afghan pashtun dna to be posted soon

[Toramana]

Only some tribes have conection but not all pashtuns are bani israel, we pashtun are diferce group we are not like Europeans or Chinese peopel who have a homogenous population.

I am confident the researchers that undertook the study selected a representative sample (as implied by the word unrelated males) of the entire Pashtun population of Afghanistan. So, the results of the study may be assumed conclusive as for the authenticity of the Ban-i-Isrealite theory is concerned.

And it is not important whom we link to. Rather the important thing is, the long-standing controversy about Pashtun origin gets resolved through scientfic and objective research. A lot of speculations have been made about Pashuns some out of genuine interest and curiosity some politically and ideologically motivated (like SE would like to link Pashtuns to Arabs).

The most scientific tools that can provide clues to Pashtun origin are DNA studies and linguistics (because Pashtuns lack written history). Archeology and anthropology (physical anthropology) can also help to a degree.

[Michin Khel]

Sorry friends. I made an almost fatal mistake i.e., both populations studied are Pashtuns; one to the north of Hindukush of whom a sample of 44 unrelated Pashtun males was studied and the other to the south of Hindukush in which the DNA profiles of 145 urelated Pashtun males were considered. The subjects of the experiment also provided geneological information of at least two generations. Below is the related excerpt from the paper.

"Sample collection: Blood samples were collected with informed consent from 189 unrelated Pathan males from Afghanistan. Donors provided geneological information for at least two previous generations".

As I mentioned earlier, the study indicated statistically significant difference between the genitic data of the two populations (Pashtuns north of Hindukush versus Pashtuns south of Hindukush), which made the researchers suggest maintaining independent gene databases for the two Pashtuns. The authors argue Hindukush posed a barrier to the gene flow between the two Pashtun populations and that is the reason for the difference.

According to the study (Table 4), 3.4% of the northern Pashtuns genetically match population of Anatolia (Greece and Turkey), 7.2% that of East Asia (Korea, Malaysia, Philipinnes, Taiwan, and Vietnam), 26.3% that of South Central Asia (Bangladesh, Bhuttan, Nepal, Newar, Kathmando, and Punjab) and 63.1% that of Southwest Russia (Lipzeskaja and Penzenskaja regions).

Pashtuns south of Hindukush on the other hand have genetic match with Anatolian population (Greece, Turkey) by a percentage of 3.6% and with Southwest Russia (Lipzenkaja and Penzenskaja regions) by a percentage of 96.4% (Table 4). The researchers determined this based on Correspondence Analysis(CA), NJ, and Admixture Analysis.

One can clearly see the relatively greater variation in the gene pool of Pashtuns north of Hindukush. The reason for the variation may be the intermarriages of Pashtuns in the north with other groups in the area due to the Hindukush impeding such relations between north and south.

What areas are in north and south of hindokush?

[Toramana]

Supplementary Figure 1. Neighbor-Joining (NJ) tree based on Nei’s genetic distance. The numbers at the nodes represent bootstrap values estimated from 1000 replications.

[retro]

The most scientific tools that can provide clues to Pashtun origin are DNA studies and linguistics (because Pashtuns lack written history). Archeology and anthropology (physical anthropology) can also help to a degree.

You are a Eurasiatic, Central Asia Indo-Iranian peoples and you aren't Near Easterns. Todays Jews in a ethnic sence are basically Hellenised-Kurds and they are genetically closely related to Greeks. The Israelite's kingdom arose out of the earlier, Bronze Age Canaanite culture of the Levant region.

The earliest know surviving scene of an Israelite, bowing the Assyrian king Shalmaneser:



Jehu son of Jehoshaphat son of Nimshi, or Jehu's ambassador, bows before Shalmaneser III.

Jehu severed Israel’s alliances with Phoenicia and Judah, and became subject to Assyria. The caption above the scene, written in Assyrian cuneiform, can be translated:

“The tribute of Jehu, son of Omri: I received from him silver, gold, a golden bowl, a golden vase with pointed bottom, golden tumblers, golden buckets, tin, a staff for a king [and] spears."

In the Obelisk, Jehu's name appears as mIa-ú-a mar mHu-um-ri-i or "Jehu son of Omri (Bit-Khumri"). The House of Omri was an Assyrian name for the Kingdom of Israel.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Obelisk

The Haplogroup J2 present in Central Asia is likely associate with either silk road traders or more likely Near Eastern/Western Asian interlopers, such as the Persians, Greeks or Arabs. As Pashtuns are very much a Indo-Iranian, Central Asia, Eurasiatic peoples. Haplogroup J2 like R1b originates in the Fertile Crescent/Anatolia region (Western Asia). Whilst R1a is likely originally Central Asia, since it's diversity is more or less similar in Pakistan and Ukraine.


R1 almost certainly has arcane Central or Southern Asia, Eurasiatic origins and it's intresting to note that the Kalash in northern Pakistan exhibit both R* and R1* in their very rare primordial forms.

"A genetic study published led by Firasat (2007) on Kalash individuals found high and diverse frequencies of :Haplogroup L3a (22.7%), H1* (20.5%), R1a (18.2%), G (18.2%), J2 (9.1%), R* (6.8%), R1* (2.3%), and L* (2.3%). Haplogroup L originates from prehistoric South Asia."

"mtDNA haplogroup being U4, (pre-HV)1, U2e, and J2"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kalash_...enetic_origins

Genetically people generally tend to resemble their neighbours. It's my understanding that Pashtuns Mitochondrial mtDNA is largerly Western Euriasian. Tajik mtDNA gene pool harbors nearly equal proportions of eastern Eurasian and western Eurasian haplotypes.

In this graphic fram a study on Uzbeks, as you can see Afghani Uzbeks have predominantly western Eurasian mtDNA haplotypes.

[Karachi]

those russian population mentioned, who are they exactly?? any pics??? southwest russia isn't exactly europe, its probably around the Caspian sea area, which is not very far from afghanistan

[Toramana]

You are a Eurasiatic, Central Asia Indo-Iranian peoples and you aren't Near Easterns. Todays Jews in a ethnic sence are basically Hellenised-Kurds and they are genetically closely related to Greeks. The Israelite's kingdom arose out of the earlier, Bronze Age Canaanite culture of the Levant region.

The earliest know surviving scene of an Israelite, bowing the Assyrian king Shalmaneser:



Jehu son of Jehoshaphat son of Nimshi, or Jehu's ambassador, bows before Shalmaneser III.


The Haplogroup J2 present in Central Asia is likely associate with either silk road traders or more likely Near Eastern/Western Asian interlopers, such as the Persians, Greeks or Arabs. As Pashtuns are very much a Indo-Iranian, Central Asia, Eurasiatic peoples. Haplogroup J2 like R1b originates in the Fertile Crescent/Anatolia region (Western Asia). Whilst R1a is likely originally Central Asia, since it's diversity is more or less similar in Pakistan and Ukraine.


R1 almost certainly has arcane Central or Southern Asia, Eurasiatic origins and it's intresting to note that the Kalash in northern Pakistan exhibit both R* and R1* in their very rare primordial forms.

Genetically people generally tend to resemble their neighbours. It's my understanding that Pashtuns Mitochondrial mtDNA is largerly Western Euriasian. Tajik mtDNA gene pool harbors nearly equal proportions of eastern Eurasian and western Eurasian haplotypes.

In this graphic fram a study on Uzbeks, as you can see Afghani Uzbeks have predominantly western Eurasian mtDNA haplotypes.

Hi retro, thanks for that informative comment. It is nice exchanging views with you on these matters. Could you give me the source of the last figure? As can be seen, Afghans(Pashtuns) are the most West Euroasians after Russians ( with relatively higher admixture of East Euroasian gene pool).

I believe, of all Pashtuns, Pashtuns of Afghanistan's south are the most unsullied followed by Pashtuns of FATA and Baluchistam.

[Toramana]

those russian population mentioned, who are they exactly?? any pics??? southwest russia isn't exactly europe, its probably around the Caspian sea area, which is not very far from afghanistan

Karachai Khan, I really haven't checked where these places are. The only thing they mention is, these are places in South Asian Russia.

[Manzareh]

so in brief.....??

[AfghanResistance]

lol were never gonna know our real origin

We already know our real origins. we descend from Adam and Hawa and Allah then made us into nations and tribes so that we may know and respect one another.

[Toramana]

Guys, I think there are few important DNA studies on Pashtuns in progress or recently published. Two DNA studies that I was able to trace have been carried out by a group of researchers of the Department of Forensic Medicine, Younsei University College of Medicine, South Korea.

The topic of one of the studies is "Forensic and genetic characterization of mtDNA from Pathans of Pakistan" and has been published online in the "International Journal of Legal Medicine" in Dec 2010. So it is sufficiently recent. The sample size in this study is 230 (sample of 230 unrelated Pashtun males from KP and FATA).

The other work titled "Genetic characterization of male lineages of Pathans from Pakistan" by the same researchers has just been presented (Aug 29 to Sept 03, 2011) in a conference on Forensic Genetics at Vienna, Austria. The sample size used in this study is 270. The abstract of this study is available online (http://www.isfg2011.org/fileadmin/is...A_2011_Web.pdf , page 116 of the pdf file). May be this work is published in the conference proceeding with the detailed research to be published as journal paper. So, it would take at least a few months to be available for use.

Another study that I mentioned has been carried out by Niaz Mohammad (from Afghanistan) that compares the genetic profiles in a sample of 125 Pashtuns from Afghanistan with Pashtuns of other regions. This study has been submitted to FSI Genetics and is awaiting acceptance.

[retro]

Hi retro, thanks for that informative comment. It is nice exchanging views with you on these matters. Could you give me the source of the last figure? As can be seen, Afghans(Pashtuns) are the most West Euroasians after Russians ( with relatively higher admixture of East Euroasian gene pool).

I believe, of all Pashtuns, Pashtuns of Afghanistan's south are the most unsullied followed by Pashtuns of FATA and Baluchistam.

Heres the link to the study on Uzbek mtDNA

http://209.85.48.16/4802/123/0/p1005689/The_mtDNA_composition_of_Uzbekistan.pdf

Uzbeks are intresting and I'd say the Tajiks influence upon Uzbeks and other Turkic Central Asians is considerable. I'd say that it's likely that the Western Eurasian, looking Pashtuns in Southern Afghanistan and other regions are displaced Northern Persians. As the Caspian sea, Urals and Western Steppes have Eurasiatic, Indo-Iranian associations. Which is why Uralic has Indo-Iranian browings.

The Kalash, Chitral and Nuristanis are genetically distinct (geographic isolation) and they aren't closely related to Pashtuns or Kashmiris. However they have ancient Western Eurasian/South Asian, ancestry and are likely fairly indigenous.

[Karachi]

^ i have seen one chart showing that kalash are up to 90% west eurasian, and very little south asian

By south asian they actually mean the people who came first to south asia some 60,000 years ago, the advasis of india are the most south asian who are a tribal people living in south and east india. North indians on average are a hybrid of west eurasian and ancient south asian dna. So it would make sense if kalash are mostly west eurasian and have very little ancient south asian dna

[Toramana]

By the way, I am a bit skeptical about the studies on Pakistan Pashtun DNA. The reason is the way the samples have been collected for these studies e.g., for the 2002 study (Y-Chromosome variation in Pakistani Population), the Pashtun sample was collected from the Department of Padraetic (sorry for spellings) of the Lady Reading Hospital, Peshawar. Now one can well imagine how representative this sample could be of Pashtuns. Lady Reading Hospital, esp its Pad Dept., is in Peshawar city and serves a limited geographical region (mostly a part of Peshawar city) and a small population that also including non-Pashtuns. As one can guess, the Pad Dept provided blood samples of newborn to the researchers. How much care did the Pad Dept staff might have taken to provide a good sample, one can well-imagine.

The other thing is, in all such studies non-Pashtun Pakistanis are/were involved and these guys have no clue as who is a Pashtun and who not. They most of the time call anyone from the north to be a Pashtun even if such person is not a native Pashto speaker and is not an ethnic Pashtun in the strict sense. Therefore, it would be no surprise that many non-Pashtuns were also wrongly included in the Pashtun sample.

Moreover, these studies have not covered Pashtuns of Baluchistan. Pashtuns of FATA have also not been fairly covered.

In my opinion, the most reliable DNA study so far is that done on Pashtuns of Afghanistan involving a sample size of 189 individuals quoted earlier in the thread. It also was published in the Journal of Legal Medicine, which has number 1 ranking based on impact facor. The guys also seem to be careful in selecting a sample and having a knowledge about the definition of Pastun ethnicity as prevalent among Pashtuns.

[Toramana]

Heres the link to the study on Uzbek mtDNA
http://209.85.48.16/4802/123/0/p1005...Uzbekistan.pdf

Uzbeks are intresting and I'd say the Tajiks influence upon Uzbeks and other Turkic Central Asians is considerable. I'd say that it's likely that the Western Eurasian, looking Pashtuns in Southern Afghanistan and other regions are displaced Northern Persians. As the Caspian sea, Urals and Western Steppes have Eurasiatic, Indo-Iranian associations. Which is why Uralic has Indo-Iranian browings.

The Kalash, Chitral and Nuristanis are genetically distinct (geographic isolation) and they aren't closely related to Pashtuns or Kashmiris. However they have ancient Western Eurasian/South Asian, ancestry and are likely fairly indigenous.

Thanks retro for the paper.

[Toramana]

The results of the first study (Forsenic and genetic characterization of mtDNA from Pathans of Pakistan) are summarised in the following chart. The haplogroup ratios are: South Asian 39.1%, East Euroasian 5.7%, and West Euroasian 55.6%