Questions about Afghanistan and Pashtun affairs

[akbarkhan]

All the true representatives of the Afghan people are represented in the peace jirga. Furthermore, It can be a way to open dialog betweent the moderate Taliban and the Kabul Govt.

Really? I wonder why they all stunk of American dollars.

[pir_Rokhan]

If you have the time, energy, ability and resources to find out about Pashtuns then surely you have the time, energy and ability to seek the truth about universe. There is alot more to life than 'pashtun' this and 'pashtun' that. And don't talk to me about honest living, if you were honest about who you were, you wouldn't be able to live where you are living!

There is no harm in seeking the truth about universe but not through dogmatic creeds which has no rooms for any argumentation, questioning, reasoning, objection or criticism. Truth, if one satisfies the pre requisites for it, should be sought by learning science and technology.

I agree but there is a lot more to life than the Arab imperialistic forms too, whatever they should be called. If I talk about Pashtuns and Afghans that is to fight for our rights , self respect ,dignity and a prosperous future and I dont think you will have any problem with that.

It is not for any antagonism with Arabs or Islam or Muslims that I suggest to segregate religion from statecraft and urge Afghans to focus on learning modern sciences instead of learning something which is non productive. The real reason is that I have gone through all this Islamic system, Khilafa system, Imamat etc both theoretically and practically [by participating in such movements till I found out the real intentions of their high ups ,were not of any benefit to Afghans and had to quit them].

By earning an honest living, I meant that Afghans should have skills to become doctors, engineers, scientists, lawyers,etc so that are not dependent on donations and charity from others and live independently [ in economic terms] whether in Afghanistan or abraod.

Exactly, but you concentrate all your pride and glory in Pashtun nationalism which is generalization at its best!

I just call for strategies and actions to revive Afghan glory not at the cost of humiliating others but a strive to win a life of dignity and honor for Afghans. I accept all non Pashtuns who live in Afghanistan as Afghans but I am sure you will not accept anyone who does not believe in exactly the same type of creeds as you have , even a muslim.

Yesterday the father had to force his children to seek Islamic knowledge, today the children are keen seeking knowledge going against the wishes of their parents. The dawn of illumination has appeared like a crescent on the horizon.

The children should object to the non productive, sectarian , brainwashing and non thought provoking mode of education. This is natural. The elders have achieved nothing after learning what is being termed as "Islamic knowledge" except developing a trait to hate humanity and labelling them as heretics and hence killing each others for a difference in the interpretation of some Arab-coined-metaphysical notions ,the reality of which, will never be known either to them or to others.

I never have and never will advocate imperialism regardless of it being Arab or Ajam.

You and other sincere ideologues would not do it consciously, however it practically ends up in submission to the Arabs or their interpretation, instead of an abstract concept of Allah, which could otherwise have been an anti- imperialistic slogan to give some relief to the oppressed Afghan masses.

If its about self consciousness then would you embrace a Tajik, Arab, Punjabi as equal to yourself? Or will you perceive them as lowly and hold you forefathers in great esteam?

Delusion of the granduer is one disease which narrow racists could fall prey to however no realist woud ever degrade any man or person or group or nation in history who have stood for creativity , innovation, wisdom, justice, bravery, courage, voice against oppression and humanism.

My call to Afghans is NOT to convince them for holding the non Afghans inferior to them but to MOTIVATE them for bringing themselves at par with the rest of the world in terms of knowledge, science,technology,civilisation, humanism and prosperoity and progress. It is we ,who are lagging behind, not the world.

Islam is not an ideology, it is a pragmatic framework ensuring success in this life and the hereafter. It is not our job to convince people nor do we have the ability or authority to convince people.

This is your point of view. I respect it as do I respect others' in this regard.

We will have to wait and see whether you are Pir Rokhan or Pir Tareek.

This was a good one.

[Smarty]

Well i am curious about this question answer session with sir akbar khan, is he some kind of celebrity?

[akbarkhan]

There is no harm in seeking the truth about universe but not through dogmatic creeds which has no rooms for any argumentation, questioning, reasoning, objection or criticism. Truth, if one satisfies the pre requisites for it, should be sought by learning science and technology.

I feel like we are going in circles, not that it is alien to us. Its imperative to steer our efforts towards accumulation of scientific knowledge. But you have to understand that Muslims strive for the hereafter, unlike persons like you who measure success based on tangibles of this world.

It is not for any antagonism with Arabs or Islam or Muslims that I suggest to segregate religion from statecraft and urge Afghans to focus on learning modern sciences instead of learning something which is non productive.

So learning our Deen and acting upon it is non-productive? Mildly putting it, if I may; you don't represent Afghans. Everything you stand for is against vox populi as as matter of fact, it is but an outright insult to the countless martyrs who throughout the centuries have coloured the pinnacles of virtue and benevolence with their sacred blood!

By earning an honest living, I meant that Afghans should have skills to become doctors, engineers, scientists, lawyers,etc so that are not dependent on donations and charity from others and live independently [ in economic terms] whether in Afghanistan or abraod.

I agree with the first part but am particularly glad with that which you have pointed out in the second part! It is indeed shameful that today we see hundreds of thousands of able Afghans choosing to be financial burden on the host countries where they have sought asylum!

I just call for strategies and actions to revive Afghan glory not at the cost of humiliating others but a strive to win a life of dignity and honor for Afghans. I accept all non Pashtuns who live in Afghanistan as Afghans.

I believe this part is the only thing me and you have in common.

I am sure you will not accept anyone who does not believe in exactly the same type of creeds as you have , even a muslim.

Not exactly, I am just not fond of Murtads and secularists. However, that doesn't mean that I am not going to be kind and just with them.

The children should object to the non productive, sectarian , brainwashing and non thought provoking mode of education. This is natural. The elders have achieved nothing after learning what is being termed as "Islamic knowledge" except developing a trait to hate humanity and labelling them as heretics and hence killing each others for a difference in the interpretation of some Arab-coined-metaphysical notions ,the reality of which, will never be known either to them or to others.

They say knowledge and wisdom, far from being one, have often no connection. Knowledge dwells in heads replete with thoughts of other men; wisdom in minds attentive to their own! And so it is that on one hand we have Mullahs who don't know a thing about the world, on the other, we have atheists as such as yourself who think that they know everything about the world.

You and other sincere ideologues would not do it consciously, however it practically ends up in submission to the Arabs or their interpretation, instead of an abstract concept of Allah, which could otherwise have been an anti- imperialistic slogan to give some relief to the oppressed Afghan masses.

That is your assumption, widen up your eyes and put away the blur spectacles which have distorted your vision! Were we not conscious of the world, surely, we would have been unable to bring the rebellious and factious conglomerates to absolute stalemate, witness them red faced and on the brink of kowtowing with all their means and resources.

Delusion of the granduer is one disease which narrow racists could fall prey to however no realist woud ever degrade any man or person or group or nation in history who have stood for creativity , innovation, wisdom, justice, bravery, courage, voice against oppression and humanism.

Agreed upon.

My call to Afghans is NOT to convince them for holding the non Afghans inferior to them but to MOTIVATE them for bringing themselves at par with the rest of the world in terms of knowledge, science,technology,civilisation, humanism and prosperoity and progress. It is we ,who are lagging behind, not the world.

Agreed upon, as long as our social and religious integrities are not stepped upon.

This was a good one.

Thanks

[MazloomyarMaseed]

I feel like we are going in circles, not that it is alien to us. Its imperative to steer our efforts towards accumulation of scientific knowledge. But you have to understand that Muslims strive for the hereafter, unlike person like you who measure success based on tangibles of this world.



So learning our Deen and acting upon it is non-productive? Mildly putting it, if I may; you don't represent Afghans. Everything you stand for is against vox populi as as matter of fact, it is but an outright insult to the countless martyrs who throughout the centuries have coloured the pinnacles of virtue and benevolence with their sacred blood!



I agree with the first part but am particularly glad with that which you have pointed out in the second part! It is indeed shameful that today we see hundreds of thousands of able Afghans choosing to be financial burden on the host countries where they have sought asylum!



I believe this part is the only thing me and you have in common.



Not exactly, I am just not fond of Murtads and secularists. However, that doesn't mean that I am not going to be kind and just with them.



They say knowledge and wisdom, far from being one, have often no connection. Knowledge dwells in heads replete with thoughts of other men; wisdom in minds attentive to their own! And so it is that on one hand we have Mullahs who don't know a thing about the world, on the other, we have people atheist as such as yourself who think that they know everything about the world.



That is your assumption, widen up your eyes and put away the blur spectacles which have distorted your vision! Were we not conscious of the world, surely, we would have been unable to bring the rebellious and factious conglomerates to absolute stalemate, witness them red faced and on the brink of kowtowing with all their means and resources.



Agreed upon.



Agree upon, as long as our social and religious integrities are not stepped upon.



Thanks

What is our Religious Integrities?

Should one Question ones faith be banned and Punishable?

Should Mullahs promote the whole "Kaffir can arm you to kill kaffir" be spread throughout our regions?

Kind Regards

[MazloomyarMaseed]

In my view, just limit ISI's influence, and the Taliban will soon dissapear, because who will house,feed and care for them when most of them are hiding in Pakistan?

The International Community needs to pressurise Pakistan to stop playing double games.

If that doesnt work, then there is no other option but to divide Pakistan and Let Punjabis enjoy the Luxuries Laws of Lal Masjid.

Kind Regards

[akbarkhan]

What is our Religious Integrities?

Shariat

Should one Question ones faith be banned and Punishable?

No, infact we should encourage people to question what Islam and Sharia is. It is our duty to provide our communities a platform where they could pose their questions, dillemas and misconceptions.

Should Mullahs promote the whole "Kaffir can arm you to kill kaffir" be spread throughout our regions?

Young man, you should read the Seerah of Prophet Mohammad pbuh before making such ill conceived comments! Mohammad pbuh has on many occasions got arms and weapons from Jewish tribes to fight the pagans.

[Smarty]

^are u a jihadi?

we have no right to kill the innocent humans whether they r pagans or kafirs.

[akbarkhan]

Akbar dear, should we hold talks with the Taliban and have integrate into our society? or do we kill em all? and why?

thanks.

Have them integrated in your society? They are part of the society, if that wasn't the case then they would have been unable to put a successful resistance for over 9 years.

What surprises me is the fact that every single one of us here talk about politics, anthropology and warfare yet none seem understand the basics of guerilla warfare! Regis, Zedong and Guevara all agree that the backbone of all revolutionary movements is the common mass, without grass root support a guerilla movement can never sustain itself let alone putting up a vehement resistance.

Graingar has stated the following:

Contrary to the focus of conventional warfare, territory gained, or casualty counts are not of overriding importance in counter-guerrilla warfare. The support of the population is the key variable. Since many insurgents rely on the population for recruits, food, shelter, financing, and other materials.

[pir_Rokhan]

I feel like we are going in circles, not that it is alien to us. Its imperative to steer our efforts towards accumulation of scientific knowledge. But you have to understand that Muslims strive for the hereafter, unlike persons like you who measure success based on tangibles of this world.

No we are not.
When the Quran says: "fa amma ma yanfaun naas fa yam kusu fil ard" [only that endures which is beneficial to humanity]. The endeavors to accumulate scientific knowledge, using it for the benefit of humanity and the concept of hereafter [whatever it is] are interrelated according to Quran.

Similarly without going into the controversial term of what is meant by hereafter, let us assume there is a life after death irrespective of its nature, even in that case the religious demagogues are neither understanding nor preaching the fruitful and correct version. How can one have a better "life in hereafter" if he or she has contributed nothing to humanity in this life? Think for a moment in non sectarian terms on the "hikma" of Quran [intellectual level] when it says:

"wa man fi hazi hid dunya a'maa fa huwa fi akhirata a'ma" [anyone who is blind here will be so in the hereafter too]. In this verse ofcourse Quran is not talking about the defects in the optical nerves and cornea but the fact that if you don’t see those phenomena thinking on which gives a push forward to humanity and empower it then you are blind and don’t expect that you will see any good results in the future [hereafter] if you continue to be stubborn about contributing nothing to humanity despite your "worship".

Moreover the clergy might call "zikar" as just murmuring some sacred arabic words while the quran says " wa man a'raza an zikri fa ina lahu maeeshatan zanka" [who so ever forgets (the laws which evolve humanity) would witness a stringent economic life]. In this verse the "zikar of Allah" is tied to the economic well being of a man.

Last but not least I am sure you would recite the verse in your prayers without paying an iota of serious heed when you say: " rabbana aatina fid DUNYA hasana wa fil akhiratay hasana wa qinna azaaban naar" [May we see a prosperous life in the short as well as in the long run and may we not become among those who face the music of their submissive and non productive life]. In this verse the life of Dunya is considered first in importance to the hereafter ,as against the creeds of mystics and ascetics who have no business to worry about in the world due to living in a fool's paradise.

So may I conclude that even if optimistically you are waiting for a life hereafter [and I don’t say it is impossible due to genome resurrection in genetic engineering], the plea that you do not contribute anything to the progress of humanity and wait as a prequalified successful candidate for the hereafter is a mirage according to the Quran itself [unless ofcourse you believe in an irrational interpretation which is good to keep people live in fantasies throughout their lives]

So learning our Deen and acting upon it is non-productive? Mildly putting it, if I may; you don't represent Afghans. !

What you term as learning DEEN is infact wasting one's creative and mental potential on some narrow minded sectarian interpretations of Quran and Sunnah and yes let me dare say it is a waste.
Why don’t the student in the madrassa study the normal curriculum taught in schools which can give them skills to earn an honest ad respectable living. Yes if they want to specialize in theology [deen] they should go for it but it should be at the same stage as the normal students do when they opt for specialisation.

What is the need of injecting the germs of hateful sectarian creeds into the innocent minds and turning them into a hate machine instead of making them useful, civilised and techno-creative members of a society?

Everything you stand for is against vox populi as as matter of fact, it is but an outright insult to the countless martyrs who throughout the centuries have coloured the pinnacles of virtue and benevolence with their sacred blood

I don’t mind to be unpopular voice if it saves the lives and dignity of millions of people of the third world countries like Afghanistan but we need to stop deceiving ourselves.

The heroes and martyrs of one creed and nation are the villains of another. The blood of those martyrs who stood against oppression, whether religious or political, is as sacred as the blood of those who in their naivety but sincerity lost their lives for the vested interests of the elite classes among the ruling junta.

I agree with the first part but am particularly glad with that which you have pointed out in the second part! It is indeed shameful that today we see hundreds of thousands of able Afghans choosing to be financial burden on the host countries where they have sought asylum!

I have written a small write-up " To the Expat Afghans" for urging them to be an asset and not a liability to the nation.

Not exactly, I am just not fond of Murtads and secularists. However, that doesn't mean that I am not going to be kind and just with them.

The concept of Murtad [Apostate] is controversial and is among the misinterpreted concepts in Arabic version of Islam. The popular version is the reminessaince of Arab imperialist regimes of the medieval ages.
Quran says:

"La ikraha fid deen".[ There is no compulsion in the choice of way of life].

There is nothing wrong in being secular, if one understands what it means. It means that every religion should be respected, and everyone has the right to practice one's religion. It is against the idea that a particular version of religion should be imposed on the whole state or population.

They say knowledge and wisdom, far from being one, have often no connection. Knowledge dwells in heads replete with thoughts of other men; wisdom in minds attentive to their own! And so it is that on one hand we have Mullahs who don't know a thing about the world, on the other, we have atheists as such as yourself who think that they know everything about the world.

I am skeptic not atheist. Skeptics tend to argue and argument is the only way to find out the true nature of discourses. I don’t just submit to someone's view claiming to be a divine authority because I somewhat find out that the person does not really know what he is talking about.

That is your assumption, widen up your eyes and put away the blur spectacles which have distorted your vision! Were we not conscious of the world, surely, we would have been unable to bring the rebellious and factious conglomerates to absolute stalemate, witness them red faced and on the brink of kowtowing with all their means and resources.

The Afghan courage but not the wisdom should be appreciated. To be used as a cannon fodder thought history [first against Russians and now against Americans, first for Punjabis and Americans and now just for Punjabis] is no wisdom. Had the so called ISI-backed mujahidin not fought against Russians the world would not have transformed into a UNIPOLAR world and Afghans would not be compelled to take the dictation of their Punjabi teachers and Afghanistan would have stabilized much more than what it is now. The 3 million Afghans would not be leading a life of Shodars [scheduled caste in Indus] in Pakhtunkhwa which is their own land but they do not have the balls to get it back from Punjab because Afghanistan is not stable and this is what they want. I know Afghans are against imperialism and so am I but the sad thing is that they fail to understand or convince themselves about fighting imperialism when the imperialists are so called Muslims [in afghan case it is Arabs and Punjabis] though much more deadly and fatal they might be.

[akbarkhan]

No we are not.
When the Quran says: "fa amma ma yanfaun naas fa yam kusu fil ard" [only that endures which is beneficial to humanity]. The endeavors to accumulate scientific knowledge, using it for the benefit of humanity and the concept of hereafter [whatever it is] are interrelated according to Quran.

Similarly without going into the controversial term of what is meant by hereafter, let us assume there is a life after death irrespective of its nature, even in that case the religious demagogues are neither understanding nor preaching the fruitful and correct version. How can one have a better "life in hereafter" if he or she has contributed nothing to humanity in this life? Think for a moment in non sectarian terms on the "hikma" of Quran [intellectual level] when it says:

"wa man fi hazi hid dunya a'maa fa huwa fi akhirata a'ma" [anyone who is blind here will be so in the hereafter too]. In this verse ofcourse Quran is not talking about the defects in the optical nerves and cornea but the fact that if you don’t see those phenomena thinking on which gives a push forward to humanity and empower it then you are blind and don’t expect that you will see any good results in the future [hereafter] if you continue to be stubborn about contributing nothing to humanity despite your "worship".

I agree.

Moreover the clergy might call "zikar" as just murmuring some sacred arabic words while the quran says " wa man a'raza an zikri fa ina lahu maeeshatan zanka" [who so ever forgets (the laws which evolve humanity) would witness a stringent economic life]. In this verse the "zikar of Allah" is tied to the economic well being of a man.

Zikr of Allah is not tied to economic well being. Zikr is about remembrance of Allah swt not by just murmuring his name and doing the beads, but rather remembering his Ahkam (commandments) in every undertaking.

Te life of Dunya is considered first in importance to the hereafter ,as against the creeds of mystics and ascetics who have no business to worry about in the world due to living in a fool's paradise.

I agree. I am against i.e sufism because it promotes a rather selfish and individualistic prespective of the world. This world is not about what we do with our lives alone, its about the fulfillment of responsibilities that we owe to humanity and our Lord.

For example, it is my responsibility to invite you to Islam, not the Islam that a village Mullah promotes with his limited knowledge of the world, or the Islam of a Khan or a politician who uses Islam as a tool to empower himself but rather the Islam that is pure of political motives and other dilutions; Islam thats free of secularism prioritizing scientific exploration and open dialogue.

[akbarkhan]

Akbar khan do you consider Pakistan as Afghanistans enemy? I can show you how we have helped you all along.

Look I don't have any issues with the average Pakistani man.

The Pakistani government has only 'helped' us to help themselves. I am sure you are going to either bring up the refugee scenario or the USSR era assistance. Pakistan's government did not help Afghanistan or Afghans for Islamic purposes, it was instead their chance to rake in billions of dollars, have the chance to build nuclear weapons and to maintain a strategic depth against India.

So my question to you is, if Pakistani government is so helpful then we are the same Afghans as in the 80s, why don't they help us now? Instead the same roads that used to carry logistics for Mujahideen are used to deliver logistics to Americans.

Conlusion: Pakistan's motive has always been money and military technology.

It is abit like this is, Brzezinski said the following to Afghans during the soviet era - compare it to what American administration says about their own occupation now.

[Michin Khel]

Afghans have a serious defect in them : unthankfullness.
We should be very be very thankful to the countries like iran, india and pakistan for what ever help they are providing even if they are interfering in afghanistan.

[Nadir Shah]

Afghans have a serious defect in them : unthankfullness.
We should be very be very thankful to the countries like iran, india and pakistan for what ever help they are providing even if they are interfering in afghanistan.

What stupidity is this? Why should we thank the Pakis or the Tehran Mullahs?

[Michin Khel]

What stupidity is this? Why should we thank the Pakis or the Tehran Mullahs?

You have some serious problem in the head. Imagine you are very hungry and some one give you a bread to eat. What will you say to him ? thank you or stupid? ( Ignore the intention of person in giving you food, at instance taking care of hunger will be important)