paki dog killing afghans

[IamDZJ]

Seriously dude, rather than being defensive about it, try and learn why I accuse you of having no understanding of the human condition.
For the sake of all people of the region, including the population of Punjab the breakup would be a great advance for all! It will solve many many problems of the whole region, as well as solving the islamistic whackoeness all around the globe !

pakistan, in its present appearance, is the swamp in which whackoes dwell ! Even Punjabis are realizing this.

A new book has been published by Syed Jamalluddin, titled "Divide Paksitan: To Eliminate Terrorism".

The cover design shows Pakistan divided into 5 or 6 new smaller states

http://www.amazon.com/Divide-Pakista...7&sr=1-1-fkmr0

asking for separation is one thing and accusing the nation of an entire country of being murdering dogs who want you enslaved by the british, something else. screw sayed jamaludin and his book. a ****ty point doesn't become any more meritable than it is after it's published in black ink.

[Azmal]

Hmm tied enough so that Kharoti kills Wazir and Dawar kills Mehsid and Shamizoy kills Barakzai and Ghilzai gets killed by Nurzai etc. Or Khattak kiilled Yusufzai... etc etc.
And you are absolutely right that I could care less about what happens there. They can all genocide themselves to their heart's content. However, their BS is now entering our comfortable reality over here.
We have a faction of cowards that cannot handle their own problems, pick up their own pistols, and take care of their own mess.

Yet you want US to leave the swam

You want Baitullah, build your own drone and take care of him. You want Omar, get a gun and take care of him. You want Fazlullah, go and smoke him out of Nuristan.

You want to build Pashtunistan and genocide Emal or Luffy or Shahbaz or whoever, you are all on your own.

What the mighty Pashtuns cannot handle a few sly IndoPaks?

Me, Ill continue to pay my taxes, live my comfortable life, prescribe some cholesterol drugs, and meet God above without blood on my hands (thank God).

I see you are another one of those out of the Quetta red top hat wearing folks that sees Islamists under the bed and in the dark corners of the night.

lol reminds me of a writing on 7/11restroom door .."here i set with broken heart...trying to sh.t but only could fa.rt"

You need to make up your mind…You can’t care about Afghanistan and then have US leave Afghanistan and yet don’t want “their BS is now entering our comfortable reality” so what it gona be? Spite or swallow?
As for as who I am…. That’s thats the shortsighted and age old stupidity of pukies that label people… simply because they can not distinguish themselves without an opposite. I’m just an Afghan for you…east or west of infamous line does not matter.

[BLS_1919v2.0]

You seem reasonably studied in the matters, in all seriousness, are there are stats regarding KP Pashtuns and their desire for autonomy? There is such a survey for Afghanistan that cofirms a reasonable size of the southern Afghan basin desires for reunification independent of northern Afghanistan. I would be curious to see non ANP, non agenda laced, perhaps foreign NGO related data on the subject.

Wrora I can't speak for millions of people. However I will say that from people who are seperatists (I can't call them a majority) to people who accept Pakistan, there is no disagreement on autonomy. I say this because a recent ammendment was passed in Pakistan which granted much more autonomy to the provinces (along the lines of the 70s constitution but less than the 1940 resolution which opted for almost full autonomy) and there was no outcry in Pashtun areas. There was either generic response or approval. If Pashtunkhwa can get a unified autonomous province there will not be any major anger rather support to quiet approval. Again there are political achievements for the long term and then short term concerns. We have to separate the two. N and S pashtunkhwa have been ok with unifying for quite some time, but the only opposition has been with the zealot pakistanis or higher up establishment.

In any of those events that you mentioned Pashtunkhwa will have no choice but to unite with their brethren west of the durand line. Considering that a civil war in Afghanistan will drag Pashtunkhwa in and vice versa. The biggest hindrance to unity is east of the durand line and that is due to previously drawn out lines. This has created political gaps. There is a difference between PATA FATA settled areas and south Pashtunkhwa. So although we may be one nation there are political gaps due to these multiple tiers of governance. Being branded a kaffir for asking for such claims doesn't help either.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

lol reminds me of a writing on 7/11restroom door .."here i set with broken heart...trying to sh.t but only could fa.rt"

You need to make up your mind…You can’t care about Afghanistan and then have US leave Afghanistan and yet don’t want “their BS is now entering our comfortable reality” so what it gona be? Spite or swallow?
As for as who I am…. That’s thats the shortsighted and age old stupidity of pukies that label people… simply because they can not distinguish themselves without an opposite. I’m just an Afghan for you…east or west of infamous line does not matter.

One can have a passion for a subject and comment as well wisher. Look at it as I am a man in a restaurant watching two jackasses fight. I generally like both these guys, but think that they are going to end up hurting eachother. As a decent person, Ill advise both, but I certainly am not going to let either of them punch me accidently while swinging at the other one. If they tell me to back off and not offer advice based on what I have experienced and read, then thats fine, Ill take the message elsewhere.

Admin Khan and I talked about this once. As an American Pashtun you get crap from both sides. The folks on the far right call you singh and the folks on the far left accuse you of some pan Islamist agenda hidden in dark corners of the night. Being outside of that cesspool, we actually see with a clearer vision. However, having seen the environment there all we can do is warn our adopted countrymen about the risks of getting involved in that Tomfoolery.

However, your nationality is not Afghan. If you come to the US and state you are an Afghan, they will assume that you are from the current state as demarcated by all maps.

So trust me, its neither spit or swallow... its pass the cup, Id prefer to not drink of it at all.

[emkhan]

seperation ???? hehehehe dont waste your time. even think for the betterment of the nation.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

Wrora I can't speak for millions of people. However I will say that from people who are seperatists (I can't call them a majority) to people who accept Pakistan, there is no disagreement on autonomy. I say this because a recent ammendment was passed in Pakistan which granted much more autonomy to the provinces (along the lines of the 70s constitution but less than the 1940 resolution which opted for almost full autonomy) and there was no outcry in Pashtun areas. There was either generic response or approval. If Pashtunkhwa can get a unified autonomous province there will not be any major anger rather support to quiet approval. Again there are political achievements for the long term and then short term concerns. We have to separate the two. N and S pashtunkhwa have been ok with unifying for quite some time, but the only opposition has been with the zealot pakistanis or higher up establishment.

In any of those events that you mentioned Pashtunkhwa will have no choice but to unite with their brethren west of the durand line. Considering that a civil war in Afghanistan will drag Pashtunkhwa in and vice versa. The biggest hindrance to unity is east of the durand line and that is due to previously drawn out lines. This has created political gaps. There is a difference between PATA FATA settled areas and south Pashtunkhwa. So although we may be one nation there are political gaps due to these multiple tiers of governance. Being branded a kaffir for asking for such claims doesn't help either.

Yeah but a part of that sentiment was based on the drive by MQM for jinnapur and independent Sindh right? I mean I would like data about that kalaay Pashtun and how he feels about unification with what he generally knows as "kabulyaan." To him, there is no Qandharaay or Jalalabadi etc.... that individual knows us all as Kabulaay. I want to gauge how far wide spread that sentiment is. Based on the general admiration Peshawar had for the military on my travels, and the way that military officers (pashtuns mind you) would somehow cut in lines in front of us all... I saw quiet a respect for the Pakistani military throughout NWFP. Quetta, where there are fellow Durrani and Kakar Pashtuns was a bit different with less open patriotism and generally a bit more of an acceptance due to the straddling across the border of the Norzaay and Achekzaay tribes. That is, I felt much more easy going and able to wear my Qandahar patkaay openly in Quetta. I was able to mix in farsi words without any odd look.

[BLS_1919v2.0]

Yeah but a part of that sentiment was based on the drive by MQM for jinnapur and independent Sindh right? I mean I would like data about that kalaay Pashtun and how he feels about unification with what he generally knows as "kabulyaan." To him, there is no Qandharaay or Jalalabadi etc.... that individual knows us all as Kabulaay. I want to gauge how far wide spread that sentiment is. Based on the general admiration Peshawar had for the military on my travels, and the way that military officers (pashtuns mind you) would somehow cut in lines in front of us all... I saw quiet a respect for the Pakistani military throughout NWFP. Quetta, where there are fellow Durrani and Kakar Pashtuns was a bit different with less open patriotism and generally a bit more of an acceptance due to the straddling across the border of the Norzaay and Achekzaay tribes. That is, I felt much more easy going and able to wear my Qandahar patkaay openly in Quetta. I was able to mix in farsi words without any odd look.

No the mqm issue is entirely different and is restricted to the vicinity of Karachi. Well kabulai at best can be described as ignorance more like how some Pashtuns west of the durand may call their brethren pekhawrae (which Pashtunkhwa Pashtuns don't like since a city-dweller of peshawar is equivalent to a hindkai). These things though can still be rectified in time. Other nations with much wider gaps have managed to work around them, ours won't be any different. In Northern Pashtunkhwa there are more tiers of government (and hence gaps) than south Pashtunkhwa. In South Pashtunkhwa it is there region and right across Southern Afghanistan. For N Pashtunkhwa there is Peshawar city then FR peshawar then FATA then Afghanistan. So you can see the multiple tiers there. Add on that PATA areas of N Pashtunkhwa were their own entity right through the british times and even semi-independent since 1969 after partition. These gaps can be fixed as Afghanistan stabilizes, autonomous and unified Pashtunkhwa is on the table, etc.

Military used to have a lot of respect (even among the Afghanistan Pashtuns who settled in Pashtunkhwa)....this was due to the fact that they were a "muslim army" against the hindu India fighting in Kashmir, etc etc etc. So they had respect not to mention they had access to things regular civilians didn't. It was the easiest and surest way in Pakistan to move up the social ladder.

The army impression in FATA and PATA areas is not as friendly, at least not anymore. If anything there is an increasing dislike due to the Army's actions and double-dealings in the region.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

No the mqm issue is entirely different and is restricted to the vicinity of Karachi. Well kabulai at best can be described as ignorance more like how some Pashtuns west of the durand may call their brethren pekhawrae (which Pashtunkhwa Pashtuns don't like since a city-dweller of peshawar is equivalent to a hindkai). These things though can still be rectified in time. Other nations with much wider gaps have managed to work around them, ours won't be any different. In Northern Pashtunkhwa there are more tiers of government (and hence gaps) than south Pashtunkhwa. In South Pashtunkhwa it is there region and right across Southern Afghanistan. For N Pashtunkhwa there is Peshawar city then FR peshawar then FATA then Afghanistan. So you can see the multiple tiers there. Add on that PATA areas of N Pashtunkhwa were their own entity right through the british times and even semi-independent since 1969 after partition. These gaps can be fixed as Afghanistan stabilizes, autonomous and unified Pashtunkhwa is on the table, etc.

Military used to have a lot of respect (even among the Afghanistan Pashtuns who settled in Pashtunkhwa)....this was due to the fact that they were a "muslim army" against the hindu India fighting in Kashmir, etc etc etc. So they had respect not to mention they had access to things regular civilians didn't. It was the easiest and surest way in Pakistan to move up the social ladder.

The army impression in FATA and PATA areas is not as friendly, at least not anymore. If anything there is an increasing dislike due to the Army's actions and double-dealings in the region.

Fair enough, as anicdote the reasoning appears sound because I have not been on the ground in said regions since 2003, well before the operations escalated in FATA.

However, I would still prefer hard data in written from on:

1) How many NWFP Pashtuns % wise see their area as an independent province.
2) How many NWFP Pashtuns % wise would, at this juncture want to join into a Pashtunistan vs their own province without any relation to Afghanistan.
3) How many NWFP Pashtuns in the non FATA regions are against military operations there.

[BLS_1919v2.0]

Fair enough, as anicdote the reasoning appears sound because I have not been on the ground in said regions since 2003, well before the operations escalated in FATA.

However, I would still prefer hard data in written from on:

1) How many NWFP Pashtuns % wise see their area as an independent province.
2) How many NWFP Pashtuns % wise would, at this juncture want to join into a Pashtunistan vs their own province without any relation to Afghanistan.
3) How many NWFP Pashtuns in the non FATA regions are against military operations there.

This will be almost impossible to garner. In FATA there is almost a media blackout and all we hear is what ISPR says happens. Similarly in Swat. This survey will be clearly something Pakistan wouldn't want so I doubt they would allow it (unless it is in their favour). Most importantly right now isn't the time for surveys rather a time to start looking at the future of Pashtuns east or west of the durand line. We are stuck in a regional and international proxy war and it doesn't look like it is getting any better.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

This will be almost impossible to garner. In FATA there is almost a media blackout and all we hear is what ISPR says happens. Similarly in Swat. This survey will be clearly something Pakistan wouldn't want so I doubt they would allow it (unless it is in their favour). Most importantly right now isn't the time for surveys rather a time to start looking at the future of Pashtuns east or west of the durand line. We are stuck in a regional and international proxy war and it doesn't look like it is getting any better.

Fair enough, but I think, if you are native to the region and live there they need folks like you at the frontlines because these other folks muddle the message causing a knee jerk reaction against anything that smells of a nationalist agenda. Some family members on my dad's side are involved in Gilani's Afghan Mellat and even they are surprised at the hardline language that spews out of ANP and step back a little. The general assumption that occurs in even mildly religious Afghans when they hear these folks (take brother Graveyard as an example) is that here is another group of Najibists.

I think the success of Afghan Mellat even rests in its no comment on secularism and religion in general after the pro Khalqis were eliminated after the Afghan-Russo war. Now they are just generally rabid anti Tajik and Anti uzbeks/Pro Pashtun domination.

[BLS_1919v2.0]

Fair enough, but I think, if you are native to the region and live there they need folks like you at the frontlines because these other folks muddle the message causing a knee jerk reaction against anything that smells of a nationalist agenda. Some family members on my dad's side are involved in Gilani's Afghan Mellat and even they are surprised at the hardline language that spews out of ANP and step back a little. The general assumption that occurs in even mildly religious Afghans when they hear these folks (take brother Graveyard as an example) is that here is another group of Najibists.

I think the success of Afghan Mellat even rests in its no comment on secularism and religion in general after the pro Khalqis were eliminated after the Afghan-Russo war. Now they are just generally rabid anti Tajik and Anti uzbeks/Pro Pashtun domination.

Wrora the past thirty years Pashtuns saw major changes, amongst it there was times of polarization ( we see it on this forum as well even if both sides believe in unity), bitterness, war, etc etc etc. These things take a toll and have had an impact on how our people view certain individuals or politics. I worry about knee-jerk reactions as well, although I don't think it is fair to rest this entirely on ANP's shoulders. ANP has done wrong and have at times even shot themselves in the foot, but it is not entirely their fault. ANP has been classified as the hindu party, congress supporters, kaffirs, commies, etc. This has led to some of the knee-jerk reactions. Again we should try to lay blame when it is due.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

Wrora the past thirty years Pashtuns saw major changes, amongst it there was times of polarization ( we see it on this forum as well even if both sides believe in unity), bitterness, war, etc etc etc. These things take a toll and have had an impact on how our people view certain individuals or politics. I worry about knee-jerk reactions as well, although I don't think it is fair to rest this entirely on ANP's shoulders. ANP has done wrong and have at times even shot themselves in the foot, but it is not entirely their fault. ANP has been classified as the hindu party, congress supporters, kaffirs, commies, etc. This has led to some of the knee-jerk reactions. Again we should try to lay blame when it is due.

Well I would say that that famous picture of Achekzai with Najib and his followup picture with Karzai subsequently does nothing to improve that image and appears to validate quiet a bit of the criticism. Ajmal Khattak's love affair with Najib's Kabul was also not lost on us.

[BLS_1919v2.0]

Well I would say that that famous picture of Achekzai with Najib and his followup picture with Karzai subsequently does nothing to improve that image and appears to validate quiet a bit of the criticism. Ajmal Khattak's love affair with Najib's Kabul was also not lost on us.

That was not what I was hinting at. ANP and PKMAP love for Najibullah is well known. Every year they have a remembrance for him in Peshawar and Quetta. ANP and PKMAP are pro-karzai since they have based their politics on the events of 1990. When Pakistan adopted its policy in Afghanistan (success or failure) this has influenced on how they see Pakistan and subsequently Taliban. So for them, these are interferences from Pakistan's ISI and this in turn puts them in a compromising spot.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

That was not what I was hinting at. ANP and PKMAP love for Najibullah is well known. Every year they have a remembrance for him in Peshawar and Quetta. ANP and PKMAP are pro-karzai since they have based their politics on the events of 1990. When Pakistan adopted its policy in Afghanistan (success or failure) this has influenced on how they see Pakistan and subsequently Taliban. So for them, these are interferences from Pakistan's ISI and this in turn puts them in a compromising spot.

They would do better to take a page from your book and call for a clearn slate approach. They ought to leave behind these silly mantras and nearly religious devotion to some mission statement based purely on secularism. No Pashtuns will accept interest based systems etc. openly in their area. These people have to learn to comprimise or they will continue to look like a lunatic fringe.

[BLS_1919v2.0]

^^I think that advice should go around the table in terms of political parties especially the political agents of FATA and MMA.