niqab or hijab

[ScimitarXEdge]

The claim that the hadith were fabricated to impose Arab cultural customs is false and baseless without any proof.

when the verses about veiling were revealed, the women were previously unveiled.

Narrated Umm Salamah, Ummul Mu'minin:
When the verse "That they should cast their outer garments over their persons" was revealed, the women of Ansar came out as if they had crows over their heads by wearing outer garments. [Hadith - Abu Dawud]

So it would have been impossible for it to have been an Arab cultural practice if women had only adopted the veiling during the Islamic Period

[Badlun]

To disseminate Arab culture and dress in the name of religion was for both men and women as we see many Muslim men too try to imitate Arabs in dress and try to avoid western dress like paint shirt and tie. they call it sunna while Arabs themselves say that the dress they wear today is not the one used by the Prophet.

The point that Muslim chauvinists want to dominate and subdue women by jailing them in four walls of their houses and telling them to cover their whole bodies like coffins is by recommending hijab or niqab as part of religious duty while no where in Quran we find to cover the whole body. Even in the so called hadith there is no where that women should also cover their face. In Quran the outer garment is clearly for identification and not at all a religious duty other it would be part of the five pillars of Islam.

[KhyberKhan]

...to imitate Arabs in dress and try to avoid western dress like paint shirt and tie..

[Afghanistan2010]

wearing pant and shirt for men it doest matter, for woman wearing western underwear also doesnt matter aslong as they dont wear it publicly or anything that caught attention or that is too tight and so on that which goes against the islamic attitueds of Hijab.

[KhyberKhan]

asalaam alaikum sister's and brother's
i'm a new hijabi sister and i want to ask which one of niqab and hijab is the right mentioned hijab in the quran?
post your proof's so i can deciad which is correct to start wear inshalla and which one isn't the one mentioned in quran.

please no articles.
shakeela

How about you read this?

http://www.islam-qa.com/en/ref/13998/hijab

[Afghanistan2010]

How about you read this?

http://www.islam-qa.com/en/ref/13998/hijab

Also

http://www.islamweb.net/emainpage/in...ab=1&vPart=822

[ScimitarXEdge]

Again the claim of Hijab being a strategy to acculturate others into adopting Arab cultural dress is falsified by the fact that Evidence shows that the Hadith indicated that the Arab women prior to Islam did not use Hijab or Niqab. There is no reference in arab Historians that such practices were the norm or mandated part of Arab culture

The claim that Hijab is a prison for women is just a deception tactic by Imperialistic Agenda for female exploitation to make a woman feel insecure and lose self respect for herself by dispensing her body like as a way to treat her like Zoo Exhibition or like Dead Meat sold in the market. It's a way to delude women into humiliating themselves

The pervert Rajneesh used to use this strategy as well; since he was an agent for British Colonialism.

Also the verse which says 'to be recognized" is mistranslated, the word Yu3arafouna means "they are becoming known", not recognized. the word in Arabic for they are Recognized is "yu'atrafouna" ...same root word but different meaning when the letter Te is used

[muslim]

Aisha said, "Asma, daughter of Abu Bakr (that is, Aisha’s sister), entered upon the Apostle of God (pbuh) wearing thin clothes. The Apostle of God turned his attention from her and said, "O Asma, when a woman reaches the age of menstruation, it does not suit her except that she displays parts of her body except this and this," and he pointed to her face and hands. (Sunan Abi Dawud)

this hadith is weak by abu dawud by a weak Attribution.
its from Saeed ibn Basheer from Qutada ibn Da'ama from Khaleed ibn Durayek from Aisha.

Saeed ibn Basheer is a weak to Scholars.
Qutada ibn Da'ama is Mudallis and he take it from khaleed and we don't accept Mudallis Certificate.
khaleed didnt hear this from Aisha.

there is 3 Ills and each one of it make this hadith weak what by all being togther ? its 100% weak.

-------
hijab it is what a women cover her all body (face and hands too) with it.

allah said in the quran :
''. And when you ask (his wives) for anything you want, ask them from behind a screen, that is purer for your hearts and for their hearts.''33:53

''and not to reveal their adornment except to their husbands, their fathers, their husband's fathers, their sons, their husband's sons, their brothers or their brother's sons, or their sister's sons, or their (Muslim) women ....''24:31


Sahih Al-Bukhari Volume 6, Book 60, Hadith # 282
Narrated Safiya bint Shaiba (Radhiallaahu Ánha) "Aisha (Radhiallaahu Ánha) used to say: "When (the Verse): "They should draw their veils over their necks and bosoms," was revealed, (the ladies) cut their waist sheets at the edges and covered their faces with the cut pieces.

Sahih Al-Bukhari Volume 1, Book 8, Hadith # 368
Narrated 'Aisha (Radhiallaahu Ánha) Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Álayhi Wasallam) used to offer the Fajr prayer and some believing women covered with their veiling sheets used to attend the Fajr prayer with him and then they would return to their homes unrecognized . Shaikh Ibn Uthaimin in tafseer of this hadith explains "This hadith makes it clear that the Islamic dress is concealing of the entire body as explained in this hadith. Only with the complete cover including the face and hands can a woman not be recognized. This was the understanding and practice of the Sahaba and they were the best of group, the noblest in the sight of Allah (swt) with the most complete Imaan and noblest of characters. so if the practice of the women of the sahaba was to wear the complete veil then how can we deviate from their path? (Ibn Uthaimin in the book "Hijaab" page # 12 and 13)

Sahih Al-Bukhari Volume 1, Book 4, Hadith # 148
Narrated 'Aisha (Radhiallaahu Ánha): The wives of Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Álayhi Wasallam) used to go to Al-Manasi, a vast open place (near Baqia at Medina) to answer the call of nature at night. 'Umar used to say to the Prophet "Let your wives be veiled," but Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Álayhi Wasallam) did not do so. One night Sauda bint Zam'a the wife of the Prophet went out at 'Isha' time and she was a tall lady. 'Umar addressed her and said, "I have recognized you, O Sauda." He said so, as he desired eagerly that the verses of Al-Hijab (the observing of veils by the Muslim women) may be revealed. So Allah revealed the verses of "Al-Hijab" (A complete body cover excluding the eyes)

our women's who have been raised in the west don't have the emaan to wear this niqab they are weaker than what i thought, they are being brainwashed by the media and now they are start acting more western than the white ppl.
BUT not all of our women's are like that alhmdolilah we have lot's of great sister's who make us proud of them, but they don't know whats right and wrong in islam ..... some monafiq mulla's being Bribe by the west to give wrong fatwa to make our muslims women in the street or working next to them.

this is another ayaa to end this !!
''O Prophet, tell your wives and your daughters and the women of the believers to bring down over themselves [part] of their outer garments. That is more suitable that they will be known and not be abused. And ever is Allah Forgiving and Merciful.''33:59

The covering of the face is not a must i have discussed this issue with certain people having knowledge on islam.

And there is the agreement between the scholars that covering the face in complete except for the eyes is not must,but one can do so.

read my reply to ScimitarXEdge if you are still confused and think face and hands are okey to be showen.
you can open a thread for what confusing you.

.

shut up.

[Afghanistan2010]

this hadith is weak by abu dawud by a weak Attribution.
its from Saeed ibn Basheer from Qutada ibn Da'ama from Khaleed ibn Durayek from Aisha.

Saeed ibn Basheer is a weak to Scholars.
Qutada ibn Da'ama is Mudallis and he take it from khaleed and we don't accept Mudallis Certificate.
khaleed didnt hear this from Aisha.

there is 3 Ills and each one of it make this hadith weak what by all being togther ? its 100% weak.

-------
hijab it is what a women cover her all body (face and hands too) with it.

allah said in the quran :
''. And when you ask (his wives) for anything you want, ask them from behind a screen, that is purer for your hearts and for their hearts.''33:53

''and not to reveal their adornment except to their husbands, their fathers, their husband's fathers, their sons, their husband's sons, their brothers or their brother's sons, or their sister's sons, or their (Muslim) women ....''24:31


Sahih Al-Bukhari Volume 6, Book 60, Hadith # 282
Narrated Safiya bint Shaiba (Radhiallaahu Ánha) "Aisha (Radhiallaahu Ánha) used to say: "When (the Verse): "They should draw their veils over their necks and bosoms," was revealed, (the ladies) cut their waist sheets at the edges and covered their faces with the cut pieces.

Sahih Al-Bukhari Volume 1, Book 8, Hadith # 368
Narrated 'Aisha (Radhiallaahu Ánha) Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Álayhi Wasallam) used to offer the Fajr prayer and some believing women covered with their veiling sheets used to attend the Fajr prayer with him and then they would return to their homes unrecognized . Shaikh Ibn Uthaimin in tafseer of this hadith explains "This hadith makes it clear that the Islamic dress is concealing of the entire body as explained in this hadith. Only with the complete cover including the face and hands can a woman not be recognized. This was the understanding and practice of the Sahaba and they were the best of group, the noblest in the sight of Allah (swt) with the most complete Imaan and noblest of characters. so if the practice of the women of the sahaba was to wear the complete veil then how can we deviate from their path? (Ibn Uthaimin in the book "Hijaab" page # 12 and 13)

Sahih Al-Bukhari Volume 1, Book 4, Hadith # 148
Narrated 'Aisha (Radhiallaahu Ánha): The wives of Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Álayhi Wasallam) used to go to Al-Manasi, a vast open place (near Baqia at Medina) to answer the call of nature at night. 'Umar used to say to the Prophet "Let your wives be veiled," but Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Álayhi Wasallam) did not do so. One night Sauda bint Zam'a the wife of the Prophet went out at 'Isha' time and she was a tall lady. 'Umar addressed her and said, "I have recognized you, O Sauda." He said so, as he desired eagerly that the verses of Al-Hijab (the observing of veils by the Muslim women) may be revealed. So Allah revealed the verses of "Al-Hijab" (A complete body cover excluding the eyes)

our women's who have been raised in the west don't have the emaan to wear this niqab they are weaker than what i thought, they are being brainwashed by the media and now they are start acting more western than the white ppl.
BUT not all of our women's are like that alhmdolilah we have lot's of great sister's who make us proud of them, but they don't know whats right and wrong in islam ..... some monafiq mulla's being Bribe by the west to give wrong fatwa to make our muslims women in the street or working next to them.

this is another ayaa to end this !!
''O Prophet, tell your wives and your daughters and the women of the believers to bring down over themselves [part] of their outer garments. That is more suitable that they will be known and not be abused. And ever is Allah Forgiving and Merciful.''33:59


.

Dear brother in Islam

jazakaAllahu khayran for your reply.

I agree with Niqab this does not mean i disagree or im against it.
But you remember :

Surah 24 : 30

Tell the believing men to reduce [some] of their vision and guard their private parts. That is purer for them. Indeed, Allah is Acquainted with what they do.



30. Tell the believing men to lower their gaze, and protect their private parts. That is purer for them. Verily, Allah is All-Aware of what they do.) The Command to lower the Gaze This is a command from Allah to His believing servants, to lower their gaze from looking at things that have been prohibited for them. They should look only at what is permissible for them to look at, and lower their gaze from forbidden things. If it so happens that a person's gaze unintentionally falls upon something forbidden, he should quickly look away. Muslim recorded in his Sahih that Jarir bin `Abdullah Al-Bajali, may Allah be pleased with him, said, "I asked the Prophet about the sudden glance, and he commanded me to turn my gaze away.




how should we reduce our vision toward a female when her face is covered and we dont see her face,this is the point that is discussed by the scholars,therefor their conclusion was that face is not a must but one can.

[sunni]

Dear brother in Islam

jazakaAllahu khayran for your reply.

I agree with Niqab this does not mean i disagree or im against it.
But you remember :

Surah 24 : 30

Tell the believing men to reduce [some] of their vision and guard their private parts. That is purer for them. Indeed, Allah is Acquainted with what they do.



30. Tell the believing men to lower their gaze, and protect their private parts. That is purer for them. Verily, Allah is All-Aware of what they do.) The Command to lower the Gaze This is a command from Allah to His believing servants, to lower their gaze from looking at things that have been prohibited for them. They should look only at what is permissible for them to look at, and lower their gaze from forbidden things. If it so happens that a person's gaze unintentionally falls upon something forbidden, he should quickly look away. Muslim recorded in his Sahih that Jarir bin `Abdullah Al-Bajali, may Allah be pleased with him, said, "I asked the Prophet about the sudden glance, and he commanded me to turn my gaze away.




how should we reduce our vision toward a female when her face is covered and we dont see her face,this is the point that is discussed by the scholars,therefor their conclusion was that face is not a must but one can.

'' reduce [some] of their vision ''

this means her legs for the cloths ....etc nothing got to do with face bro.
its uncomfortable to stare at a girl thats why lower their gaze.

i think brother muslim post a nice reply and you shouldnt be confused anymore about it.
i dont see any Interaction from the females in this thread.

[ScimitarXEdge]

this hadith is weak by abu dawud by a weak Attribution.
its from Saeed ibn Basheer from Qutada ibn Da'ama from Khaleed ibn Durayek from Aisha.

Saeed ibn Basheer is a weak to Scholars.
Qutada ibn Da'ama is Mudallis and he take it from khaleed and we don't accept Mudallis Certificate.
khaleed didnt hear this from Aisha

show proof it has been deemed weak

[sunni]

show proof it has been deemed weak

my pleasure


The hadith of Aisha (Radhiallaahu Ánha) when Asmaa (Radhiallaahu Ánha) the daughter of Abu Bakr came to the Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Álayhi Wasallam) while wearing thin clothing. He approached her and said: 'O Asmaa! When a girl reaches the menstrual age, it is not proper that anything should remain exposed except this and this. He pointed to the face and hands. But this hadith is WEAK because of 2 main weaknesses:
1. There is no link between Aisha (Radhiallaahu Ánha) and Khalid bin Dareek, who narrated the hadith from her. And in every chain of narrators Khalid bin Dareek is mentioned.
2. In the chain os narrators Sa'eed bin Basheer appears, who is known by most of the Muhaditheen as being a weak narrator. This has been mentioned by Imaam Ahmad bin Hanbal (Rahimahullah), An-Nasai (Rahimahullah), Ibn Madeeni (Rahimahullah) and Ibn Ma'een (Rahimahullah). This is also why Imaam Bukhari (Rahimahullah) and Muslim (Rahimahullah) did not except this hadith to be in their books.
(From Shaikh Ibn Uthaimin in the book "Hijaab" pages # 17 and 18.)

We also have to see that the Muhadith Abu Dawood when he quoted this hadith put with it that it is Musal (with a broken chain that does not lead up to the Sahaba).
(From The Book "Hijaab wa Safur" under tha fatwaa of Shaikh AbulAziz Bin Bazz on Page #61. Also stated as being weak by Shaikh Nasirudden Al-Albaani in his Daeef Sunan Abu Dawud in Kitab-ul-Libas under hadeeth number 4092 (which is the original hadeeth number.) It has also been mentioned in the magazine called "Al Hijrah" that Ullima agree this hadith is weak.)

An other thing that shows the weakness of this hadith is that after the ayah for hijab (Surah Al-Ahzaab – Verse #59) was revealed then the women of Sahaba wore a complete veil and covered the faces and hands. This includes Asmaa (Radhiallaahu Ánha) the daughter of Abu Bakr, who is supposed to have narrated this hadith. Asmaa (Radhiallaahu Ánha)covered herself completly including tha face, this has been narrated in authentic hadith in Imaam maliks "MUWATTA Book 20 Hadith # 20.5.16."

[ScimitarXEdge]

my pleasure


The hadith of Aisha (Radhiallaahu Ánha) when Asmaa (Radhiallaahu Ánha) the daughter of Abu Bakr came to the Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Álayhi Wasallam) while wearing thin clothing. He approached her and said: 'O Asmaa! When a girl reaches the menstrual age, it is not proper that anything should remain exposed except this and this. He pointed to the face and hands. But this hadith is WEAK because of 2 main weaknesses:
1. There is no link between Aisha (Radhiallaahu Ánha) and Khalid bin Dareek, who narrated the hadith from her. And in every chain of narrators Khalid bin Dareek is mentioned.
2. In the chain os narrators Sa'eed bin Basheer appears, who is known by most of the Muhaditheen as being a weak narrator. This has been mentioned by Imaam Ahmad bin Hanbal (Rahimahullah), An-Nasai (Rahimahullah), Ibn Madeeni (Rahimahullah) and Ibn Ma'een (Rahimahullah). This is also why Imaam Bukhari (Rahimahullah) and Muslim (Rahimahullah) did not except this hadith to be in their books.
(From Shaikh Ibn Uthaimin in the book "Hijaab" pages # 17 and 18.)

We also have to see that the Muhadith Abu Dawood when he quoted this hadith put with it that it is Musal (with a broken chain that does not lead up to the Sahaba).
(From The Book "Hijaab wa Safur" under tha fatwaa of Shaikh AbulAziz Bin Bazz on Page #61. Also stated as being weak by Shaikh Nasirudden Al-Albaani in his Daeef Sunan Abu Dawud in Kitab-ul-Libas under hadeeth number 4092 (which is the original hadeeth number.) It has also been mentioned in the magazine called "Al Hijrah" that Ullima agree this hadith is weak.)

An other thing that shows the weakness of this hadith is that after the ayah for hijab (Surah Al-Ahzaab – Verse #59) was revealed then the women of Sahaba wore a complete veil and covered the faces and hands. This includes Asmaa (Radhiallaahu Ánha) the daughter of Abu Bakr, who is supposed to have narrated this hadith. Asmaa (Radhiallaahu Ánha)covered herself completly including tha face, this has been narrated in authentic hadith in Imaam maliks "MUWATTA Book 20 Hadith # 20.5.16."

THis is not unanimous by i'jma; these are Wahhabi scholars and not Scholars of Sunni Muslims; so this is not proof.

show us from Sunni Ulama.

[ScimitarXEdge]

Sunnis are not obligated to follow Saudi Arabian Kharijis (also called Wahhabis); their Fatwas and opinions have no merit for Sunnis.

[king-zazai]

niqab is highest of iman and best of dress codes obviously if you cover up more the better with all the proofs its not easy to move up but inshallah may allah give all women the tawfiq to do so amen