A salute to the brave massess of North Africa

[Baygham]

I was following events in libya and earlier in tunisia and eygpt. For the first time if someone identifies me with them, I will be proud, not ashamed. They have a long way to go to dream land, but hey they are taking the first few steps. Bravo.

Whats wrong with what is happening in eygpt and the rest of north africa. The world is changing guys, even the arabs dont want khalifah abdullah from riyadh giving orders from lavish billion dollar mansions, they want an equal playing field.

Coptic christens, hand in hand, with sunni, shia, muslim brotherhood, aspiring for a future. Though it may turn sour at any moment, lets enjoy this most joyous moment in history. A moment of liberation of the human spirit.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

I was following events in libya and earlier in tunisia and eygpt. For the first time if someone identifies me with them, I will be proud, not ashamed. They have a long way to go to dream land, but hey they are taking the first few steps. Bravo.

Whats wrong with what is happening in eygpt and the rest of north africa. The world is changing guys, even the arabs dont want khalifah abdullah from riyadh giving orders from lavish billion dollar mansions, they want an equal playing field.

Coptic christens, hand in hand, with sunni, shia, muslim brotherhood, aspiring for a future. Though it may turn sour at any moment, lets enjoy this most joyous moment in history. A moment of liberation of the human spirit.

Sorry to rain on your parade lol. Evidence brother... logic and evidence. Bring it to the table and shelve the opinions.

Bin Laden Does a Happy Dance

February 14, 2011
Michael Scheuer [2]

Osama bin Laden thought the mujahedin had seen the last of Marxist-like thinkers in 1980s Afghanistan where the “inevitability” of communism’s world mastery proved illusory. To his surprise and joy, however, this sort of mental malady reappeared with a vengeance this month as the woefully uneducated West cheered democracy’s “inevitable” advance in Egypt.
From CNN to FOX to BBC, journalists performed as weepy, ahistorical cheerleaders, describing crowds of Jeffersonian Egyptians filling Tahrir Square to replicate the events of Philadelphia in 1776 and 1787. And then
— Mubarak left and democracy was installed! The unfinished republican project Americans have labored on for 800 years since Runnymede was completed in Egypt in only 18 days. We live in an age of wonders.

Is this analysis flawed? Is the argument’s logic weak? Well no, certainly not. Egypt is what it is, as the saying goes. In a time of economic crisis, political chaos, and looming violence, 80 million Egyptians grasped an alien, long-detested ideology called “secular democracy,” turning their collective back on the Islam that heretofore graced and ordered their lives, and gave them the will and courage to patiently resist Mubarak’s tyranny and rely on God’s promise of victory. They swapped Allah for paganism in just eighteen days. Why, my goodness, Katie Couric said so, didn’t she?
Well, back in his Afghan cave Osama bin Laden knows better, not having benefited from an Ivy League education. Indeed, if Salifism allows such things, Brother Osama is doing the Happy Dance. Bin Laden, his lieutenants, and their allies know that after the Western media returns to what it does best — isn’t Lindsey Lohan due in court? — Muslim Egyptians will be reaching for Allah’s rope, not Facebook’s self-deification. And the Islamists also will know the stout wall of U.S.-and-Israeli-supported Arab tyranny they have long attacked is cracking.

When the West sees pious Egyptians moving toward Islam, not secular democracy, bin Laden will have thanked God for His gifts to the mujahedin. Having designated Arab police states and Israel as Islam’s main enemies — brain-dead America simply being in the way due to its money and guns — bin Laden et. al. now see the ruins of the strongest Arab tyranny, as well as the most loyal, least demanding ally secured by Washington‘s relentless intervention in the Muslim world. They know whatever regime follows Mubarak will be weaker, more influenced by those demanding a form of Sharia law — including General Clapper’s Kiwanis-in-waiting, the Muslim Brotherhood — and, being a democracy, more representative of Egyptians’ deep, abiding hatred for Israel.

With one tyranny dished, bin Laden also will know Israel is thigh deep in disaster. Israel’s physical security long depended on repression by the Levant’s three border-controlling tyrannies: Egypt, Syria, and Jordan. After all, look at the trouble Israel gets from Lebanon’s fitfully representative political system. Now, Israel faces Jeffersonian Egypt, which, to reflect popular will, must be less “friendly” toward it, less willing to seal its Gaza border, and unwilling to kill Egyptians trying to aid Palestinians. Perhaps the West missed the anti-Mubarak posters showing David’s star burned into his forehead. And perhaps that’s because few Western journalists explained the hard truth that Mubarak was hated not just for repression and joblessness, but because he dealt with Israel and persecuted Egyptians for their faith.

So for bin Laden and all Islamist leaders, happy days are here. Through no actions of their own, their most potent Arab foe disappeared at the hands of their other erstwhile enemies, the United States and its allies. They can now exploit the Egyptian debacle knowing that, as they do so, Washington will be further weakened economically as the new Egyptian regime begs funds to rebuild — and hints it will take Saudi money if U.S. taxpayers are not shaken down — and the Israel-suborned Congress ships great batches of taxpayer funds to Israel for a military and border-control build-up to cope with Egyptian democracy and prepare for Israel’s other two indispensable tyrants — Jordan’s Abdullah and Syria’s al-Asad — going Mubarak‘s way.

As ever, the wages of U.S. intervention are dire. After intervening for 30-plus years to support Mubarak and allow Israel’s every whim, Washington now finds itself headed toward more intervention in a probably useless attempt to rebalance the Potemkin political “system” its intervention helped create. Like an umpire trying to make up for a bad call, Washington’s forthcoming intervention will spread the Egyptian disaster and undermine U.S. security; only bin Laden and the Islamists will benefit.
Perhaps a reading of General Washington’s Farewell Address is in order?

[ScimitarXEdge]

That might be true if Prince Abdullah was head of the Khilafah; but a Khilafah is not a stooge of some pink faced baboons; the Khilafah has too much merit to be associated with that.

make note that the parties that do ultimately want a global Islamic Unity are making gains headways, you're right it's a joyous occassion, now it's time for true liberty, both of the mind and of the body.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

Heres another one for you to munch on and rebut... cheers!:

Tunisia, Egypt, and Yemen: Moving toward Islam and away from the West

By Michael Scheuer

The bankruptcy of America’s ideological and unrealistic educational system — especially its universities — has seldom been on better display than during this period of unrest in the Muslim world. For the most part, the well-educated folks offering analysis on television seem befuddled that anyone could think that the mass protests in Tunisia, Egypt, and Yemen have anything remotely to do with religion. No, say they, the unrest is the result of poverty, oppression, and a dozen other things, but it has nothing to do with Islam.

Well, no. While the immediate spark for events in Tunisia, Egypt, and Yemen came from poverty, oppression, etc, the ultimate cause is the unIslamic nature of the dictatorial governments that long have ruled the three states in question. Each regime has used the rhetoric of Islam in public statements and the methodology of European Fascism as its instrument of government. On this point the Neoconservatives were absolutely right: The Muslim world is rife with Islamofascists. What the Necons deliberately failed to add to this truism is that the Islamofascists are not found among the mujahedin, but rather man the Arab regimes that Washington, many of its Western allies, and Israel have supported for several decades.

Thus the uprisings now occurring are anti-fascist, but they are a nowhere near pro-democracy, at least in the Western sense. The international media’s propensity — especially strong in the BBC and CNN — for finding what it lusts to find is on prominent display as they seek out protesters in Cairo and elsewhere who speak English, are middle-class professionals, and wax eloquent with admiration for the West. Having found this “evidence” the media then extrapolate from what must be regarded as a rather small sample and declare that Americans are watching “We the people” movements on the Arab streets. (We have seen this absurd species of extrapolation frequently in recent years when U.S.-led military coalitions have success in one small- or medium-sized Iraqi or Afghan village and it is portrayed by the media as a nationwide trend.)

From Chris Matthews to Katie Couric to General Wesley Clark flows the nonsense they were trained to believe at university: The triumph of secularism, democracy, and globalization are inevitable and those that stand in the way are anachronistic expendables. General Clark, on Saturday, went so far as to tell FOX viewers that after Mubarak leaves Egypt there will be “some kind of an election” — presumably with Western observers — and that an international commission must be established to investigate the Egyptian government’s corruption.

In other words, the U.S. and Western interventionism that has supported Islamofascists for 50 years should now be revved up to intervene to teach our unwashed Arab brothers how to vote, be honest, and allow power to be passed from the dictator Mubarak to an unIslamic, unrepresentative, and tiny group of secularized Muslims who shave, admire Jefferson, and have little truck with that Islam stuff.
From Matthews on the left, to Clark on the right, to Press Secretary Robert Gibbs in the ever-hopeful-if-reality-defying heart of the Obama-Clinton fantasy world, the answer to a problem that has been partially wrought by U.S. and Western intervention on the side of tyranny is more and more intervention to again deny power to the majority. We should all be wondering how long the United States can survive the handiwork of the professors who “educated” this generation of U.S. leaders to be certain of the blessed inevitability of universal, pagan, and non-violent
Westernization of the entire globe, a sort of a leftist, atheist, libertine Khalifate.

What seems lost in the wishing-makes-it-so fog of this “analysis” is the fact that nearly one-hundred percent of the Tunisians, Egyptians, and Yemenis we see on the street — indeed, all except the Westernized handful Matthews, Couric, and Clark want power passed to — are Muslim believers who not only want to improve their living and political conditions, but likewise want Islam to play a far larger role in governance, a role they believe will be lead to far less oppressive regimes. It is absolutely true that the Tunisian, Egyptian, and Yemeni dictators are hated by their peoples from imposing brutal repression, but they are also hated for limiting the role of Islam in government and their persecution of those Islamic scholars, preachers, and militants who have struggled to defend their faith. (Parenthetically, the government of our Republic under both parties long has used taxpayer funds to intervene in Tunisia, Egypt, and Yemen to encourage regime stability and so has facilitated both varieties of oppression. This may limit the pro-U.S. sentiment of any successor regime in these three states.)

At day’s end it is unclear whether Egypt’s Mubarak or Yemen’s Salih will fall, or whether the new Tunisian regime will be anything other than a more efficient dictatorship than the one it replaced. Fascist regimes, after all, have protected themselves by systematically disarming their citizenry and have little concern for anything save holding onto power. (NB: On the last point, they are like the two U.S. political parties.)

The Islamofascist regimes also know that the pro-democracy bark of Washington and its NATO allies is likely to be far worse than their bite because the existence of the regimes is necessary for the survival of Israel. It is the vigorously brutal oppression of the Mubaraks, Abdullahs (Jordan and Saudi Arabia), and Bashirs of the Arab world that controls borders contiguous with Israel and keeps a lid on hundreds of millions of Muslims who seethe with a desire to exact wide and lethal retribution for what they see as Israel’s theft, on-going occupation, and unfolding annexation of Muslim land.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

I was following events in libya and earlier in tunisia and eygpt. For the first time if someone identifies me with them, I will be proud, not ashamed. They have a long way to go to dream land, but hey they are taking the first few steps. Bravo.

Whats wrong with what is happening in eygpt and the rest of north africa. The world is changing guys, even the arabs dont want khalifah abdullah from riyadh giving orders from lavish billion dollar mansions, they want an equal playing field.

Coptic christens, hand in hand, with sunni, shia, muslim brotherhood, aspiring for a future. Though it may turn sour at any moment, lets enjoy this most joyous moment in history. A moment of liberation of the human spirit.

And of course, finally the polling data form University of Maryland that supports what Michael wrote above:

http://www.publicpolicy.umd.edu/sppu...0and%20America

"Majorities in most Muslim countries continue to have a negative view of the US and to perceive the US as seeking to dominate the Muslim world, to undermine Islam and to impose Western culture."

"These surveys do however suggest that there is a kind of internal clash of civilizations or at least some tension of civilizations. For example while large majorities support the principle that will of the people should be the basis of authority for government; majorities also support the notion that shari'a should be the basis for government and that a group of Islamic scholars should be able to vet laws."



Remember, Baygham Khan, evidence trumps emotion everytime.... everytime. The poll is high powered (with a large N sample size) and was not conducted by Al Qaeda members or the Musharraf government. Have fun with this.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

Oh and in case you attempt to discredit it here is the information from the first paragrah:

Author Dr. Steven Kull

"Over the last six years I have been conducting a major study of public opinion in the Muslim world. This study included conducting focus groups in six majority Muslim countries and numerous surveys in ten of them, including all of the major ones. It also included a comprehensive analysis of surveys conducted by other organizations."

[Baygham]

BA, whats your problem, you appear in the manic phase of some affective disorder dude, calm down. Relax, let a brother savor a rare moment in history for two minutes, before you ruin it with nonsense gibberish. If I wanted to read gibberish, i would subscribe to it myself.

dont you get it, a liberated youth in eygpt is not going for taliban style islam. He wants his style of islam, with freedom of expression, with a little dance a little music, a little interaction between the sexes, a tolerance of minorities. Taliban islam is a dictatorial imposition, a newly freed youth is going to settle for that, are you kidding me. With that Islam I have no problem. I dont even have a problem with a head scarf, hey its your head, or the moustage less beard, what ever sir, be happy. Just dont shove it down, those that are our brother and sisters and dont want it. That does mean no public laws based on one or the other sect.

This is the start of islamic reformation. A most joyous moment in history, one that is 500 years late, but hey better late than never.

Now I dont see us in pashtoon land yet at the level to be ready for reformation, may be not in afghanistan but parts of pukhtunkhwa are not far away. I will have my fingers crossed.

Sorry to burst your bubble SX, no khalifah is coming to eygpt or tunisia for at least a few centuries now. Soon libya, hopefully the others will follow, oh I am getting giddy with excitement.

[Admin Khan]

BarakzaiAbdali,
In my opinion whatever happens in Egypt, the US will make sure it serves its interests. After all, the US provides $ to the Egyptian Armed forces. There are even reports that the US funded these "protests".

[BarakzaiAbdali]

BarakzaiAbdali,
In my opinion whatever happens in Egypt, the US will make sure it serves its interests. After all, the US provides $ to the Egyptian Armed forces. There are even reports that the US funded these "protests".

I dont know about funding the protests... but I 100% agree with you that the armed services, similar to the situation in Pakistan, are US funded. The fact that policy internally has not changed but the face of leadership has appears to be supported by what Mike points out above at the end of his excellent pieces:

"At day’s end it is unclear whether Egypt’s Mubarak or Yemen’s Salih will fall, or whether the new Tunisian regime will be anything other than a more efficient dictatorship than the one it replaced. Fascist regimes, after all, have protected themselves by systematically disarming their citizenry and have little concern for anything save holding onto power. (NB: On the last point, they are like the two U.S. political parties.)

The Islamofascist regimes also know that the pro-democracy bark of Washington and its NATO allies is likely to be far worse than their bite because the existence of the regimes is necessary for the survival of Israel. It is the vigorously brutal oppression of the Mubaraks, Abdullahs (Jordan and Saudi Arabia), and Bashirs of the Arab world that controls borders contiguous with Israel and keeps a lid on hundreds of millions of Muslims who seethe with a desire to exact wide and lethal retribution for what they see as Israel’s theft, on-going occupation, and unfolding annexation of Muslim land.

As ever, the wages of U.S. intervention are dire. After intervening for 30-plus years to support Mubarak and allow Israel’s every whim, Washington now finds itself headed toward more intervention in a probably useless attempt to rebalance the Potemkin political “system” its intervention helped create. Like an umpire trying to make up for a bad call, Washington’s forthcoming intervention will spread the Egyptian disaster and undermine U.S. security; only bin Laden and the Islamists will benefit.
Perhaps a reading of General Washington’s Farewell Address is in order?"

[BarakzaiAbdali]

BA, whats your problem, you appear in the manic phase of some affective disorder dude, calm down. Relax, let a brother savor a rare moment in history for two minutes, before you ruin it with nonsense gibberish. If I wanted to read gibberish, i would subscribe to it myself.

dont you get it, a liberated youth in eygpt is not going for taliban style islam. He wants his style of islam, with freedom of expression, with a little dance a little music, a little interaction between the sexes, a tolerance of minorities. Taliban islam is a dictatorial imposition, a newly freed youth is going to settle for that, are you kidding me. With that Islam I have no problem. I dont even have a problem with a head scarf, hey its your head, or the moustage less beard, what ever sir, be happy. Just dont shove it down, those that are our brother and sisters and dont want it. That does mean no public laws based on one or the other sect.

This is the start of islamic reformation. A most joyous moment in history, one that is 500 years late, but hey better late than never.

Now I dont see us in pashtoon land yet at the level to be ready for reformation, may be not in afghanistan but parts of pukhtunkhwa are not far away. I will have my fingers crossed.

Sorry to burst your bubble SX, no khalifah is coming to eygpt or tunisia for at least a few centuries now. Soon libya, hopefully the others will follow, oh I am getting giddy with excitement.

That is why no one takes you seriously... because you cannot provide evidence, logic, or historical precedent. In your world those are gibberish.. which is fine because then you validate the idea that you are really on par with the kalaay koorwala more than someone whose word matters.

Note that the U of M poll says as much, but it places emphasis on the Islamic character of what is wanted by the people. You attempt, true to your nonevidence based fashion, to distort this into a clear win for secularist democracy... which also true to your history of posting, as an emotional, illogical, and nonevidence based construct of reality.

"These surveys do however suggest that there is a kind of internal clash of civilizations or at least some tension of civilizations. For example while large majorities support the principle that will of the people should be the basis of authority for government; majorities also support the notion that shari'a should be the basis for government and that a group of Islamic scholars should be able to vet laws."

[ScimitarXEdge]

based on the goings on, I see this as a perfect opportunity of a new Islamic revival, let's hope and do our part to push things in the right direction.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

That is why no one takes you seriously... because you cannot provide evidence, logic, or historical precedent. In your world those are gibberish.. which is fine because then you validate the idea that you are really on par with the kalaay koorwala more than someone whose word matters.

Note that the U of M poll says as much, but it places emphasis on the Islamic character of what is wanted by the people. You attempt, true to your nonevidence based fashion, to distort this into a clear win for secularist democracy... which also true to your history of posting, as an emotional, illogical, and nonevidence based construct of reality.

"These surveys do however suggest that there is a kind of internal clash of civilizations or at least some tension of civilizations. For example while large majorities support the principle that will of the people should be the basis of authority for government; majorities also support the notion that shari'a should be the basis for government and that a group of Islamic scholars should be able to vet laws."

Actually I take a part of this back... because the village woman also has a realistic outlook on her environment and does not chase Quixotic Windmills.

[شمله ور خراساني]

based on the goings on, I see this as a perfect opportunity of a new Islamic revival, let's hope and do our part to push things in the right direction.

revival of what kind of Islam?

[ScimitarXEdge]

revival of what kind of Islam?

the genuine Islam bro, not the obsessing about how long someone's beard is and whether every strand of a woman's hair is under her hijab type.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

the genuine Islam bro, not the obsessing about how long someone's beard is and whether every strand of a woman's hair is under her hijab type.

I know its wierd, if Baygham actually read what you wrote and read closely he would not be psychologically splitting you into one category of people that ipso facto support the Taliban. I do not know where in any of the postings either the two of us have made have we supported a Taliban emirate spanning from sea to shining sea.