Pashtun tribe names and their history?

[Jamal120]

Hey guys, I'm new here. I was just wondering if I could get some information on Pashtun tribes such as Stanikzai(which I am), Ahmadzai, Orakzai, etc. and also all the Khel's as well. Do any of you know the history or meaning of these names, I know Zai means son of. But is there any information beyond that, thanks.

[Iblis_Efreetzai]

I THINK and I stress the word THINK because I am not sure, but Stanikzai

comes from the word Stana which means pious? so Stanik must refer to someone who has the qualities of piety.

Orak, comes from Warak, which means Little or Small, which may suggest that Orakzai were a little brother of several brothers. Correct me if I am wrong.

The word Zai comes from Soghdian word "Zaita" which means "to be Born", but this word comes from Avestan Zana, which means "Life, Birth etc etc"

In Pashto, there's still the word zegdal or Zejdal which comes from the same root, but Paida Shwal or Paida Kedal is more commonly used.

[Jamal120]

So do you think that the names came from actual historical people or just came about randomly?

[Iblis_Efreetzai]

More likely from Myths and Legends, but even behind every myth and legend there's some element of truth.

[Samandri]

I THINK and I stress the word THINK because I am not sure, but Stanikzai

comes from the word Stana which means pious? so Stanik must refer to someone who has the qualities of piety.

Orak, comes from Warak, which means Little or Small, which may suggest that Orakzai were a little brother of several brothers. Correct me if I am wrong.

The word Zai comes from Soghdian word "Zaita" which means "to be Born", but this word comes from Avestan Zana, which means "Life, Birth etc etc"

In Pashto, there's still the word zegdal or Zejdal which comes from the same root, but Paida Shwal or Paida Kedal is more commonly used.

Orak is actually Wrak i.e lost............Orakzais appear as "Wrakzai" in the writings of Khushal Khan Khattak and Mughals. Its relatively recently, that it has altered to Orakzai. According to Orakzais, their progenitor Sikander Shah, an exiled Persian prince, "wrak" from his home, about 1000 years ago, migrated to Kohat and took service with Muslim king of that area. The Tirahis of the hills being troublesome, Sikandar Shah then led an army against them and defeated them. Later he married a Tirahi woman and permanently settled in Tirah. (A Glossary of the Tribes and Castes of the Punjab and North-West ..., Volume 3, page-176)........This is of course a legend but reveals that Orakzais have Tirahi blood in them. There did exist Dardic people by name of Tirahi in Tirah valley who were expelled from there by Pir-i-Roshan and they settled in Nangarhar (where they have some villages). Afridis and Shinwaris poured into Tirah valley from Nanagrahar and Orakzais moved into Tirah from Kohat and Hangu side (Tarikh-i-Murassa narrates that Orakzais were settled in plains of Kohat when Khattaks arrived there from Bannu)

[Samandri]

So do you think that the names came from actual historical people or just came about randomly?

Tribes with few centuries old history are not myths and legends, its only millennium old history which usually enters into the territory of legend. For example the claim that Saddozais are descendants of a person by name of Saddo, is not legend or fiction. There did exist a person by name of Saddo in 16th century, a chief of Abdali tribe. Saddo Khan Abdali is mentioned in the persian manuscript of Mirza Syed Mohamed of Isfahan who was his contemporary. The name of same Saddo also appears in the Mughal sources as his grandson Shah Hussain was a high ranking officer in Mughal army.

[Aryana]

Tribes with few centuries old history are not myths and legends, its only millennium old history which usually enters into the territory of legend. For example the claim that Saddozais are descendants of a person by name of Saddo, is not legend or fiction. There did exist a person by name of Saddo in 16th century, a chief of Abdali tribe. Saddo Khan Abdali is mentioned in the persian manuscript of Mirza Syed Mohamed of Isfahan who was his contemporary. The name of same Saddo also appears in the Mughal sources as his grandson Shah Hussain was a high ranking officer in Mughal army.

You seem to know a lot on Pashtun history. What evidence is there that Abdalis are descendants of Hepthalites, other than the similarities in the root words. Or for that matter, what evidence is there that Ghilzais (Ghilji) are descended from Khiljis?

[Samandri]

You seem to know a lot on Pashtun history. What evidence is there that Abdalis are descendants of Hepthalites, other than the similarities in the root words. Or for that matter, what evidence is there that Ghilzais (Ghilji) are descended from Khiljis?

Unfortunately i am not well-acquainted with ancient history ,and i am quite clueless about hepthalites, Kushans, Bactrians etc (@Afghanfootball is quite knowledgeable about it)

About Khiljies, some argue that they were Turks who got assimilated into Afghans (argued by Raverty and Elphinstone, based on Tarikh-i-Ferishta description of Khiljis), other argue that they were Afghans mistaken for Turks ( according to Abdul Hai Habibi and many other Afghan scholars).

Some points in support of connection between Khiljis and Ghilzais

1- Khiljis were living in the Helmand, Zabul , Ghazni etc......these areas are nowadays inhabited by Ghilzai tribes. It can not be a coincidence. Either Khiljis were absorbed or displaced by Ghilzais, or Khiljis were Ghilzais to begin with.

2- Khushal Khan Khattak clearly considers Khiljis to be Ghilzais in his diwan. He says in a couplet that Sultan Jalauddin Khilji (first ruler of Khilji dynasty of India) was from Wilayat of Ghilzai.

3- Qasim Ferishta wrote his history in 1613 A.D, and he says that Khiljis were Turks who had manners and customs of Afghans. But a contemporary historian Zia-udd-din Barani, who lived in the Khilji period, says that ,' "Jalal-d-din came of a race different from the Turks ,' and that by the death of Sultan Kaikoabad , 'The Turks lost the empire'.

4-Ghulam Sarwar Niazi, the author ofThe Life and Works of Sultan Alauddin Khalji, argues that "In the light of the rule of grammar if two nouns are used in conjunction , they do not necessarily give opposite meanings, but many times they are synonymous. So it follows that when Khaljis and Afghans are mentioned togather , it is not done to represent two separate tribes belonging to different races but probably of the one and the same race. " check the link for the details

5-Minhaj-us-siraj, author of Tabqat-Nasiri doesnt regard the Khiljis as belonging to the race of Turks. While giving a detailed account of Ikhtiar-ud-din Khilji Muhammad Bakhtiar Khilji's exploits , he gives the following statement , which clearly explains that the Khiljis and the Turks were two different entities.

"when his lashkar passed over that ridge , he posted there two of his amirs, one being a Turk , the other a Khalji, to guard that bridge"

[Sarbani]

[MENTION=18842]History of Pashtuns[/MENTION]

We also call the Khiljis "Ghilji". The only difference being a single consonant. I think they became Ghilzai in some areas because of Pashtun influence.

Do you know the origins of the Khiljis? Like did their ethnogenesis happen in SE Afghanistan or did they have folklores about coming from northern Central Asia?

[Iblis_Efreetzai]

Orak is actually Wrak i.e lost............Orakzais appear as "Wrakzai" in the writings of Khushal Khan Khattak and Mughals. Its relatively recently, that it has altered to Orakzai. According to Orakzais, their progenitor Sikander Shah, an exiled Persian prince, "wrak" from his home, about 1000 years ago, migrated to Kohat and took service with Muslim king of that area. The Tirahis of the hills being troublesome, Sikandar Shah then led an army against them and defeated them. Later he married a Tirahi woman and permanently settled in Tirah. (A Glossary of the Tribes and Castes of the Punjab and North-West ..., Volume 3, page-176)........This is of course a legend but reveals that Orakzais have Tirahi blood in them. There did exist Dardic people by name of Tirahi in Tirah valley who were expelled from there by Pir-i-Roshan and they settled in Nangarhar (where they have some villages). Afridis and Shinwaris poured into Tirah valley from Nanagrahar and Orakzais moved into Tirah from Kohat and Hangu side (Tarikh-i-Murassa narrates that Orakzais were settled in plains of Kohat when Khattaks arrived there from Bannu)

That explanation makes way more sense, I always thought Orak was from Warokai, which some dialects of Pashto describes as a little boy or baby.

but Wrak=Orak makes more sense. but I didn't put it together "Lost-Son"

[Jamal120]

Tribes with few centuries old history are not myths and legends, its only millennium old history which usually enters into the territory of legend. For example the claim that Saddozais are descendants of a person by name of Saddo, is not legend or fiction. There did exist a person by name of Saddo in 16th century, a chief of Abdali tribe. Saddo Khan Abdali is mentioned in the persian manuscript of Mirza Syed Mohamed of Isfahan who was his contemporary. The name of same Saddo also appears in the Mughal sources as his grandson Shah Hussain was a high ranking officer in Mughal army.

Do you know any books about this topic. I appreciate your reply.

[Samandri]

Do you know any books about this topic. I appreciate your reply.

No , i dont know about any book on this topic.

[Samandri]

@History of Pashtuns

We also call the Khiljis "Ghilji". The only difference being a single consonant. I think they became Ghilzai in some areas because of Pashtun influence.

Do you know the origins of the Khiljis? Like did their ethnogenesis happen in SE Afghanistan or did they have folklores about coming from northern Central Asia?

We say "Ghilji" or "Ghiljay", and i think Ghilzais themselves (majority if not all) say Ghilji instead of Ghilzai. The -Zai or -Zi for other tribes is maintained

A very relevant article on khyber.org by Abubakar Asadullah about connection between Ghilzais and Khiljis, give it a read . Ghilzai Afghans