dr najeeb speech on shah nawaz tanai

[ScimitarXEdge]

LOL. Like Mutali-a-Pakistan

so you're saying that the Russian invasion and 1.5 Million Afghan lives lost never happened?

[Toramana]

Why don't they i.e. the Punjabi establishment carry out an effective and conclusive operation in Waziristan especially (and other tribal agencies generally) if they have all the ability to do that as they demonstrated in the case of Bugti whom they eliminated ruthlessly despite the popular basis of Baluch movement(unlike Taleban who are not popular at all)?

The fact is, Bugti was a threat to the interests of the Punjabi establishment whereas TTP and Taleban are its proxies. In Swat, they (Swatis) used to say Army and Taleban are one(they had understood the relationship between the Punjabi establishment and Taleban after going through all the ordeal)...They(Punjabis) have to camouflage their overall tactic and strategy viv-a-vis NATO/US and the Afghan state... Haqanis and other proxies of the Punjabi establishment need a base to retreat to, to regroup, retrain, and launch again (Waziristan and Kurram etc. provide such basis)....The TTP phenomenon is just a drama played to create a condition and environment for such a base ...that is why tribal maliks were killed in such a large number (because they could be a hurdle)...

[MeemWawMeemNoon]

Yeah but the majority opinion is it's forged. Authentic Hadith please.

In fact, the hadith was forged by Arab Nationalists; LOL

Majority card is a fallacy.

The text of the hadith is perfectly in-line with human nature. I am sure you miss the US when you are abroad. It is natural.

[khyaal]

Who said I defend Pakistan?

You're making a false dichotomy ...Anti Najib =/= pro Pakistan

that's absurd. USSR basically was trying to do the same. How else does a country militarily send it's personell into a country not their own unless they felt entitled to it?

Under the friendship treaty of 1921.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

LOL. Like Mutali-a-Pakistan

Is this where the conversation is going to once again degenerate into accusing him of being a closet Pakistani? He has consistently called for the dissolution of the local nation states. His agenda is more Pan Islamic than anything else. One might counter with the notion that you are not a Pashtun and therefore you have no place to dictate what occurs between Pashtuns regarding land grabs. That brand of argument would quickly degenerate and be idiotic to the level of the back and forth between Azmal and I. I prefer to stay on topic and be evidence based. Provide evidence that he is Pakicentric or a Pakiphile.

[ScimitarXEdge]

]The reason why you think that he was worst is because he was not a Muslim. Again, don't mix politics and religion. The Muslim leaders should all be sent straight to Jahannam, they used Islam for their dirty work.

No it's because he was involved in killing the most Afghans; and other heinous crimes; He may not have been a Muslim, but he tried to act Muslim.

Islam isn't a religion, stop with this circular argument.

[MeemWawMeemNoon]

If that's the case then why I am I not agreeing with most people who are supporting Najib, who are not Qadiyani

please dont call yourself Ahmadi, have some respect for Nabi(saw)'s name.

Two different issues.

Well, sorry, I am and will die an Ahmadi.

[ScimitarXEdge]

Under the friendship treaty of 1921.

That basically means in 1921, Afghan leaders told Russia that they have the right to treat Afghanistan as their property

case closed.

[MeemWawMeemNoon]

No it's because he was involved in killing the most Afghans; and other heinous crimes; He may not have been a Muslim, but he tried to act Muslim.

Islam isn't a religion, stop with this circular argument.

See, you are committing circular arguments. You can't comprehend your own flaws.

Again, the numbers fallacy...


it's ok

[ScimitarXEdge]

Two different issues.

Well, sorry, I am and will die an Ahmadi.

Ok Qadiyani; whatever helps you sleep at night.

[ScimitarXEdge]

Khyaal is like Comrade Pashtun and Azmal; when they can't rebut a point logically or with meritable evidence; their scapegoat by accusing you of being Pakistani

as if Pakistanis own the monopoly on truth or something? If anything that's implicitly more pro-Pakistani than anything being said here; because it means that they believe that only Pakistan will tell the Truth and everyone else will just mask things under propaganda.

[MeemWawMeemNoon]

Ok Qadiyani; whatever helps you sleep at night.

[ScimitarXEdge]

See, you are committing circular arguments. You can't comprehend your own flaws.

Again, the numbers fallacy...


it's ok

Until you show me with a logical rebuttal as to why it's a fallacy; it remains.

by the way do you know what a circular argument is? And no it doesnt mean repeating the same point. LOL

[BarakzaiAbdali]

Why don't they carry out an effective and conclusive operation in Waziristan especially if they have all the ability to do that as they demonstrated in the case of Bugto whom they eliminated ruthlessly despite the popular basis of Baluch movement?

The fact is, Bugti was a threat to the interests of the Punjabi establishment whereas TTP and Taleban are proxies. In Swat, they (Swatis) used to say Army and Taleban are one...They have to camouflage their overall tactic and strategy viv-a-vis NATO/US and the Afghan state... Haqanis and other proxies of the Punjabi establishment need a base to retreat to, to regroup, retrain, and launch again....The TTP phenomenon is just a drama played to create a condition for such a base ...that is why tribal maliks were killed in such a large number (because they could be a hurdle)...

Its a possible differential diagnosis I admit. I will have to think about that. However, another possibility is that Pakistan sees them as a detriment/benefit that can be kept intact but reigned in every so often with a "slap". What I mean by that is since they are not near the centers of power as Fazlullah was, and since they serve a purpose by making incursions for holy war into Afghanistan against NATO/Indian interests (i.e. Khost bombing) they may be viewed as a sustainable group to keep around. What I mean is that their interests may partially align to the point that Pakistan is willing to sustain their limited capabilities/wrath in order to maintain pressure. In which case they would still be an independent entity.

[khyaal]

Why don't they carry out an effective and conclusive operation in Waziristan especially if they have all the ability to do that as they demonstrated in the case of Bugto whom they eliminated ruthlessly despite the popular basis of Baluch movement?

The fact is, Bugti was a threat to the interests of the Punjabi establishment whereas TTP and Taleban are proxies. In Swat, they (Swatis) used to say Army and Taleban are one...They have to camouflage their overall tactic and strategy viv-a-vis NATO/US and the Afghan state... Haqanis and other proxies of the Punjabi establishment need a base to retreat to, to regroup, retrain, and launch again....The TTP phenomenon is just a drama played to create a condition for such a base ...that is why tribal maliks were killed in such a large number (because they could be a hurdle)...

Pakis could kill millions of Bengalis, assassinate Bugti, the son of Khair Bukhsh Marri, and thousands of Pashtuns and Baloch but they are unable to tame Lashkar e Tayyaba, Jaish Mohammad, Lashkar e islam. This is just a joke. LOL