Evolution?Creation? Quran teaches both

[PFgulalai]

This is one of the most illogical, absurd, and ambiguous article on the issue creationism vs evolution that I have read so far by the theists of his kind. Without any scientific or philosophical argument, the anonymous author is just bluffing all along about Darwin, DNA, heart transplants, and the role of science in the history of mankind. Apparently, he does not even know the meaning of SCIENCE, let alone EVOLUTION.

[Sheenka]

mashallah sholobay u r so clever

[Roshina]

SOURCE: Science Islam - Evolution Creation or BOTH?

I agree with Gulalai. It's not even worth reading.

This anonymous author provides NO evidence for the claims he/she makes against science. For example, he claims:

There is no DNA research pointing to a connection between apes and humans as was supposed by the scientists and those who had financed them over the years. In fact, the barnyard pig is closer to humans in many aspects, than a monkey or a gorilla. Consider the fact, doctors use the skin from pigs to replace needed tissue on burn victims and the famous movie actor, John Wayne had a pig's heart valve installed in his own heart in a 1977 operation to save his life. It worked, too - until his smoking caused him to die of cancer.

SERIOUSLY?!

I'm interested to see what this person's expertise lies in, since it's clearly not in science or, more specifically, evolution. Why do people waste their time (and ours) writing stuff they fail to prove well enough?

Even the stuff he says about the Quran/Bible ("The Quran says..." and "The Bible says..."), he doens't provide specific verses as examples in all instances.

Also according to the article:

Speaking of Charles Darwin, he was only an armature naturalist and had only observed the finches (birds) on the Galapagos Islands for the first time in the mid 1850s. He noticed that on each island the birds had different shaped beaks according to the type of food available on their particular island. For this reason, he assumed, the birds had progressed over millions of years and only the hardiest of the species had survived the climate and vegetation changes. However, this is totally inaccurate and was dismissed as a mere humor in a TV series on the educational channel in October of 1998. According to the scientists’ discoveries in that very same year, the effects of the weather phenomenon known as El Nino, the climate on these same exact islands had drastically changed in a single year within a number of months. And to their surprise, the eggs of the finches on each island hatched open producing birds with beaks already altered to accommodate the changes of their environment.

The commentator even said this shoots Darwin's theory completely down and he laughed.

LOL @ the first boldened part "Only an armature naturalist!" Right. According to whom? According to creationists? Well, duh. But what about according to scientists and others who know that evolution is more a fact than a "mere theory"? C'mon, guys. We seriously just READ stuff without thinking about them?

Anyway, tons of questions come to mind about this.
1. Who exactly was/is this commentator?
2. "For this reason"? Are you serious? This author REALLY needs to study Darwin's works -- or evolution in general.
3. "Dismissed as mere humor by an educational TV in 1998"? Wait, what? Which channel was that? Who were leading it? Who were its main scientists?
4. "According to the scientists' discoveries"? Which scientists? Why aren't their names given?

I could go on, and I would do the same analysis of the rest of the "essay," but in all honesty, it's not worth it.

Just know that the guy fails to provide evidence from any scientific point of view, and the Quranic verses he gives -- what makes him think that his understanding (or the understanding of those of his favorite scholars/interpreters) is the only possible or THE correct one to begin with?

Such people should not indulge in discourses on science and religion. They should just stick to religion, since they take the literal interpretation of religion so literally that they end up butchering both their own religion and religious understanding as well as serious and scientific studies.

[Palwasha]

But what about according to scientists and others who know that evolution is more a fact than a "mere theory"?

Evolution in what sense?

Islam acknowledge evolution of humans (and also animals), and how our bodies will have changed and adapted over time. However, it refutes Darwin's theory.

[PFgulalai]

Brilliant post, Qrra!

This all unreasonable autodidactism started in an organized form with M.Bucaille who wrote "Islam, Bible & Science (of course, eveyone is now aware of the Saudi petro-dollars he received for writing this book and being a personal physician of King Faisal).The paradox is that even though he tried to prove that all scientific accomplishments and facts are from Quran, instead of being converting to Islam,he remained an ardent Christian for his lifetime.

The practice of exalting religion by making a scapegoat out of science is not a new one. Before Muslims, Hindus and Crhistians have tried to dodge in the similar manner.However, where secularism saved Christians by separating the Church and Science, the oil-rich puritanical Muslim States, on the other hand, started using their petro-dollars to pay huge sums of money to western and muslim scientists to write books to impregnate the notion in the minds of people that the scientific truths discovered by the West have already been predicted in Quran. For this reason, many muslim scientists and young students consider Pervez Hoodboy as kafir and a USA agent (since he has studied and taught at MIT) but would consider Sultan Bashiruddin Mahmood as a true scientist (this guy actually thinks that JINNAT can be used to create nuclear technology).

So what happens when you tell your young muslim scientists that everything is a miracle of God and that science, or more precisely, humans have no role to play in the making of an aeroplane, steam engine, or Ipad? Well, they detract from science, labs, and logical arguments. If everything is in the holy books, what the hell are scientists doing in those labs which are not less than self-imposed solitary confinements? Why are they working hard day and night in the labs and trying to prevent us from H1N1 pandemics? Their salary is by far little compared to the hefty amounts paid to Mullahs and priets.

The holy book could satisfy the needs of a believer only, not a skeptical scientist. And look at the hypocricy..Whilst everyone, including these rich Arabs, are happy to board on planes and use those kool gadgets 24/7 and make tallest buildings in the world (and not the biggest research institution or University in the world), but when it comes to appreciating the Science behind those inventions, they simply act as consecrated myopics, completely devoid of rationality.

I would really like to see these Jinns who has the power to make electricity without using any raw material or to play with their babies when they have sex with the wives of humans! The creationists should be able to make this possible since eveything is there in the Holy Book.

Such people should not indulge in discourses on science and religion. They should just stick to religion, since they take the literal interpretation of religion so literally that they end up butchering both their own religion and religious understanding as well as serious and scientific studies.

[PFgulalai]

Evolution in what sense?

Evolution in the sense of Natural Selection and Genetic Drift to be the main driving and governing forces for the organic/biological evolution on earth.

Islam acknowledge evolution of humans (and also animals), and how our bodies will have changed and adapted over time. However, it refutes Darwin's theory.

The Theory of Evolution is exclusively a domain of Science..created, presented (Charles Darwin), and tested and verified continuously for the last 200 years by scientists from all across the world, mostly western ones. These scientists include anthropologists, archaelogists, evolutionary biologists, moelcular geneticists, developmental biologists, neuroscientists, as well as paleontologists etc.Islam does not acknowledge evolution of species as a domain of humans but of God.

[Roshina]

Evolution in what sense?

Islam acknowledge evolution of humans (and also animals), and how our bodies will have changed and adapted over time. However, it refutes Darwin's theory.

Are you sure it refutes Darwin's theory? Please give references from the Quran or hadiths that refute Darwin's theory of revolution in any way. (I'm not going to accept the arguments of people or so-called scholars, gwarey, kha? I need actual Quranic verses or hadiths.)

While you give those verses, also explain to us/me HOW they refute Darwin's theory.

However, before that, you're going to have to describe Darwin's theory.

Then we'll continue.

[Roshina]

This all unreasonable autodidactism started in an organized form with M.Bucaille who wrote "Islam, Bible & Science (of course, eveyone is now aware of the Saudi petro-dollars he received for writing this book and being a personal physician of King Faisal).The paradox is that even though he tried to prove that all scientific accomplishments and facts are from Quran, instead of being converting to Islam,he remained an ardent Christian for his lifetime.

EXACTLY!!! I was even told this guy (Maurice Bucaille) has converted to Islam, but I just found he actually never did convert to Islam. And he remains a Christian (I believe he's Christian -- right?). Now, Muslims have told me that "See, see? He converted to Islam after seeing that Islam supports science and all." Right. Now, as you said, Gulalai, we're aware of his reason for having written the book in the first place.

Oh the billions of innocents he's beguiled with his claims and statements that even an ordinary being like me can challenge and prove wrong . . .

[eusuphxai]

I dont know what your logics r but i m not ready to accept that my forfathers were monkies , za kho da shado aulad na yama u want to call urself one carry on

[Roshina]

I dont know what your logics r but i m not ready to accept that my forfathers were monkies , za kho da shado aulad na yama u want to call urself one carry on

LOL. Who told you your forefathers were monkeys? That's pretty sad, man.

[شمله ور خراساني]

its funny, gulalai & qrratugai claim to know so much more about science. I curious to know what kind of degrees you two hold in natural sciences.

[Roshina]

Gulalai, should I tell him? Or do you wanna take the honor this time?

[PFgulalai]

Lol eusuphxai. Don't fret!

All apes, including humans, evolved from a common ancestor. You can consider monkeys, Chimps, Gorillas,Orangutan as evolutionary cousins but not our twins.

It is like X (Common Ancestor) segregated into A (humans)+ B (chimps)+ C (Gorillas)..and not ABC.

I dont know what your logics r but i m not ready to accept that my forfathers were monkies , za kho da shado aulad na yama u want to call urself one carry on

[PFgulalai]

Sangar, I don't think degrees have anything to do with Science. Anyone can understand scientific theories if one bears an objective and logical approach and are interested in seeking truth. Qrratugai is one of them.

I always strictly refrain from bringing my degrees to make an impact of any degree (pun intended).Nonetheless, since you asked about my degrees so I should tell you that I have been invlolved in Science since my childhood. ( For my own convenience, I just copied my previous posts when I was asked about my qualification/interests by some folks...)

"Presently, I am studying cellular, molecular and biomedical studies with specialization in cancer genomics, neurosciences, and developmental genetics."

"Program-wise, I study 'cellular, molecular and biomedical studies'. But what I am actually studying is cancer genomics...recently I got interested in the neuro and develpmental aspects of malignant carcinomas...and just a week ago I thought of looking at some infectious agents for further exploration.What I actually study is evolution of humans...Phews!!"

"I am presently doing research on cancer genomics, human and microbial evolution, and highly infectious diseases and many other stuff--Phews!!Last year I was working on a project aimed at finding novel drug molecules for HIV, Dengues, Prostrate Cancer, Diabetes, and Multiple Sclerosis. Before that I worked on infectious diseases and am still working on two of the projects including polio problem in Afghanistan, Pakistan and some parts of Africa. Recently I have started working on breast cancer specifically. I am working with a team trying to find/analyze this one gene that we think is important enough to be targeted for therapeutic drug.
I also volunteer as a researcher at American Museum of Natural History for studying the human/microbial evolution and in The New York Academy of Sciences (Scientists without Borders) where I work on some projects related to the healthcare in the developing countries."

Now lets get back to the actual topic.....

its funny, gulalai & qrratugai claim to know so much more about science. I curious to know what kind of degrees you two hold in natural sciences.

[شمله ور خراساني]

Sangar, I don't think degrees have anything to do with Science. Anyone can understand scientific theories if one bears an objective and logical approach and are interested in seeking truth. Qrratugai is one of them.

I always strictly refrain from bringing my degrees to make an impact of any degree (pun intended).Nonetheless, since you asked about my degrees so I should tell you that I have been invlolved in Science since my childhood. ( For my own convenience, I just copied my previous posts when I was asked about my qualification/interests by some folks...)

"Presently, I am studying cellular, molecular and biomedical studies with specialization in cancer genomics, neurosciences, and developmental genetics."

"Program-wise, I study 'cellular, molecular and biomedical studies'. But what I am actually studying is cancer genomics...recently I got interested in the neuro and develpmental aspects of malignant carcinomas...and just a week ago I thought of looking at some infectious agents for further exploration.What I actually study is evolution of humans...Phews!!"

"I am presently doing research on cancer genomics, human and microbial evolution, and highly infectious diseases and many other stuff--Phews!!Last year I was working on a project aimed at finding novel drug molecules for HIV, Dengues, Prostrate Cancer, Diabetes, and Multiple Sclerosis. Before that I worked on infectious diseases and am still working on two of the projects including polio problem in Afghanistan, Pakistan and some parts of Africa. Recently I have started working on breast cancer specifically. I am working with a team trying to find/analyze this one gene that we think is important enough to be targeted for therapeutic drug.
I also volunteer as a researcher at American Museum of Natural History for studying the human/microbial evolution and in The New York Academy of Sciences (Scientists without Borders) where I work on some projects related to the healthcare in the developing countries."

Now lets get back to the actual topic.....

So do you think your ancestors were monkeys?