Afghanistan in 100 years time

[roadrunner]

Firstly, all those kiddies that can't discuss and can only namecall, please avoid this thread as it is for the adults.

So what do you believe Afghanistan will look like in 100 years? The borders.

Do you think the Durand line will still exist? Or do you think there'll be different borders? If so, why?

How do you think they will arise, if you do think this? Mature comments required.

[Admin Khan]

It depends on our political situation. If Pashtuns are continuously oppressed, I think we might see a new nation on the map soon, which will change the borders obviously. As of right now, we Pashtuns are suffering in both sides of this line. We do have a elite class amongst us in both sides of the Durrand who have historically exerted a considerable amount of influence on their respective governments. I think we all might agree that Pashtuns like Zahir Shah and their counterparts across the Durrand never represented the local tribesmen. I do not think "Loy Afghanistan" is possible though.

[Talal]

There are two factors that will guide both the future of Afghanistan and Pakistan

1. Institutions

2. Religion

I will try to describe my views regarding both countries in the context of these two factors..I must mention Pakistan and Afghanistan since both their future and that of their borders is very much interlinked.

Pakistan

For the better part of its history or essentially all of its history, Pakistan has been distraught with religious fundamentalism and weak government institutions. The sole powerhouse i.e. The Pakistan Army ran the country like they would run a garrison for 60 years..And they aren't to blame, they are the soul institution in Pakistan that is disciplined and is able to work efficiently and due to ineptness of the central government and the ethnic issues Pakistan inherited on August the 14th, it has tried to deal with them the best it could or rather the way any professional army would deal with them. However, while they kept Pakistan afloat for the most part they further weakened the credibility of a central government and to an extent they actually enabled weak governance by supporting corrupt politicians and making sure that Pakistan never got a political party that was able to go beyond the confines of their respective provinces. Whereas the Army themselves did in their own way strive to achieve national unity ( point in case being Ayub Khan )

Throughout all this period, an overwhelming majority of Pakistanis was uneducated, lacked any political sense and that was to be expected because these people had inherited the jageerdar and wadera mentality and generation after generation was born into that, they were enslaved within their own minds. So as a result there was never any effort to put credible people in charge, people rallied behind their jageerdars who rallied behind corrupt politicians to expand their own jageers. Through all of this you dont see any sense of national interest. Over the course of these sixty years, coups kept coming people kept struggling and Pakistan kept becoming a far cry from what Jinnah had dreamed of.

But Army wasn't enough to fill this power vaccum, and the army knew that..and when the oppurtunity came in terms of the Afghan-Russia war they waved the banner of Islam..When people have no hope left, they turn to God and that is what happened. Pakistan as a nation dived head first into Mullahism, the intelligence let lose the maulvis upon loudspeakers.. Religious fundamentalism was a tool that was used so effectively and it gave them such profound results both in Afghanistan and India that Pakistan chose to persist with it.

However by now, the nation itself is waking up to the nightmare..The media has gained momentum, judiciary is challenging the Army on its own turf, Provinces are waking upto their rights, the carnage brought about the TTP has further added fuel to fire. Musharraf the first dictator in history of Pakistan got chucked out by an "institution", the most fundamental one at that. Judiciary brought about changes, Pakistan for the time moved towards political reforms in Pakhtunkhwa not through the Army but through the government, the media has become a powerhouse of its own. The military has receded to the barracks and though they still exert pressure on the government, they cant on the judiciary..Pakistan is moving to build its institutions, corruption is still ripe but now Pakistanis see and they realize their own role

So where do we go from here ? Well we are at war with ourselves, our beliefs and ofcourse the mighty US..However, today we are also more aware, sensitive and willing to move forward on such core issues that have rotten the very core of our society.

Pakistan is striving to put institutions together, if we do that we can deliver justice and rights to our people, FATA must get political reforms, Balochis must be heard, and so much more needs to happen..but all of this will happen, i can say that for now we are headed in that direction

[Talal]

I will post on Afghanistan shortly

[graveyardofempires]

funny how its only pakis who jump to tell us what Afghanistan looks like over a 100 years.
the facts is we arent falbeens so we dont know how it will be in 100 years
lets talk about if pakistan will exist in another 15 years.

[roadrunner]

There are two factors that will guide both the future of Afghanistan and Pakistan

1. Institutions

2. Religion

I will try to describe my views regarding both countries in the context of these two factors..I must mention Pakistan and Afghanistan since both their future and that of their borders is very much interlinked.

Pakistan

For the better part of its history or essentially all of its history, Pakistan has been distraught with religious fundamentalism and weak government institutions. The sole powerhouse i.e. The Pakistan Army ran the country like they would run a garrison for 60 years..And they aren't to blame, they are the soul institution in Pakistan that is disciplined and is able to work efficiently and due to ineptness of the central government and the ethnic issues Pakistan inherited on August the 14th, it has tried to deal with them the best it could or rather the way any professional army would deal with them. However, while they kept Pakistan afloat for the most part they further weakened the credibility of a central government and to an extent they actually enabled weak governance by supporting corrupt politicians and making sure that Pakistan never got a political party that was able to go beyond the confines of their respective provinces. Whereas the Army themselves did in their own way strive to achieve national unity ( point in case being Ayub Khan )

Throughout all this period, an overwhelming majority of Pakistanis was uneducated, lacked any political sense and that was to be expected because these people had inherited the jageerdar and wadera mentality and generation after generation was born into that, they were enslaved within their own minds. So as a result there was never any effort to put credible people in charge, people rallied behind their jageerdars who rallied behind corrupt politicians to expand their own jageers. Through all of this you dont see any sense of national interest. Over the course of these sixty years, coups kept coming people kept struggling and Pakistan kept becoming a far cry from what Jinnah had dreamed of.

But Army wasn't enough to fill this power vaccum, and the army knew that..and when the oppurtunity came in terms of the Afghan-Russia war they waved the banner of Islam..When people have no hope left, they turn to God and that is what happened. Pakistan as a nation dived head first into Mullahism, the intelligence let lose the maulvis upon loudspeakers.. Religious fundamentalism was a tool that was used so effectively and it gave them such profound results both in Afghanistan and India that Pakistan chose to persist with it.

However by now, the nation itself is waking up to the nightmare..The media has gained momentum, judiciary is challenging the Army on its own turf, Provinces are waking upto their rights, the carnage brought about the TTP has further added fuel to fire. Musharraf the first dictator in history of Pakistan got chucked out by an "institution", the most fundamental one at that. Judiciary brought about changes, Pakistan for the time moved towards political reforms in Pakhtunkhwa not through the Army but through the government, the media has become a powerhouse of its own. The military has receded to the barracks and though they still exert pressure on the government, they cant on the judiciary..Pakistan is moving to build its institutions, corruption is still ripe but now Pakistanis see and they realize their own role

So where do we go from here ? Well we are at war with ourselves, our beliefs and ofcourse the mighty US..However, today we are also more aware, sensitive and willing to move forward on such core issues that have rotten the very core of our society.

Pakistan is striving to put institutions together, if we do that we can deliver justice and rights to our people, FATA must get political reforms, Balochis must be heard, and so much more needs to happen..but all of this will happen, i can say that for now we are headed in that direction

I suppose that's a nice summary. But not really much about how you view the future of Pashtun lands. I do agree that Pakistan is headed in the right direction. One point. Pakistan shouldn't be a democracy at the moment. It's not the correct time. If you want democracy, you need to first break off the feudal system. It still exists in Pakistan to some extent. Or perhaps you can try limited democracy. Only particular areas voting.

[roadrunner]

It depends on our political situation. If Pashtuns are continuously oppressed, I think we might see a new nation on the map soon, which will change the borders obviously. As of right now, we Pashtuns are suffering in both sides of this line. We do have a elite class amongst us in both sides of the Durrand who have historically exerted a considerable amount of influence on their respective governments. I think we all might agree that Pashtuns like Zahir Shah and their counterparts across the Durrand never represented the local tribesmen. I do not think "Loy Afghanistan" is possible though.

Why not?

The thought of a country whose constitution comprises of Pashtunwali would be a good start. I would of course insist such a country not follow the harsh interpretations of Pashtunwali that some Pashtuns follow and believe. But as a basis for a nation and culture, why not, if it's interpreted properly?

I also do not believe you can keep a border dividing the same people. The Durand line is more of a paper border. But can Loy Afghanistan exist and be part of two countries?

[graveyardofempires]

Afghanistan in 100 years?
TOP OF THE WORLD

[roadrunner]

Reading this stuff about pakistan, institutions, and religion is hilarious.

Those so-called fundamentalist Muslims have put on a great show. They are part of the crooked defunct system in Pakistan which includes the army.

Talal, you talk of the Pakistan Army. Let's examine this issue in a more simple way. The pakistan army flourishes on conflict. Pakistan benefits from continued war in Afghanistan. As this failed war in Afghanistan ends, Pakistan will restart the crap with India once again.

How is the Pakistan Army disciplined? They allow US to operate in most of their cities. They allow US to use drones to attack people within their borders. You call that discipline? What other country in the world would allow this?

You think North Korea or Iran would?

The list goes on. Pakistan as a nuclear power is a failed state.

You're one of the biggest fundamentalists on here.

[Nick]

In 100 years Afghanistan would still live inshallah but much bigger in terms of Map as well as populated in terms of People.

[roadrunner]

Roadrunner fool,

What is a fundamentalist? Since you are a typical uncle tom Muslim, the west has defined for you what a fundamentalist is and given it a bad name. A good Muslim is a fundamentalist: they follow the fundamentals of Islam.

Open your eyes, wear some glasses, and you will note that I said "so-called fundamentalist." Pakistani fundamentalists are a joke, their words are bought with money by their government.

Most Pakistani Muslims are Uncle tom/ cnn muslims like you lol

A fundamentalist I think is someone who views the world, religious interpretations, as either good and bad. Religious dualism.

The Salafists are a good example. My interpretation is the correct one, all the others are wrong, Kufr and evil.

It's a wide topic. Go post it somewhere else. This one is a look into the future.