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Kalash and Nuristanis religion?

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  • Kalash and Nuristanis religion?

    I actually found something interesting on the internet

    Kalash people are divided equally between the adherents of Islam and their own religion.[2] Kalash religion is similar to the religion that was practiced by Rigvedic aryans. Kalash have retained most of the Proto-Indo-Iranian religion (Indo-European religion). The Kalash people are unique in their customs and religion. The Hindukush area shares many of the traits of IIr. myths, ritual, society, and echoes many aspects of Ṛigvedic, but hardly of post-Ṛigvedic religion.[19] Kalash culture and belief system differs from the various ethnic groups surrounding them but is similar to that of the neighboring Nuristanis in northeast Afghanistan. In the 1970s there were a number of forced conversions. However, during the last two decades, protection by the Pakistani government has seen the Kalash double in number.[20]
    The isolated Kalash have received strong religious influences from pre-Islamic Nuristan. The prominent and noted linguist Richard Strand, who is the sole modern authority on Hindu-Kush languages spent three decades in the Hindu Kush. He noted the following about the pre-Islamic Nuristani religion:


    "Before their conversion to Islâm the Nuristânis practiced a form of ancient Hinduism, infused with accretions developed locally



    They acknowledged a number of human-like deities who lived in the unseen Deity World (Kâmviri d'e lu; cf. Sanskrit deva lok'a-)



    Certain deities were revered only in one community or tribe, but one was universally revered as the Creator: the ancient Hindu god Yama Râja called imr'o in Kâmviri.[21][22] There is a creator god, appearing under various names, no longer as Father Heaven, but as lord of the nether world and of heaven: Imra (*Yama Rājan), Māra 'death' (Nuristani) [23] He (Yama rajan) is a creator deity called Dezau (ḍezáw) whose name is derived from Indo-European *dheig'h 'to form' (Kati Nuristani dez 'to create', CDIAL 14621); Dezauhe is also called by the Pashto term Khodai. There are a number of other deities, semi-gods and spirits. The Kalash pantheon is thus one of the last living representatives of Indo-European religion.

  • #2
    so were they ancient and original hindus?

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    • #3
      Not sure but Iv hard they are descendedts of greeks.

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Afghanfootball View Post
        Not sure but Iv hard they are descendedts of greeks.
        Yeah, so have I countless times. SE Euros that claim the Kalash as their descendants are all talking out of their rear end. The Kalash and Nuristanis are Dardic people with their own unique ancient history and culture and not some offshoot of a European man's army that briefly invaded the region 3 centuries ago. The reason a lot of those guys are very light skinned is because they weren't involved too much in race mixing like Pashtuns and other Iranics heavily were.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by Karachi View Post
          so were they ancient and original hindus?
          They follow a religion that stems from the same root as Hinduism, but their religion still has its differences from Hinduism. Their religion is definitely not the "original" Hinduism. It's just a very old pre-Islamic Indo-Iranic religion that didn't succumb to the Arabs. And also, it isn't anymore ancient than modern day Hinduism.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Azad Pashtunistan View Post
            Yeah, so have I countless times. SE Euros that claim the Kalash as their descendants are all talking out of their rear end. The Kalash and Nuristanis are Dardic people with their own unique ancient history and culture and not some offshoot of a European man's army that briefly invaded the region 3 centuries ago. The reason a lot of those guys are very light skinned is because they weren't involved too much in race mixing like Pashtuns and other Iranics heavily were.
            Eh I wouldn't say that Nuristani are I Dards since that would make them indo aryans. They are a part of their category in terms of language. Though I agree about Nuristani not mixing they have always been in the same place since the Aryan invasion.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Azad Pashtunistan View Post
              Yeah, so have I countless times. SE Euros that claim the Kalash as their descendants are all talking out of their rear end. The Kalash and Nuristanis are Dardic people with their own unique ancient history and culture and not some offshoot of a European man's army that briefly invaded the region 3 centuries ago. The reason a lot of those guys are very light skinned is because they weren't involved too much in race mixing like Pashtuns and other Iranics heavily were.
              Not really, most of them are lighter skinned because they live in higher altitudes in Nuristan which is basically all mountainous while a lot of Pashtuns have settled in plain valleys. Besides, the Nuristanis are related to the Kalash and are believed to have migrated down from chitral a few thousand years ago. Considering how close Nuristan is to Chitral, it may be true.
              "Revenge is a dish best served cold".

              -Old Pashtun proverb




              "My Pashtun Pride i will not hide!"

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Kushan Prince View Post
                Not really, most of them are lighter skinned because they live in higher altitudes in Nuristan which is basically all mountainous while a lot of Pashtuns have settled in plain valleys. Besides, the Nuristanis are related to the Kalash and are believed to have migrated down from chitral a few thousand years ago. Considering how close Nuristan is to Chitral, it may be true.
                Higher altitudes is also a huge reason why they look like what they do, but I just brought up that they didn't race mix to compare them to the pro-miscegenation Iranics who's ancestors looked very similar to the Nuristanis and Kalash.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Afghanfootball View Post
                  Eh I wouldn't say that Nuristani are I Dards since that would make them indo aryans. They are a part of their category in terms of language. Though I agree about Nuristani not mixing they have always been in the same place since the Aryan invasion.
                  Oh yeah, Nuristanis aren't Dards. I got them confused. Dards aren't Indo-Aryan/Indic btw, the reason they have some linguistic similarities with Indics is because of living next to them for so long. Dardics are their own group from the upper regions of Central Asia originally with most of them assimilating into Iranics. I mean just look at Dards (Kashmiris, Pashayis, Kalash, etc.) and then look at Indians, they look nothing alike.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Azad Pashtunistan View Post
                    Oh yeah, Nuristanis aren't Dards. I got them \confused. Dards aren't Indo-Aryan/Indic btw, the reason they have some linguistic similarities with Indics is because of living next to them for so long. Dardics are their own group from the upper regions of Central Asia originally with most of them assimilating into Iranics. I mean just look at Dards (Kashmiris, Pashayis, Kalash, etc.) and then look at Indians, they look nothing alike.
                    Never understood by Dards were classified as Indo Aryans since Pashayi are almost the same as Pashtun. Thanks for clearing that up.

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                    • #11
                      In my opinion I think there should be 3 classification groups Iranian, Central Aryan, Indo-Aryan.

                      Central Aryan:
                      Pashtun
                      Farsiwan (Persianized Afghans)
                      Tajiks
                      Balochi
                      Nuristani
                      Dards

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Sarbani View Post
                        Oh yeah, Nuristanis aren't Dards. I got them confused. Dards aren't Indo-Aryan/Indic btw, the reason they have some linguistic similarities with Indics is because of living next to them for so long. Dardics are their own group from the upper regions of Central Asia originally with most of them assimilating into Iranics. I mean just look at Dards (Kashmiris, Pashayis, Kalash, etc.) and then look at Indians, they look nothing alike.
                        Only an Afghan can make such a blank statement because their iq is so little, Kashmiris and Kalasha are Indo Aryans, their languages are not only Indo Aryan, its more ancient Sanskrit also, their haplogroups are R1a1 M17 like Indians, you do know Indo Aryans are genetically from the Kushan right? I have seen people even lighter than Kashmiris near Uttarkhand India where many Indo Aryan people preserved their looks, that is why we call them Indo ARYANS, even Hitler said that Aryan people from the Kurgan 50,000 years ago invaded India, why do think Sanskrit is so similar to Slavic idiot? The might not be the same race but they have a common origin.

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                        • #13
                          Fool

                          Originally posted by Afghanfootball View Post
                          Never understood by Dards were classified as Indo Aryans since Pashayi are almost the same as Pashtun. Thanks for clearing that up.
                          That's because Indo Aryan race is originally from the Kurgan of eastern Europe from 50,000 years ago and they were apart of the yamaya, is it coincidence that Hinduism and slavs have R1a1, similar polytheism, and why Indo Aryan langauges are related more to Slavic than Dravidian and Hitler knew the Swatiska was a Indo Aryan symbol

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                          • #14
                            I recommend work by the Norwegian language expert Morgensterne, Strand from Chicago Uni, and the most recent French Jean Yves Loude. These people have collected the most data including soundbites. I checked the reliability of Katviri and Kamviri vocab (indicated in the research) of the Kam people and Kata people of Landaiseen/Bashgul area with of one of my elders who lived in Sarobi and was involved in Nuristan by marriage and by work. Here lies perhaps the most useable data on the Nuristani and Kalash for individuals to examine. Yousif Nuristani, son of Khalilullah Nuristani is perhaps the most well know link to Nuristani people, he lives in Mikroryan and can be easily found, I met him in 2005 when he visited Germany. In Pakistan Saifullah Khan of Bumboret valley is still alive and a valuable source of information. Last I heard was his daughter taking private pilots licence in pakistan.

                            So there is plenty information available and really there is no need to accept Greek or Macedonian romantic tales which are scurrilously made without empirical data.

                            Jean Yves Loude and Lievre - Kalash Solstice
                            Kalash : les derniers infidèles de l’Hindu-Kush, avec Viviane Lièvre, phot. d’Hervé Nègre, Champigneulles, France, Berger-Levrault Éditions, coll. « Espace des hommes », 1980, 179 p. (ISBN 2-7013-0379-6)

                            Richard Strand
                            Richard Strand's Nuristan Site: Peoples and Languages of Nuristan

                            Georg Morgenstierne
                            Georg Morgenstierne -- map

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                            • #15
                              Ancient people of Afghanistan practised several religions: Zorastrianism, Buddism, Hinduism, and probably many other local religions that are lost and forgotten.

                              Ancestors of the people of modern Afghanistan may have likely invented all these religions. Zorastrianism spreaded towards the West (with Judaism, Christianity, and Islam all having origins in this religions) and Hinduism and Buddism spreading towards South Asia and South East/East Asia.
                              Last edited by Kabulistan; 10-27-2016, 08:45 PM.

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