Pervez Hoodbhoy - Tracing the Roots of Religious Extremism

[Toramana]

Pervez Hoodbhoy - Tracing the Roots of Religious Extremism - YouTube

[ډګروال]

[Toramana]

Prof. Hoodbhoy debunks Hamza Tzortzis - YouTube

Prof. Hoodbhoy and Hamza Tzortzis - the Facts after their Debate Dec 2011 - YouTube

[Friend]

Toramana, what I don't like about Hoodbhoy besides many more things, is that he loose his temper very quickly. He gets emotional very quickly.
What he is trying to prove about miracles and non material world is total baseless.
He actually wants to prove Quran with the principle of science like the mutazilahs though Quran is much more higher than science.
And listen Quran is not a book of science but a book of signs.
Whatever in little amount Quran speaks about science is 100% correct.
Science has proved 80% of the Quranic verses about science to be 100% correct, the remaining 20% is beyond its reach.

[Hakim Khan Urgonai]

Is hoodboy really a name and that too an Islamic one?

[Friend]

Is hoodboy really a name and that too an Islamic one?

Ideologically he is an atheist who does not believe in the word of God.

[Hakim Khan Urgonai]

Ideologically he is an atheist who does not believe in the word of God.

Thanks for clarifying.

No wonder Toramana admires him.

[Toramana]

Hamza Tzortzis and Pervez Hoodbhoy on Religion & Rationality- A Discussion @ LUMS - YouTube

[Friend]

Thanks for clarifying.

No wonder Toramana admires him.

Yeah its surprising for me though he all the time gives us lecture about anti Punjabism and anti Pakistan this and that but hoodbhoy is an ideal to Toramana and he listen to hoodbhoy all the time lol. clear contradiction.

[Toramana]

Whatever in little amount Quran speaks about science is 100% correct.
Science has proved 80% of the Quranic verses about science to be 100% correct, the remaining 20% is beyond its reach.

Is there is any thing in Quran about the future scientific inventions and discoveries that you or any other scholar can point to me? Saying that Science has verified Quran or any other holy book is plain ridiculous. Scientific method is not based on conjectures and insinuations ---rather it is based on rigorous reasoning process and empirical data.

This is the same stance that the church adopted when Science was triumphant over religion during Renascence in Europe who would say whatever science is discovered is already there in the bible. By that claim they meant "there is no need for science".

[Friend]

Well, as I said Quran is not a book of science. It is a divine book revealed on the holy prophet for the guidance of the humankind. If it was a book of science then it must have touched physics, chemistry maths etc in details.
It has guided the human race on different aspect of life, like politics, society, worshiping, economy, international relations. It is a book to guide the man individually and collectively.
The purpose of the holy Quran is to tell the human race how to get salvation in this life and the life after death, the life of death is eternal and infinite. You being a mathmatician know better the meaning of infinity.
So the message of Quran is far higher than any other book. This life is nothing as compared to the other. It may be of maximum 100 years but think about the other infinite. So Allah wants us to get salvation in that life which is eternal and which has no ending.

[Hakim Khan Urgonai]

@Toramana

"Have not those who disbelieve known that the heavens and the earth were of one piece, then We parted them"

Qur`an 21:30

Isn't this clear evidence of the Big Bang?

[Toramana]

Well, as I said Quran is not a book of science. It is a divine book revealed on the holy prophet for the guidance of the humankind. If it was a book of science then it must have touched physics, chemistry maths etc in details.
It has guided the human race on different aspect of life, like politics, society, worshiping, economy, international relations. It is a book to guide the man individually and collectively.
The purpose of the holy Quran is to tell the human race how to get salvation in this life and the life after death, the life of death is eternal and infinite. You being a mathmatician know better the meaning of infinity.
So the message of Quran is far higher than any other book. This life is nothing as compared to the other. It may be of maximum 100 years but think about the other infinite. So Allah wants us to get salvation in that life which is eternal and which has no ending.

A Hindu or a Jew or a Christian or follower of any other religion has the same unwavering conviction about his/her holy book as you have i.e., it is divine and is the absolute truth. It might not actually be the authenticity of the claim but rather the intensity of the belief to make you make that claim (you believe in something without a proof due to psychological etc. reasons).

[Friend]

A Hindu or a Jew or a Christian or follower of any other religion has the same unwavering conviction about his/her holy book as you have i.e., it is divine and is the absolute truth. It might not actually be the authenticity of the claim but rather the intensity of the belief to make you that claim (you believe in something without a proof due to psychological etc. reasons).

lol, unfortunately the atheists and people who believe in science has mixed Islam with other religions like Christianity and Judism etc but whenever they have studied Islam with deep thinking they embraced it.
What I am saying is that science could not proved a single verse of the holy Quran to be untrue but it has proved 80% of the Quran to be true, the remaining 20% is, science has not reached to that level where it could prove the remaining 20%. May be It will prove it in the next 100 years or a part of it or never prove it. science is a process of learning and discovering the things that Allah has made already.

[Hakim Khan Urgonai]

A Hindu or a Jew or a Christian or follower of any other religion has the same unwavering conviction about his/her holy book as you have i.e., it is divine and is the absolute truth. It might not actually be the authenticity of the claim but rather the intensity of the belief to make you that claim (you believe in something without a proof due to psychological etc. reasons).

At the end of the day, everything comes from Allaah SWT so it doesn't matter what you do. But remember never to test the Elohim.