What Pashtun nationalists?

[checkmate]

Who are Pashtun nationalists? Asfandyar Wali ? Hamid Karzai? Ahmad Karzai?

Don't these people support the US war against Afghanistan and FATA?

So, how can they be so-called Pashtun nationalists?

Didn't ANP support Soviet war against Afghanistan, and now supports the US war against Afghanistan?

So how are they Pashtun nationalists?

Putting aside the fact that nationalism is prohibited in Islam, these people

are an insult to the very term nationalism. Show me any instance in

history where nationalists of any nation supported war upon their country.

Is it therefore no wonder the futile state of their politics?

Who is better? A man who does not support war upon his Muslim brethren

in Afghanistan and FATA, or a man who openly and fully supports war upon

them?

The future belongs to those who are freeing their homeland.

[randolph85]

its a dead concept kept alive in background chatter out of pride.

[Levanaye Zalmaye]

This is exactly the sort of ignorance, shortsightedness and general misinformation that can be seen in any of uknownprince's posts. Children get access to the internets and post whatever they want and then they pass it on as fact.

1) The ANP, Karzai, PMAP and other nationalist elements support the flushing out of the Saudi, Jordanian, Yemeni, Egyptian, Uzbek, Chechen and Pakistani terrorists out of their homeland. These foreigners have not only made life hell for the people of Afghanistan (FATA, KP, etc) by implementing their own barbaric laws and taking by force whatever they want but they've also brought death and destruction to their peaceful homelands through their terrorist attacks on Western civilians. If these Arab nationalists want to rid themselves of the humiliation they've faced at the hands of Israel, they should go and liberate Palestine instead of bring war to our homeland. In fact, it was Al-Qaeda's plan to trap the US in Afghanistan and tire them out. At the cost of Pashtun blood.

2) Almost 10 years before the Soviet intervention in Afghanistan, Pakistan was busy training "Jihadist" terrorists to send to Afghanistan to destroy communications, schools, government installations, etc. By the late 70s, that cross-border Pakistani terrorism against Afghanistan had reached its peak. Something had to be done. The Soviets were called in twice but they refused to intervene militarily. The third time though, they had no choice. The Pashtun nationalists at that time wanted Soviet help to get rid of Pakistani and Arab terrorism in their homeland. And when the Soviets and the nationalist lost, we all saw what Pakistan did in Afghanistan and how it used your Pashtuns as terrorists in Kashmir and beyond and turned Afghanistan into a 7th century wasteland.

Bachaa Khan opposed that war because he saw it as a US-USSR conflict in which both sides were using Muslims as cannon-fodder. But of course, you know better than Bachaa Khan.

[checkmate]

[QUOTE]

1) The ANP, Karzai, PMAP and other nationalist elements support the flushing out of the Saudi, Jordanian, Yemeni, Egyptian, Uzbek, Chechen and Pakistani terrorists out of their homeland.

you speak of ignorance. Afghans support the flushing out of US and Karzai out of their homeland. ANP, Karzai, PMAP are the biggest jokes there. Karzai is hated in Afghanistan. He stands no chance. He will flee. ANP/PMAP are the biggest jokes out there. They aren't even Pashtun nationalists. Again what nationalist supports war on their own country? Besides this anomaly, please show me any other nationalist who has done this in history? Their crimes and treachery are there for all to see. No one can erase this dirty record of theirs.

These foreigners have not only made life hell for the people of Afghanistan (FATA, KP, etc)

Yes, the US has killed many Afghans in Afghanistan and FATA, and this is the reason they too are getting defeated. I mean a one time superpower is crumbling before our eyes. LOL

The US/West has been waging wars and have meddled against the Muslim/ civilized world for far too long. It is good that their economies are destroyed forever. Rumor has it that Iran is already proposing an OIL embargo LOL.

If these Arab nationalists want to rid themselves of the humiliation they've faced at the hands of Israel, they should go and liberate Palestine instead of bring war to our homeland. In fact, it was Al-Qaeda's plan to trap the US in Afghanistan and tire them out. At the cost of Pashtun blood.

Oh,you somehow forget that it was the the so-called "Pashtun nationalists" that supported the Soviet war against Afghanistan. Arab nationalists LOL. First of all, the Arab contribution to the defeat of the Soviet Union was really insignificant since they were small in number, and mainly provided finance and logistics. Secondly, they were welcomed in Afghanistan by Afghans, especially the rural Afghans. If Afghans truly despised these Muslims who had come to defend a Muslim land, then why did they not kill them? I mean they kills others they despise. So? Hmm? They waged war against the Soviets, and are freeing their homeland today, so why did they not fight against the Arabs (who were small in number)? And nothing can convince me otherwise. Really.

2) Almost 10 years before the Soviet intervention in Afghanistan, Pakistan was busy training "Jihadist" terrorists to send to Afghanistan to destroy communications, schools, government installations, etc.

Sources. You truly have shown that your bristling with anger since I pointed out the moronic nature of so-called Pashtun nationalists. So, now you resort to fibs and a false narrative which every educated person knows is complete BS. Afghans trained for Jihad once the Soviets invaded, not 1o years before LOL LOL I mean how much BS will you spew?

By the late 70s, that cross-border Pakistani terrorism against Afghanistan had reached its peak. Something had to be done.

Actually, it was Daud Khan's stupidity and eagerness to overtake FATA right away instead of bidding his time and studying the possibility. Had he thought it through, it would have been best to build up Afghanistan, and then take FATA later once Afghanistan had the means- become a nuclear armed Islamic state because the rural Afghans would have not accepted anything else.

Pakistan was used as a basing ground for the anti-Soviet resistance once the Soviets had started the war. The Jihad was called in June of that year if I am not mistaken. This is when the Afghan resistance spread throughout.

Secondly, it was his ridiculous modernization campaign that led to rebellion and resentment within Afghanistan, especially in rural Afghanistan. He should have learned from Amanullah's stupidity.

The Soviets were called in twice but they refused to intervene militarily. The third time though, they had no choice. The Pashtun nationalists at that time wanted Soviet help to get rid of Pakistani and Arab terrorism in their homeland.

Please just be frank, and say that the so-called "Pashtun nationalists" were against Islam. Thats what it was all about. There were no Pakistani and Arabs roaming around Afghanistan, especially prior to the Soviet war. Afterwards, yes, but in numbers that was so insignificant compared to the Afghan mujahideen. It was the Afghan mujahideen that defeated the Soviets, not the US, not Pakistan, or anyone else.

And when the Soviets and the nationalist lost

News flash. The Soviets and Najib slave forces bombed thousands of Afghan villages and maimed thousands of Afghans. Your purposeful ignorance of this just goes to show how indifferent you are. It is this indifference of the so-called "Pashtun nationalists" that explains why no one gives a rats ass to them. they are a pathetic lot, hated by many for their crimes against their own people. They are not nationalists, but traitors.

we all saw what Pakistan did in Afghanistan and how it used your Pashtuns as terrorists in Kashmir and beyond and turned Afghanistan into a 7th century wasteland.

The Soviets and Najib waged a war against the whole of Afghanistan. Millions of Afghans perished, thousands were tortured to death, and whole villages were bombed. You call this protecting? Not destroying. This is news to me, I didn't know bombing a whole country is considered an act of grace? In either case, the Afghans dealt a swift defeat on them, and are now doing the same to others. Do not play with words, it does not work when everything is based on stupidity and purposeful lying. Afghans hated the Soviets and Najib. Afghans hate the American and Karzai. This is why the American hegemony is crumbling before your very eyes.

[Levanaye Zalmaye]

you speak of ignorance. Afghans support the flushing out of US and Karzai out of their homeland. ANP, Karzai, PMAP are the biggest jokes there. Karzai is hated in Afghanistan. He stands no chance. He will flee. ANP/PMAP are the biggest jokes out there. They aren't even Pashtun nationalists. Again what nationalist supports war on their own country? Besides this anomaly, please show me any other nationalist who has done this in history? Their crimes and treachery are there for all to see. No one can erase this dirty record of theirs.

Yes, the US has killed many Afghans in Afghanistan and FATA, and this is the reason they too are getting defeated. I mean a one time superpower is crumbling before our eyes. LOL

The US/West has been waging wars and have meddled against the Muslim/ civilized world for far too long. It is good that their economies are destroyed forever. Rumor has it that Iran is already proposing an OIL embargo LOL.

Oh,you somehow forget that it was the the so-called "Pashtun nationalists" that supported the Soviet war against Afghanistan. Arab nationalists LOL. First of all, the Arab contribution to the defeat of the Soviet Union was really insignificant since they were small in number, and mainly provided finance and logistics. Secondly, they were welcomed in Afghanistan by Afghans, especially the rural Afghans. If Afghans truly despised these Muslims who had come to defend a Muslim land, then why did they not kill them? I mean they kills others they despise. So? Hmm? They waged war against the Soviets, and are freeing their homeland today, so why did they not fight against the Arabs (who were small in number)? And nothing can convince me otherwise. Really.

My point is that they were the Arabs and the Central Asians who, with their shortsightedness and miscalculations, invited the US to invade Afghanistan by attacking them over and over again while taking sanctuary in Kandahar and Kabul. And we Pashtuns want these foreign terrorists out of our land. If it takes the US to do it, we're with them. But we don't want the US to stay either. I hope that clarifies my position on this.

Sources. You truly have shown that your bristling with anger since I pointed out the moronic nature of so-called Pashtun nationalists. So, now you resort to fibs and a false narrative which every educated person knows is complete BS. Afghans trained for Jihad once the Soviets invaded, not 1o years before LOL LOL I mean how much BS will you spew?

Actually, it was Daud Khan's stupidity and eagerness to overtake FATA right away instead of bidding his time and studying the possibility. Had he thought it through, it would have been best to build up Afghanistan, and then take FATA later once Afghanistan had the means- become a nuclear armed Islamic state because the rural Afghans would have not accepted anything else.

Pakistan was used as a basing ground for the anti-Soviet resistance once the Soviets had started the war. The Jihad was called in June of that year if I am not mistaken. This is when the Afghan resistance spread throughout.

Secondly, it was his ridiculous modernization campaign that led to rebellion and resentment within Afghanistan, especially in rural Afghanistan. He should have learned from Amanullah's stupidity.

Please just be frank, and say that the so-called "Pashtun nationalists" were against Islam. Thats what it was all about. There were no Pakistani and Arabs roaming around Afghanistan, especially prior to the Soviet war. Afterwards, yes, but in numbers that was so insignificant compared to the Afghan mujahideen. It was the Afghan mujahideen that defeated the Soviets, not the US, not Pakistan, or anyone else.

36. When did Pakistan enter the Afghan scenario as a party, which was assisting the anti-Daud insurgents in Afghanistan?

In October 1973 while I was serving as ig fc an Afghan named Habibur Rahman (Shaheed) came and contacted me about setting up a resistance movement in Afghanistan with active military assistance of Pakistan. I conveyed the same to Mr Bhutto, who accepted my proposal in view of the changed situation in Afghanistan and asked me to organise training of Afghans.
Remembering Our Warriors Babar “the great”


Afghanistan's political relationship with Pakistan had been aggravated by Daud's revival of the Pushtunistan issue in 1973. Islamist fugitives were greeted as an opportunity by the government of Prime Minister Zulfikar Ali Bhutto. They might counter Daud's anticipated meddling with Pakistan's Pushtuns.

Among the leaders of the Islamist escapees were Burhanuddin Rabbani and Gulbuddin Hekmatyar. Rabbani had been among the founders of the Islamic ideology movement at Kabul University. Hekmatyar was a former engineering student who had become a full-time political activist and charismatic student leader. The Pakistan government provided them facilities and training at Peshawar. The Saudi Arabian government also found them interesting enough to provide funding. Would-be mujahidin leaders were groomed to make trouble for the Afghan government three years before the Saur coup.
http://lcweb2.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/...OCID+af0106%29 (temporary link)
Library of Congress Country Studies
Pakistan's Support of Afghan Islamists, 1975-79

News flash. The Soviets and Najib slave forces bombed thousands of Afghan villages and maimed thousands of Afghans. Your purposeful ignorance of this just goes to show how indifferent you are. It is this indifference of the so-called "Pashtun nationalists" that explains why no one gives a rats ass to them. they are a pathetic lot, hated by many for their crimes against their own people. They are not nationalists, but traitors.

The Soviets and Najib waged a war against the whole of Afghanistan. Millions of Afghans perished, thousands were tortured to death, and whole villages were bombed. You call this protecting? Not destroying. This is news to me, I didn't know bombing a whole country is considered an act of grace? In either case, the Afghans dealt a swift defeat on them, and are now doing the same to others. Do not play with words, it does not work when everything is based on stupidity and purposeful lying. Afghans hated the Soviets and Najib. Afghans hate the American and Karzai. This is why the American hegemony is crumbling before your very eyes.

As Bachaa Khan said, we were not in favor of any side. We were against the war altogether because it was essentially a US-USSR proxy war in which Pashtun Muslims were dying on both sides. The Americans were arming and sending in Pashtun Muslims to fight against Pashtuns Muslims armed and told to stand guard by the Soviets. The Arabs, defeated at home, came here to spread their seeds of global Jihad. And we Pashtuns are still paying the price for it. They might have been few but their influence was huge. They were the Arabs that invited the US at 9/11, not us.

[Levanaye Zalmaye]

you are a jerk. You people are the biggest poison to Afghanistan.

Afghans have been massacred by kill teams on a daily basis and airstrikes. This is why Afghans are winning. Take your support for a war , that oddly doesn't seem to effect you, and get lost you disgusting jerk

I hate people like you with a passion.

I hate people who support this war. These people hate Afghans in their heart.

They are the biggest frikin liars in the book.

Go to hell you ****.

Long live the free Afghanistan!!!

Ta Pukhtun ham ye che dasay khpal zaan spakawayay da tolo da makhke? Daa day da Islam terbeyat day ao ka da Pakhtunwali?

If you are genuinely concerned about Afghans losing their lives everyday, you will ensure that the neo-Arab nationalists that have been taken sanctuary in Afghanistan to use it as a launchpad for their global Jihad are kicked out so that no foreign power has an excuse to meddle in our affairs.

Afghans fight for their freedom and they are neither concerned with Al-Qaeda's global Jihad nor are they willing or able to carry their black flags to free the Arabs from Israel.

Afghanistan will never be free until it rids itself of Pakistani-trained Mullahs and their Arab brethren. Pakistan and Saudi Arabia should have been bombed for 9/11 and Al-Qaeda but common sense hardly ever prevails...

[gadoonwal]

They are all traitors working for punjabi establishment.
ANP is the B team of pakistani establishment.
An introduction to anp here,,,,

anp leaders are pashtuns in pashtunkhwa
proud pakistani in islam abad when elected by pashtun vote
afghan in afghanistan when they visit there to make fool of afghans and enjoy up on their hospitility.
pro indain and hindostani in india when visit india.
ANP leaders are all on the payroll of ,,isi,,
Their children study in lahore and non of them know a sigle word of pashtu to write.
Afghan govt and people should not welcome these bunch of oppertunists making fool of pashtuns.
They are the real enemies of pashtun/afghans and thier unity.Bacha khan and his politics is no more in anp,s agenda.
Pashtun need revolution to crush these evils and punjabi and westren agents.
The people of afghanistan regardless of the ethnicity need to know that their country will never be free until they get access to the sea and that is only possible to free pashtunistan wa baluchistan.
pakistan know that afghanistan is depending on her port and borders for trade.
Sadly former ,,isi,, agent karzai sitting in kabul and not supporting any anti-pakistan movement.He even oppose the baluch army against pakistan.He forced out brahm dagh bugti out of afghanistan for the sake of pakistan while pakistan is busy bringing down his govt.
They are conected and still follow the ,,isi,,agenda.

Pashtuns as a nation is without voice ,unity and struggle.
We fought and still fighting others war.
Revolution is the only way to free pashtunkhwa and afghanistan.
Pashtuns and afghan (pashtun,tajik,uzbiks, etc) should form an allience for the freedom and unity of the nation .
or
they will be in war until the entire afghanistan become a part of pakistan.
This is the ,,isi,,agenda.They will divide you and will fool you to fight eachother for race,religion etc.

[Shayesta]

Next and first member to use foul language will be warned, with an infraction added. Cheers.

[checkmate]

LZ,

You can support a US war against Afghanistan, but then do not pretend to be concerned.

The US is losing, if not already lost, because they are waging a war against the Afghan people. US airstrikes and night raids specifically target Afghan people.

They have been trying to impose occupation and force Afghan people to accept it, and it has failed.

So, if you support their war against Afghanistan, it shows how indifferent you are to the countless who have died.

As to your other false pretexts which you use to justify your support- the terrorism one- Well the US is the biggest state sponsor of terrorism. They have been interfering in the Muslim world prior to so-called 9/11

They killed Mossadeq in the 1950's after he nationalized Iranian oil. They started war with Vietnam, Korea, Iraq 1 and 1, Somalia, Yemen, Libya, and now Afghanistan.

Their era is over.

Afghans fight to free their land from foreign occupation.

As Soviets crumbled, so has this too. Their wars are all ending.

[tor_khan]

Checkmate, in our attempt to find solutions and understand the reasons behind the US presence in the Muslim world, it is important to be honest. That way, at least, when the foreigners driven by their own motives (whomever/whatever they may be) leave Afghanistan, we will see things in a balanced way.

The truth is, there are no innocents. Russians, Americans, Brits, Muslims, Afghans, Pakistanis, Indians, Chinese. All are to blame. Some more so than others, but let's at least start by accepting that in pointing fingers, we do not exclude ourselves.

As a Pashtoon, is the desire to see your people prosper, be economically independent, united and politically stable important? If so, you're probably a nationalist. The dilemma, of course, is what to do next.

[checkmate]

The future belongs to those who are freeing their country, not to those who have been attempting to enslave it, and have failed.

This truth has resounded in antiquity when the Chinese defeated the British in the Opium wars, when Hannibal rose up against the Romans, when Mirwais defeated the Persians,

when Spartacus sacrificed himself for an idea that would lead to the break up of the Roman empire.

Freedom is everything, there is nothing else without it.