History of Wahabyat,, Read

[ډګروال]

No its not Yes or No question, because there are lot of labels which people use without having any idea what they represent. I am Muslim because it is the name which Allah uses for people who follow Him and His Last Prophet Muhammad pbuh.
i don't know what term "wahabi" means for you? because Wahabi word was invented by British when they couldn't fight with Muslims in battle field and to break unity of muslims they invented term Wahabi and associated certain beliefs which were not right with Wahabis and this way they cut muslims power and they started fighting arguing within.
So i Call myself Muslim though i am very deficient in my practice(May Allah have mercy) but i know what are accurate fundamental beliefs of Islam.

anyone can claim this but im talking about modern day neo salafis also labeled wahabis. They sure pass judgement on muslims and in many instances pretend as if they have already won the key to paradise. some even went as far as to do takfir on imam abu hanifa.

[Karachi]

zamurd, give your lectures to the Al Saud family dumbass, they are your leaders anyways, and the quranic qoutes you are giving have nothing to do with what I said. you are just a brainwashed fool

[Manzareh]

^ I was confused aswel with the random quotes he put as replies for you. Maybe he doesn't have an answer so that is his way of avoiding your questions.

[zamurd]

anyone can claim this but im talking about modern day neo salafis also labeled wahabis. They sure pass judgement on muslims and in many instances pretend as if they have already won the key to paradise. some even went as far as to do takfir on imam abu hanifa.

if u were living in Hazrat Umer rzt era, How will you describe you following which version of Islam?

[ډګروال]

if u were living in Hazrat Umer rzt era, How will you describe you following which version of Islam?

there is only one version so i dont know what you are talking about.

[zamurd]

there is only one version so i dont know what you are talking about.

i told you earlier too, i follow "that Version" of Islam which LAST Prophet Muhammad pbuh preached practiced and which His Companions Sahaba e Karam followed and put in practice of FOUR rightly guided KHULFA e Karam Abu Bakar, Unmer, Uthman and Ali rtz. Since now we have many versions of islam looking at people who all claim they are on right path and we have so many sects.

[Hurr]

So innocent of the OP, to his myopic mind only his own version, wahabiyat (which is denounced by bulk ehl e Sunnah) is the righteous, as he being a kid dont know the history of how this Najdi fitnah came into being.

What a shame those believing Allah to be having man like body, sitting on a throne
claim to be following the Shariah of Muhammad s.a.w.w undiluted, and keep on distributing the certificated of kufr.

As someone already said it is a curse, which has harmed humanity to unimaginable
degree, and brought shame to the name of Islam. This curse has trampled peace of many lands, put to sword many innocent souls.

My prayer to Allah is "Rid us of this curse for good."

[Badlun]

So innocent of the OP, to his myopic mind only his own version, wahabiyat (which is denounced by bulk ehl e Sunnah) is the righteous, as he being a kid dont know the history of how this Najdi fitnah came into being.

What a shame those believing Allah to be having man like body, sitting on a throne
claim to be following the Shariah of Muhammad s.a.w.w undiluted, and keep on distributing the certificated of kufr.

As someone already said it is a curse, which has harmed humanity to unimaginable
degree, and brought shame to the name of Islam. This curse has trampled peace of many lands, put to sword many innocent souls.

My prayer to Allah is "Rid us of this curse for good."

The problem is that Wahabis prove all their beliefs and practices from Quran and Hadith as well as from the early days of the 4 caliphs. This hand of God issue(anthropomorphism) is proved from the verse of Quran

yadulale alal juma'a= hand of God is with(upon) group

If you say this Hand is metaphorical not literal, then every word of Quran can be metaphorical or idiomatic and not literal. Then Salat can be just prayer not the formal ritual of prayer etc.

[Hurr]

The problem is that Wahabis prove all their beliefs and practices from Quran and Hadith as well as from the early days of the 4 caliphs. This hand of God issue(anthropomorphism) is proved from the verse of Quran

yadulale alal juma'a= hand of God is with(upon) group

If you say this Hand is metaphorical not literal, then every word of Quran can be metaphorical or idiomatic and not literal. Then Salat can be just prayer not the formal ritual of prayer etc.

This is not the problem, this is disbelief.

Never can anthropomorphism be proved from Quran and Hadith.
Never was this belief held by Holy Prophet, Shabah, and Tabie'en.
Salat may be considered metaphorical if we were not explicitly
taught by Muhammad saww what it is and how it is prayed.

Anthropomorphism is limiting Allah to one's perception (Human Perception) of which Almighty is free.

[Badlun]

This is not the problem, this is disbelief.

Never can anthropomorphism be proved from Quran and Hadith.
Never was this belief held by Holy Prophet, Shabah, and Tabie'en.
Salat may be considered metaphorical if we were not explicitly
taught by Muhammad saww what it is and how it is prayed.

Anthropomorphism is limiting Allah to one's perception (Human Perception) of which Almighty is free.

Then what does this mean in Quran and hadith given below ?

"which Our hands have fashioned" [35:71]

"whom I have created with My two hands" [38:75]

The hand of Allah is over their hands.(48:10)

"Today We forget you as you have forgotten this day of yours" (Qur'an 45:34),

Kitab al-sunna page 301 of the first volume that "when He Most Blessed and Exalted sits on the Kursi, a squeak is heard like the squeak of a new leather saddle"; or on page 294 of the same volume: "Allah wrote the Torah for Moses with His hand while leaning back on a rock, on tablets of pearl, and the screech of the quill could be heard. There was no veil between Him and him," or the hadith on page 510 of the second volume: "The angels were created from the light of His two elbows and chest,"

Warning of the Antichrist (al-Masih al-Dajjal), who in the Last Days will come forth and claim to be God; of which the Prophet (Allah bless him and give him peace) said, "Allah has sent no prophet except that he warned his people of the One Eyed Liar, and that he is one-eyed—and that your Lord is not one-eyed—and that he shall have unbeliever (kafir) written between his two eyes" (Sahih al-Bukhari, 8.172).

Sahih Al-Bukhari HadithHadith 5.147 Narrated byJabir
I heard the Prophet saying,

"The Throne (of Allah) shook at the death of Sad bin Muadh."

[DSM0305]

Then what does this mean in Quran and hadith given below ?

"which Our hands have fashioned" [35:71]

I couldn't find this one

"whom I have created with My two hands" [38:75]

The hands isn't literal. It means he himself have created them.

The hand of Allah is over their hands.(48:10)

Indeed, those who pledge allegiance to you, [O Muhammad] - they are actually pledging allegiance to Allah . The hand of Allah is over their hands. So he who breaks his word only breaks it to the detriment of himself. And he who fulfills that which he has promised Allah - He will give him a great reward.
It means he will protect them/in their favor. Something along this line, but not in literal sense that his hands is over them.

"Today We forget you as you have forgotten this day of yours" (Qur'an 45:34),

This one is self given, if one reads the previous verses.

The rest you wrote also isn't literal meant. Just wanted to give examples on how it can be interpreted.

[Badlun]

I couldn't find this one



The hands isn't literal. It means he himself have created them.



Indeed, those who pledge allegiance to you, [O Muhammad] - they are actually pledging allegiance to Allah . The hand of Allah is over their hands. So he who breaks his word only breaks it to the detriment of himself. And he who fulfills that which he has promised Allah - He will give him a great reward.
It means he will protect them/in their favor. Something along this line, but not in literal sense that his hands is over them.



This one is self given, if one reads the previous verses.

The rest you wrote also isn't literal meant. Just wanted to give examples on how it can be interpreted.

This is the real enigma here. Can we interpret any part of Quran metaphorically or figuratively or idiomatically and not literally? If yes then any verse or phrase can be interpreted in a non literal way like hands of God mean power or allegiance etc.

Then Salat can mean just prayer and there is no need of the ritual of prayer but pray in any way as done by Ismailis or other esoteric sects of Islam. Then haj can mean any visit to a holy place and then saum can mean just silence not fasting.

I love this Sufi or metaphorical Quran, not the literal Quran of Wahabis where hands means hands of God as according to them Quran can only me interpreted literally.

[jankhan]

This is the real enigma here. Can we interpret any part of Quran metaphorically or figuratively or idiomatically and not literally? If yes then any verse or phrase can be interpreted in a non literal way like hands of God mean power or allegiance etc.

Then Salat can mean just prayer and there is no need of the ritual of prayer but pray in any way as done by Ismailis or other esoteric sects of Islam. Then haj can mean any visit to a holy place and then saum can mean just silence not fasting.

I love this Sufi or metaphorical Quran, not the literal Quran of Wahabis where hands means hands of God as according to them Quran can only me interpreted literally.

Everything is not black and white, There are few verses which are metaphorical but not all. And we have ijma on those verses which metaphorical. Problem solved.

[DSM0305]

This is the real enigma here. Can we interpret any part of Quran metaphorically or figuratively or idiomatically and not literally? If yes then any verse or phrase can be interpreted in a non literal way like hands of God mean power or allegiance etc.

Then Salat can mean just prayer and there is no need of the ritual of prayer but pray in any way as done by Ismailis or other esoteric sects of Islam. Then haj can mean any visit to a holy place and then saum can mean just silence not fasting.

I love this Sufi or metaphorical Quran, not the literal Quran of Wahabis where hands means hands of God as according to them Quran can only me interpreted literally.

None of us are prophets or anything of sort. So making assumption that there is a certain 'right' way is ironically wrong. That is also the reason there exists many sects or forms of Islam. It is basically a matter of interpretation.

The way I personally follow Islam, is basically showing others the way I think is correctly and explain why it is. Then whether the other person believes it or not, is up to him. I do not force my 'version' in others, but simply explain it to them and show them what my logic is based upon.

One should always be a good exemplar to non-believers, and a good exemplar to the 'other' 'sects' of Islam. At least this is how I see a good muslim regardless of their sect.

I personally don't believe everything that is written in quran is metaphorical as you put it, but certain parts where you can use your rationality to determine. Like the part of gods hand, which makes sense when converted into 'non-literal' way or metaphor if you will.

Which isn't the case with haj or salat. Where it is basically spelled out how and what to do. Nor do I personally find any spirituality, if I pray in non-ritual way. Ritual way; Body cleaned and mind focused on god, I don't think it can be more spiritual.

Yet again, I will personally not judge others the way they do it or the way they interpret Islam. I just find it as my duty as a Muslim to show others the way I think is correct, the rest is up to them.

Judging by your comments Badlun. You force your point of view of Islam upon others, which I personally find wrong. What makes you different from the very 'Islamist' you're against.

[Badlun]

Everything is not black and white, There are few verses which are metaphorical but not all. And we have ijma on those verses which metaphorical. Problem solved.

This Ijma is again a dilemma. Who gathers to decide what? Shias have their own Ijma, Sunnis there own Ijma and so on.

And in the traditional Islam as now doors of Ijtihad are now closed, I do not know of any Ijma for the last many hundreds of years.

If you know of any recent Ijma then please share the information with me. For me there is no Ijma now, and the institution of Ijma is now redundant.