About to discover who Indus Valley people were

[Iblis_Efreetzai]

the “south indian” component that showed up in high amounts in older genetic studies is actually a west asian component that was being mislabeled since it shows up in dravidians. That’s what the general consensus seems to be today. The problem was that we didn’t actually have ancient south asian dna, so all you could really see is similarities, not origins. A significant indic component in pakistani pashtuns doesn’t make sense, because most kp pashtuns are relative newcomers to the area, having migrated there from afghanistan. So unless there was some massive wave of mixing with the indic natives (and there’s no evidence for this), the pakistani pashtun population should be quite similar to the afghan one.

I mean, the indic group pashtuns usually have highest on their oracles are sindhis, which make zero sense until you realize that that’s actually because of our close relation to balochis, and that some balochis have likely migrated into and assimilated into the sindhi population.

The historical pattern of migration is into india, not out of it. So the majority of the genetic affinity between some indic groups and pashtuns is likely caused by pashtun and pashtun-like groups migrating and assimilating into the indian populace, not the other way around. Not just the indo-aryans, but later migrations as well.

This new dna might shed better light on the question. We’ll see.

Also, if you are referring to pashtuns when you say afghan, we don’t have an affinity with mongolians. Most tajiks don’t either.

pwned

[Karachi]

The “south Indian” component that showed up in high amounts in older genetic studies is actually a West Asian component that was being mislabeled since it shows up in Dravidians. That’s what the general consensus seems to be today. The problem was that we didn’t actually have ancient South Asian DNA, so all you could really see is similarities, not origins. A significant Indic component in Pakistani Pashtuns doesn’t make sense, because most KP Pashtuns are relative newcomers to the area, having migrated there from Afghanistan. So unless there was some massive wave of mixing with the Indic natives (and there’s no evidence for this), the Pakistani Pashtun population should be quite similar to the Afghan one.

I mean, the Indic group Pashtuns usually have highest on their oracles are Sindhis, which make zero sense until you realize that that’s actually because of our close relation to Balochis, and that some Balochis have likely migrated into and assimilated into the Sindhi population.

The historical pattern of migration is into India, not out of it. So the majority of the genetic affinity between some Indic groups and Pashtuns is likely caused by Pashtun and Pashtun-like groups migrating and assimilating into the Indian populace, not the other way around. Not just the Indo-Aryans, but later migrations as well.

This new DNA might shed better light on the question. We’ll see.

Also, if you are referring to Pashtuns when you say Afghan, we don’t have an affinity with Mongolians. Most Tajiks don’t either.

Pakistani pashtun still have the south east Eurasian component in new calculator. Yes less compared to the original South Indian, but still shows up at 15-20% range, which is pretty high. Afghans have much less of this. Probably at 4-5%. Also don't forget that Peshawar valley, Swat etc.. were originally indic, so the indian component must have survived, even if the pashtuns took over

[SavageCurry]

if Hindus Valley existed, it would highly likely be a homogenous population. you can't put night and day like different groups in one area and exepect them to form a stable functioning society, at least one where without some form of segregation, opression, etc., specially in ancient times. lol

Most likely the Pakistani and NW Indian region in ancient times were much less Indian genetically. That's explains Pakistanis and NW indians in general are lighter and less Indian genetically than the more subcontinental Indians.

[Karachi]

if Hindus Valley existed, it would highly likely be a homogenous population. you can't put night and day like different groups in one area and exepect them to form a stable functioning society, at least one where without some form of segregation, opression, etc., specially in ancient times. lol

Most likely the Pakistani and NW Indian region in ancient times were much less Indian genetically. That's explains Pakistanis and NW indians in general are lighter and less Indian genetically than the more subcontinental Indians.

Lol. Another selfhating pakistani, trying to be someone else then indian.

Also that only means your Punjabi ancestors were raped by outsiders. Nothing to be proud off. Punjabis are 100% indic, always were indic

[salman47]

Pakistani pashtun still have the south east Eurasian component in new calculator. Yes less compared to the original South Indian, but still shows up at 15-20% range, which is pretty high. Afghans have much less of this. Probably at 4-5%. Also don't forget that Peshawar valley, Swat etc.. were originally indic, so the indian component must have survived, even if the pashtuns took over

Really?
You know what? You are completely wrong.. I can bet 1000 USD to do a new genetic study on Pashtuns in KP and Balochistan(given that Pashtuns choose Pashtuns for the test, instead of Indo-Paks choosing the so called 'pathans'), and the result will be highly unfavorable for you!!

[Karachi]

Really?
You know what? You are completely wrong.. I can bet 1000 USD to do a new genetic study on Pashtuns in KP and Balochistan(given that Pashtuns choose Pashtuns for the test, instead of Indo-Paks choosing the so called 'pathans'), and the result will be highly unfavorable for you!!

Just go look at yourself. The pashtun samples from khurram valley and some from Swat. They show much more of South East Eurasian then Afghan samples for example. Anyways i dont have any agenda. I could care less if Pashtuns show indic or not. However Peshawar and Swat were part of Indus valley, this is why i posted this here

[salman47]

Just go look at yourself. The pashtun samples from khurram valley and some from Swat. They show much more of South East Eurasian then Afghan samples for example. Anyways i dont have any agenda. I could care less if Pashtuns show indic or not. However Peshawar and Swat were part of Indus valley, this is why i posted this here

All I am saying is that there are 'fakes' in Peshawar/Swat/'esp. Near the Indus river boundary' who claim to be Pashtun. They only fool the outsiders like you, they can't fool us Pashtuns.
And I don't think so a proper genetic study has been done on Pashtuns, since all of the outsiders are fu*king sh*t scared of setting foot in our homes. And the fact that Pashtuns are unwilling to leave their homeland(aka Pashtunistan) at all.
Which brings the genetic samples the west has in question(doubt).

[Karachi]

All I am saying is that there are 'fakes' in Peshawar/Swat/'esp. Near the Indus river boundary' who claim to be Pashtun. They only fool the outsiders like you, they can't fool us Pashtuns.
And I don't think so a proper genetic study has been done on Pashtuns, since all of the outsiders are fu*king sh*t scared of setting foot in our homes. And the fact that Pashtuns are unwilling to leave their homeland(aka Pashtunistan) at all.
Which brings the genetic samples the west has in question(doubt).

Who are those fakes? They are probably the original people of the land. Pashtuns are recent arrivals to east
of Khyber pass.

Pashtuns originally come from a cold dark environment of central asia, while us Indics are tropical people

[maneatinglizard]

Pakistani pashtun still have the south east Eurasian component in new calculator. Yes less compared to the original South Indian, but still shows up at 15-20% range, which is pretty high. Afghans have much less of this. Probably at 4-5%.

The ones I've seen were not that high, and the difference between Afghans and Pakistanis was small.

Nevertheless, even if we assume it's 15%, without ancient DNA, we can't know the directionality of the gene flow. However, given that history has recorded multiple large migrations into India, and not out of it, it's likely that any genetic affinity was caused by Pashtun and Pashtun-like groups moving into India, not the other way around.

Also don't forget that Peshawar valley, Swat etc.. were originally indic, so the indian component must have survived, even if the pashtuns took over

They would survive in the native people, not the Pashtuns that migrated and took over. The only way that native blood would've mixed into the Pashtuns would be if the native groups were fully assimilated, which I don't think has happened (but I'm not completely familiar with the history of the area, so someone like Samandri would be a better person to ask).

Just go look at yourself. The pashtun samples from khurram valley and some from Swat. They show much more of South East Eurasian then Afghan samples for example. Anyways i dont have any agenda. I could care less if Pashtuns show indic or not. However Peshawar and Swat were part of Indus valley, this is why i posted this here

See, this is what I mean by the studies being suspect. Kurram is a traditionally Pashtun area, not one of the areas with recent Pashtun migrations. Additionally, Kurram is not safe for even local Pashtuns, let alone Indian researchers, so how exactly did they manage to go there and collect the samples?

Who are those fakes? They are probably the original people of the land. Pashtuns are recent arrivals to east of Khyber pass.

If they are the original people, then they aren't Pashtuns, as you just said. So if they present themselves as Pashtuns, they'd be fakes.

[Karachi]

The ones I've seen were not that high, and the difference between Afghans and Pakistanis was small.

Nevertheless, even if we assume it's 15%, without ancient DNA, we can't know the directionality of the gene flow. However, given that history has recorded multiple large migrations into India, and not out of it, it's likely that any genetic affinity was caused by Pashtun and Pashtun-like groups moving into India, not the other way around.



They would survive in the native people, not the Pashtuns that migrated and took over. The only way that native blood would've mixed into the Pashtuns would be if the native groups were fully assimilated, which I don't think has happened (but I'm not completely familiar with the history of the area, so someone like Samandri would be a better person to ask).



See, this is what I mean by the studies being suspect. Kurram is a traditionally Pashtun area, not one of the areas with recent Pashtun migrations. Additionally, Kurram is not safe for even local Pashtuns, let alone Indian researchers, so how exactly did they manage to go there and collect the samples?



If they are the original people, then they aren't Pashtuns, as you just said. So if they present themselves as Pashtuns, they'd be fakes.

It wasnt indian researchers, but Pakistani scientists who took the dna samples from pashtuns from khurram, the results were published internationally and used by Harvard university.

Pakistani pashtuns are more indian looking, would you not agree? So it is natural to assume genetically they would have more indic in them compared to Afghans. Mixing has clearly occured in Peshawar, Swat etcc nothing really surprising about these things

[Pakthun345]

Assalamu alaykum and hello,

Your discussion is interesting. However, Pashtuns and/or Pakthuns have been in proximity with Indic and Iranic people for a long time.

I have got to disclose with you. Alhamdulilah. I have found out the true origin of Pashtuns and Pakthuns in great detail with Allahs help.

[Pakthun345]

Interesting

This is interesting.

[SavageCurry]

Lol. Another selfhating pakistani, trying to be someone else then indian.

Also that only means your Punjabi ancestors were raped by outsiders. Nothing to be proud off. Punjabis are 100% indic, always were indic

Just because my parents were from Pakistan or Punjab doesnt mean I am Indic. I look closer to a Turkish than an Indian. Safe to say I am descended from Mughals. There is no Punjabi ethnicity. The place is overrun by various Indian dalit races, Persians, Turks, Arabs, etc. who settled.

[Karachi]

Just because my parents were from Pakistan or Punjab doesnt mean I am Indic. I look closer to a Turkish than an Indian. Safe to say I am descended from Mughals. There is no Punjabi ethnicity. The place is overrun by various Indian dalit races, Persians, Turks, Arabs, etc. who settled.

Lol. Why is it then most persian, turk, arab claiming punjabis look more tamil then what they claim? 99% of punjabis are native hindus, only converted

[SavageCurry]

Lol. Why is it then most persian, turk, arab claiming punjabis look more tamil then what they claim? 99% of punjabis are native hindus, only converted

I told you the place is mostly overruun by Indian dalit races, but there are some decendants of Mughals, Persians, Turks, etc still there.