Ahmad Shah Abdali was a Wahhabi

[Shamlawar Khurasani]

Lol, no question about it on those 2 clowns. Lets hear mr shamlawar out, lets see what he has to say

I'm very curious about what I previously asked@ shamlawar.

It seems, the information I have on Shah Waliullah Delvi is not solid. The quote I have of is heavily contested. Sufis claim that his grand son who was a wahhabi tampered with his books.

I don't believe Sufis because they always claim that old books are tampered with.

However, in order for me to make the case, I need better information.

Therefore, at this moment, I like to withdraw my claim that Shah Waliullah Delwi had the same creed as the Salafis.

Maybe, if I gather sufficient information, I might revisit this thread. But for now, I withdraw my claim.

[khushal]

I remember Shamlawar and RTR belittling Ahmed Shah and Khushal Khan Khatak as womanizing, alcoholic, slaves of turkoman and Mughuls and killers at the same time. People like them and Khostai/badlun/toramana/etc are out of touch with reality in Afghanistan and its history. They insult and label people that don't think like them as kufars/apostates/terrorists/backward thinkers.

In reality people like Ahmed Shah and Khushal Khan rejected their kind of militancy and funny how now Shamlawar is claiming him as his own with a letter and Badlun with a poem. Its like Muslims claiming Jefferson as their own because he kept a Quran or Obama as their own because of his middle name.

[Pakhtunzai]

It seems, the information I have on Shah Waliullah Delvi is not solid. The quote I have of is heavily contested. Sufis claim that his grand son who was a wahhabi tampered with his books.

I don't believe Sufis because they always claim that old books are tampered with.

However, in order for me to make the case, I need better information.

Therefore, at this moment, I like to withdraw my claim that Shah Waliullah Delwi had the same creed as the Salafis.

Maybe, if I gather sufficient information, I might revisit this thread. But for now, I withdraw my claim.

I'm more interested in the teachings you mentioned of Abdul Qadir Jillani R.A which you claim that goes against modern day Qadiriyyah?

[RevolutionThroughReason]

I remember Shamlawar and RTR belittling Ahmed Shah and Khushal Khan Khatak as womanizing, alcoholic, slaves of turkoman and Mughuls and killers at the same time. People like them and Khostai/badlun/toramana/etc are out of touch with reality in Afghanistan and its history. They insult and label people that don't think like them as kufars/apostates/terrorists/backward thinkers.

In reality people like Ahmed Shah and Khushal Khan rejected their kind of militancy and funny how now Shamlawar is claiming him as his own with a letter and Badlun with a poem. Its like Muslims claiming Jefferson as their own because he kept a Quran or Obama as their own because of his middle name.

Well considering I'm a Hotak and that POS drove my people out of Kandahar as a slave of Turkmen Warlords; I'm very right in shunning anything and all things Abdali. Afghanistan should never have existed

You however are inconsistent and make no sense; for someone who keeps advocating that pashtuns reject being ruled and shun central Authority to claim someone who claimed himself an Absolute Ruler i.e. a King over Your lands is totally a contradiction. This is a clear attempt to yank false credibility by playing upon heart strings of the brainwashed.

[khushal]

I never advocated any such thing. your manipulating like always.

your no hotak, your an american idiot who only read books but lacks any ground realities understanding. All leaders can be criticized but at the end of the day, all Pashtun tribes stood with abdali including the ghilzai who was his rival. No other Pashtun leader has united his people before him of after him.

[Shamlawar Khurasani]

I'm more interested in the teachings you mentioned of Abdul Qadir Jillani R.A which you claim that goes against modern day Qadiriyyah?

Abdul Qaadir al Jilaani was a Hanbali scholar. The Hanbali school has "athari" creed meaning they follow imam Ahmed ibn Hanbals principles in dealing with names and attributes of Allah. We take matters of the unseen at face value without asking "how". For instance, when we interpret Surah al Mulk, we don't say: hand means power. We say: hand is hand but not like the hand as we know it from our worldly perspective. Hand mentioned in Quran as an attribute of Allah is at it befits Allah and there is no similarity to any of Allahs attributes with what we see and observe.

Yet, Hamza Yusuf and his likes say that Imam Ahmed introduced anthropomorphism. So by modern Sufi standards, Abdul Qaadir al Jilaani was an anthropomorphist.

Similarly, Abdul Qaadir al Jilani was a Sufi who did not practice shirk. He did not worship graves. In fact, if you study his biography, he was very much similar to his contemporaries with regards to matters of worship. No barking and dancing.

You can try to find good reliable translations of his books: Fath Rabbani and al Ghunya li Talibeen.

I am not sure which one of the two, but in one of them, he describes the people who sit by the grave and ask from the dead with dogs at the gate of the house.

Within the Hanbali school, he is considered a prominent scholar. Yet, it is the Hanbali usooli method that produced Ibn Tamiyyah and the whole Dawah Najdiyyah. It is therefore, strange to see Sufis saying Hanbalis are outside the fold of Ahlus Sunnah, yet a prominent scholar of Hanbali school is their "demigod".

[Shamlawar Khurasani]

[Shamlawar Khurasani]

http://www.abovethethrone.com/arsh/articles/oeqwt-abdul-qaadir-al-jeelaanee-d-561h-refutation-of-the-saalimiyyah-sect-who-claim-allaah-is--everywhere.cfm

[Shamlawar Khurasani]

http://www.abovethethrone.com/arsh/articles/tgnnw-abdul-qaadir-al-jeelaanee-d-561h-from-the-views-of-the-jahmiyyah-is-that-allaah-is-not-above-the-throne.cfm

[Shamlawar Khurasani]

http://www.asharis.com/creed/articles/vvttk-shaykh-abdul-qadir-al-jeelaanee-d-561h-allaah-is-the-reckoner-of-every-ashari-in.cfm

[Shamlawar Khurasani]

http://www.asharis.com/creed/articles/ftwhg-shaykh-abdul-qadir-al-jeelaanee-d-561h-the-asharites-who-say-the-quran-is-an-iba.cfm

[Shamlawar Khurasani]

http://www.asharis.com/creed/articles/quran-shaykh-abdul-qadir-al-jeelaanee-d-561h-cleans-out-the-secret-hideouts-of-the-ash.cfm

[Shamlawar Khurasani]

http://www.aqidah.com/creed/articles/zrhee-abdul-qadir-al-jeelaanee-d-561h-on-allaahs-uluww-istiwaa-and-nuzool-and-a-refutation-of-the-jahmiyyah-mutazilah-and-ashariyyah.cfm

[Shamlawar Khurasani]

http://www.ahlalhdeeth.com/vbe/showthread.php?t=437

[Shamlawar Khurasani]

http://ahlulhadeeth.wordpress.com/2007/09/09/lifting-the-blame-from-the-imaams-series-part-12-abdul-qaadir-jeelaanee-part-1/