Imran Khan insults Pashtuns and Hameed Gul calls Pashtuns a specie

[tor_khan]

Here's my response to matters raised in this and the other thread where I was asked to comment.

I listened to both clips and I'm not surprised in the slightest, quite sadly. Both view Pashtoons through a lens that is inherently tainted. They take the stereotype and being the personalities that they are do significant damage by adding their backing to it.

The Pakistani media gives voice to these kinds of opinions daily. And whilst we're talking about media, consider the bigger player - Bollywood. For all their glitzy-night-club dances, alter-liberalism and beach-wear, they are equally guilty of dressing up a has-been actor in "shalwar kameez" and giving him a hideout up some mountain slope; with a pakol and an AK47 for added villainy. That impression of Pashtoons is deepy rooted in Indic thinking. Sure when India helps out Afghanistan, it's nice and I think it's fair to say that the heart and sole of the Indian masses would not hurt the Afghans, but let us also admit, quite frankly, that there is a warped historical opinion of Pashtoons that is evidenced in centuries of literature and other media.

Pakistan today is just a convenient buffer and being India's little baby, has simply inherited those traits. When India and Afghanistan were joined, the people of the plains, the rulers, the intellectual classes and later the British overlords saw us in just the same light as the two speakers here do. We were the violent crack-head baffoons who were into banditry and if tamed slightly, could be made just about loyal enough to being recruited to guard their palace doors.

Akhrot, gharam-dimagh/hot-heads, pathan etc. are just some of the names applied and we all know that we are the butt of their jokes. Occasionally we were extended a little kindness, so we have been called brave and chivalrous and people who stick to their word.

I don't expect this to change immediately, because if Imran and Hamid are our Pashtoon brothers then so is this list: Pashtun diaspora - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia. Which one of this notable list works to our benefit? Our present state means that the attrition rate - that is losing Pashtoons to other "cultures" if you like, must be higher than the "recruitment" rate - that is being able to extend ourselves outwards, culturally speaking and bring "in" people with positive opinions about us.

Our response in the modern day, perhaps, needs to be a strong, formidable counter media because that is how influence is won. On a positive, I think we are beginning to see the growth of this slowly. There's still considerable work to be done, but here's where I would like to thank Admin Khan a million times over for making that step. You know Admin and I talk and his vision - which is to present a positive image of Pashtoons, first of all to Pashtoons themselves, and then to the wider world, is a vision I completely share.

Today, as in the past, we Pashtoons are sometimes not the best commercials for ourselves, but in a media-slick world of good-news-politics what we say and do is crucial and finding a way to project that positively sends out to the world a very powerful message. Consider popular perceptions of the Chinese, the rise of India or the way that Japanese technologies, European classical musicians and English literature has shaped world views of these societies today (all societies have serious negatives too). Today, as in the past, we Pashtoons have some incredible people amongst us - we have scientists, writers, musicians, craftsmen, educators, honest-to-goodness, hard-workers. That's nothing something to be ashamed of, and everything to be proud of. We simply need to engage the tools of the modern media to show it as such.

[pir_Rokhan]

The comments of Hamid Gul despite his anti Afghan character which has been exposed by wikileaks recently, are NOT humiliating but complimentry. Rare species is not used in derogatory terms as is clear from his following sentence in which he concludes that he likes Afghans. He means it in letter and spirit due to 2 reasons.

1) He knows that it was Afghans who "saved" the empire of his masters [Punjabis] in reality due to their rare qualities of bravery [a bravery which has always been unfortunately used as a cannon fodder by other nations like Mongols, Mughal, British, American ,Punjabis etc to their own benefit]. However it was him who sent suicide bombers to Afghanistan and asked the Taliban to set Kabul ablaze [Wikileaks].

2) Hamid Gul's wife is also an Afghan.

The statement of Imran Khan is condemnable. I am sending a copy of my letter of condemnation to Toramana khor too. I would suggest it is better to send various letters to PTI site to intensify the reaction to his comments.

[r3alist]

is diplomatic communique an irrefutable fact now??

[Wrayun]

Everything you need to know about Hamid Gul and his family and wife, both claim decent from Yousafzai.

Interview:

Hamid Gul Interview | PKonweb

[Toramana]

Wrayun, following is the information about Hamid Gul.

"Hamid Gul was born on 20 November 1936 to Muhammad khan. an ethnic Bhatti Rajput, in Sargodha district of Punjab. He got his early education from his village. He briefly got admission in Government College Lahore, before reporting to Pakistan Military Academy Kakul."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamid_Gul

I don't know why is Wrayun determined proving him a Pashtun.

But if you listen to him and his wife carefully, it says all about his real origin/ethnicity, which seems a case like that of hundreds of thousands of other origin-less people, who, without any solid ethnic base for a claim to status and influence in the biradari system of the Punjab, start identifying themselves as either Moghals, Sayeds, Arabs, Pathans, Quraishis, etc.

I am quite sure many members on this forum might have encountered many such cases where a person from Punjab or any other part of India informs you he/she himself is a Pathan after uttering a few stereotypes about Pashtuns.

Now just listen to what he says about his ethnic background i.e.,

- he is a Yousafzai
-that his grandfather who was a Subedar Major went from Lahore to Sargodha where he had been granted land...

One should rather listen more carefully to what his wife tells about her ethnic background. When Dr Masood asks her where is she originally from, she informs, she is from Queta...

When Dr Masood asks her, whether she is Baluch, she is unable to tell anything explictly or immediately ...It seems as if she is unclear as who she is. So General Hamid Gul jumps in and explains, she is from Rawlakote (part of Kashmir on Punjab side)...Next General Hamid Gul informs the audience, her father brought her mother from Afghanistan and that he as well as his wife both are Yousafzais.

Now isn't it all cock's and bull's story? Look at the complex sequence of circumstances and links through which General Hamid Gul wants to establish his and his wife's ethnic background...

His wife ...... Queta (Baluchistan)->Rawlakote(Kashmir)-Afghanistan-> Yousafzai

What have Yousafzais to do with Afghanistan, Rawlkote, and Queta? It is simply laughable the unbelievable way in which he tries to connect all bits and pieces to describe the ethnic identity of his wife.

The connection, in his own case, is as complex as that of his wife's...

He himself ... Swat->Lahore(Punjab)->Sarghoda (Punjab)------> Yousazai

Now one can ask, is he able to trace his ancestry to the clan or tribe which his elders originally belonged to ? Pashtuns are proverbially famous for mainaining tribal/clan links and connection to ancestral places even if they go to far off places.

In all probability, General Hamid Gul is one of those identityless, rootless, and clanless people in a social system based on the concept of biradari who start claiming a foreign identity for social recognition. From his features, he seems a Gujar, possibly of Kashmiri descent. Most likely, his grandfather was common man from Lahore who after recruitment in British military and acquiring land in Sarghoda, started searching for an identity and came up with this Yousafzai/ Pathan story.

[r3alist]

what a cutting incisive analysis toramana.

you used stone cold facts in such a succinct way that your argument is irrefutable, completely flawless, its watertight and majestic in its brilliance.

btw, what tribe are you from? what village do you live in?

[r3alist]

what a cutting incisive analysis toramana.

you used stone cold facts in such a succinct way that your argument is irrefutable, completely flawless, its watertight and majestic in its brilliance, truly awesome and spectacular, as you can tell i am lost for words.

btw, what tribe are you from? what village do you live in?

[pir_Rokhan]

Neither the Pashtun ancestry nor its absence thereof can spare anyone from facing the consequence of one's malicious designs against the interests of Pashtun/Afghan nation. Any one's criminal acts irrespective of one's ethncity against Pashtuns/ Afghans in the past or present can neither be forgotten nor forgiven. Instead of defending or offending the stereotypes in Pakistani Politics, it will be wise to utilise them for promoting the Pashtun/Afghan cause in one way or another as they are the bye products of historic process. It is true for Imran Khan or Hamid Gul as well as anyone else.

[r3alist]

Any one's criminal acts against Pashtuns/ Afghans irrespective of one's ethncity in the past or present can neither be forgotten nor forgiven

spoken like a true pashtun, its heart warming.

[Toramana]

what a cutting incisive analysis toramana.

you used stone cold facts in such a succinct way that your argument is irrefutable, completely flawless, its watertight and majestic in its brilliance.

btw, what tribe are you from? what village do you live in?

If I claim I am from a tribe from Mars, what other way you have to establish the verocity of my claim except what I have done in the case of General Hamid Gul and his wife?

Wouldn't you rely on basic fact or circumstancial evidence ?

Instead of spitting out this gibbirish, go and question what I have said with logic.

Thanks Mr REA-List

[Wrayun]

Wrayun, following is the information about Hamid Gul.

I don't know why is Wrayun determined proving him a Pashtun.

Mara instead of always jumping the gun, horse, or bridge, it's best to keep your assumptions to yourself. I didn't post the link to prove he was "Pashtun", I could careless what he thinks he is or what you think he is. Just wanted to share the link. I clearly stated "both claim decent from Yousafzai." I didn't say they ARE Yousafzai.

Anyways, maybe they are, maybe they are not. I have come across Yousafzai from UP India, and also Nizais, Bangash and even Afridis. These people all claim linage by blood, and that is the problem with claiming linage by blood, that you can be a PURE BLOOD PUKHTOON, while working for Indic or Parso's interests while pissing on the interests of Pukhtoons. That is also the hypocrisy of Pukhtoon diaspora, if a Pathan does something great then he is immediately a mighty PURE BLOOD brethren, but if a Pathan that they don't like they will ridcule their claim to linage. Sharukh Khan, Amir Khan, Salman Khan, Imran Khan, Amjid Khan, Qadir Khan, and all the other descendants of Pathans by blood are sometimes adored as fellow brethren or other times ridiculed.

Har sook war ke baba jor da, kala yu na we che Pukhtoon nada kala bal na.

Personally it doesn't matter what you or I think, Hamid Gul has more influence over Pukhtoons than we can dream of. His one phone call can make our lives back home in our own Pukhtoon villages hell at the hands of our PURE BRETHREN.

[Toramana]

Wrayuna, Bacha lag frustrated shanai yai, bacha da jang mung la ra la gharai dai, khwa ka da haraai darjai pukhthana mo khalak ganri, aow yar dasai sa khabara nishtha...da mara zamunga hasai sensitivity da, aow bacah daltha soomra sensitivities di, pak, afgh, etc. etc. let us live with it...

[Yousafzai Pakhtun]

Imran khan said this one month ago at our college while inaugurating of imran khan welfare organization AMC.
After his speech, while talking with my classfellows, i condemned imran khan for encouraging of pashtuns in the form of talibans...they started counter-arguements, outcome was nothing.

He has given many statements like this in the past and that is why i consider his party as the political wing of Talibghwan.....

[Orzala]

Isnt Imran Khan half pashtun himself??

He's not half, he's full. But his family settled in Pakistan, that's why he's considered a Pakistani.

[r3alist]

If I claim I am from a tribe from Mars, what other way you have to establish the verocity of my claim except what I have done in the case of General Hamid Gul and his wife?

Wouldn't you rely on basic fact or circumstancial evidence ?

Instead of spitting out this gibbirish, go and question what I have said with logic.

Thanks Mr REA-List

i am glad you mentioned circumstantial evidence because your whole post was based on circumstantial evidence, what facts do you have?

it seems like none, therefore its just the rambling of a dull minded fantasist.