrora, you can be part of a nation, like I am part of America or others are part of Europe or India. But can I go off supporting all of Americans foreign policies, say that Afghans are ungrateful and they owe "us" a lot and YET demand a name as a Pashtana? And yet demand a place in Pashtun society that I just kicked with my very feet by saying that they are ungrateful? I sure can do that but it is not correct.


Palestinians can be Israeli citizens but they can't be Zionists and still claim to share the same interests as Palestinians in Ghaza.
Same goes for Pashtuns.
They can be Pakistani citizens but they can't go off taking pride in the foreign policies of Pakistan and the ISI and still claim to share the same interests as all the other Pashtuns.

[BLS_1919v2.0]

Yes, I agree, wrora, you can be part of a nation, like I am part of America or others are part of Europe or India. But can I go off supporting all of Americans foreign policies, say that Afghans are ungrateful and they owe "us" a lot and YET demand a name as a Pashtana? And yet demand a place in Pashtun society that I just kicked with my very feet by saying that they are ungrateful? I sure can do that but it is not correct.


Palestinians can be Israeli citizens but they can't be Zionists and still claim to share the same interests as Palestinians in Ghaza.
Same goes for Pashtuns.
They can be Pakistani citizens but they can't go off taking pride in the foreign policies of Pakistan and the ISI and still claim to share the same interests as all the other Pashtuns.

Yes mayana you are right. Like I told you such people are of three kinds:
- more loyal to the king than the king himself
- part of the army or state bureacracy, so they have a stake in it.
- ignorant.

You can pick any of three, and they basically fall in these three categories (sometimes all three). Nations always have a group of people that work contrary to their own interests, this has been the case generally.

[Mayana]

Yes mayana you are right. Like I told you such people are of three kinds:
- more loyal to the king than the king himself
- part of the army or state bureacracy, so they have a stake in it.
- ignorant.

You can pick any of three, and they basically fall in these three categories (sometimes all three). Nations always have a group of people that work contrary to their own interests, this has been the case generally.

I agree with those three points.. Those are the reasons why people are part of that small group that I mentioned that is confused about their own identity.
But.. that group is small and the majority of Pashtuns are very self-aware and very loyal to themselves and their pursuit of freedom and autonomy, so the majority falls under the first group that I mentioned - I strive for their autonomy alongside with ours and I pray for their peace and freedom inshAllah, those are the people we want to reunite with and the people our hearts are connected with.

[BLS_1919v2.0]

I agree with those three points.. Those are the reasons why people are part of that small group that I mentioned that is confused about their own identity.
But.. that group is small and the majority of Pashtuns are very self-aware and very loyal to themselves and their pursuit of freedom and autonomy, so the majority falls under the first group that I mentioned - I strive for their autonomy alongside with ours and I pray for their peace and freedom inshAllah, those are the people we want to reunite with and the people our hearts are connected with.

I don't know about majority, but we have to start somewhere gullae. Now it is our survival on the line. Za pa dae pakistan tsa kaoma che pakhtaana da Afghanistan ao pashtunkhwa thabaa keegee. Now we have to think about our survival as a people.

[erlangner]

I agree with those three points.. Those are the reasons why people are part of that small group that I mentioned that is confused about their own identity.
But.. that group is small and the majority of Pashtuns are very self-aware and very loyal to themselves and their pursuit of freedom and autonomy, so the majority falls under the first group that I mentioned - I strive for their autonomy alongside with ours and I pray for their peace and freedom inshAllah, those are the people we want to reunite with and the people our hearts are connected with.

Most of the opponents are from army and beaurocracy. Other ignorant people can be convinced very rightly and very fast, however the people like army officers and beurocrates have their intrests and they canchange after they are retired.

[tor_khan]

The politics of the Pashtoons are interconnected and as BLS points out ...

We didn't choose to be split from Afghanistan, but we were leased out ...

If Pashtunkhwa people were given a fair choice in 1947, of course they would have united with their brethren.

... the issues go back further and pre-date the emergence of Pakistan.

[Nadir Shah]

I dont want any Pashtun Unity under the banner of ANP. If Taliban stop being the little slaves of ISI that they are but instead promote Pashtun Unity on the grounds of Mirza Ali Khan Faqir of IPI then i would be the first one to support it, but sadly that is not reality but a dream but things can be unpredictabe and you never know what the futures holds for us Pashtuns.

Kind Regards

Malgariya, politicizing and imparting consciousness to the Pashtun masses is a pre-requisite for any change and, in the present circumstances, a political struggle is the only way to achieve these things.

[erlangner]

A big example is of the afghan communist or socilaist inqilab of noor muhammad tarakai. peolpe were not ready and they brought inqilab and we see afghanistan red till today.

[Nadir Shah]

Yes, I agree, wrora, you can be part of a nation, like I am part of America or others are part of Europe or India. But can I go off supporting all of Americans foreign policies, say that Afghans are ungrateful and they owe "us" a lot and YET demand a name as a Pashtana? And yet demand a place in Pashtun society that I just kicked with my very feet by saying that they are ungrateful? I sure can do that but it is not correct.


Palestinians can be Israeli citizens but they can't be Zionists and still claim to share the same interests as Palestinians in Ghaza.
Same goes for Pashtuns.
They can be Pakistani citizens but they can't go off taking pride in the foreign policies of Pakistan and the ISI and still claim to share the same interests as all the other Pashtuns.

I don't think that is quite the correct approach to things. The Pashtuns/Afghans on both sides of the Durand Line have the same and identical interests. I would go as far as to say that even Mashar Mahmood Khan Achakzai and Amir Muqam (though I despise myself for putting these two names in the same bracket) have the same interests. The only difference is the Mashar Mahmood Khan is cognizant of his interests, loyalties and cause and Amir Muqam isn't.

BLS Malgariya, these three people can be combined under a single category. They can be categorized as "Pashtuns, who because of the forces of history and geo-stretegic intersts of the world powers, and the subsequent state indoctrination, are ignorant of their identity, their interests, their collective standing among nations and their potential for a great and prosperous future, for their continued survival and their subhuman living tend to associate themselves, and try to be loyal to the Pakistani state.'Though we could maybe differentiate between the Pashtuns on the basis of classes.