Biggest Islamist party banned in Bangladesh

[Friend]

Hey I'm not the one making fallacious claims here; if you want to see confused idiot look in the mirror at yourself

The fact you're trying to shift focus here when you're WRONG and moronically giving opinions on things you have had no idea of; just tells us you're desperate.

Stop rebuking others all the time like a whinning woman and be humble and try to create the quality of acceptance and submission in yourself.

[RevolutionThroughReason]

Stop rebuking others all the time like a whinning woman and be humble and try to create the quality of acceptance and submission in yourself.

Well that's ironic because weren't you just trying to "rebuke" others here? Whiningt like a woman; sounds like you heard this told you a lot when you whine. LOL

[BarakzaiAbdali]

1. The Dhaka middle class that in some ways essentially rule Bangladesh are predominantly secular, the intelligentsia at least.

This is partly because of Dhaka university and the West Bengal influence. The middle class Muslims of West Bengal living in symbiosis with Hindus developed a more secular outlook compared to mainly Muslim East Bengal (now Bangladesh). Dhaka University is essentially an extension of Aligarh university in India.

So secularism and aspirations for "modernity" have always thrived in Dhaka due to the power of Dhaka university and the intellectuals it produced, and other factors.

2. So the intelligentisa and literati in Bangladesh are quite secular (though socially even they are conservative) in terms of political views.

Despite this Hizbut Tahrir did make some inroads in to the Bangladeshi middle class and educated elite and have a presence, though they are officially banned now.

It is thought that one attempt at organizing a coup (NOTE not an attempted coup, but a plan to try and get support for one) involved people sympathetic to HT (Hizbut Tahrir) last year.

As for Hizbut Tahrir themselves, they will not succeed as they are a party deviating from true Islam and even traditional orthodoxy and though many of their supporters in Indonesia, Uzbekistan, the west don't realize it have heavy Arab nationalism in their ideology.

Their glorification of Islamic history pre-1924 is false as Muslims fought Muslims, Muslims were conquered, defeated, massacred, enslaved even before 1924. The mighty "Khilafah" they revere could not stop the lands of Turkestan or the Caucasus falling to the Orthodox Russians.

They venerate the Ottoman Caliphate but most of their followers are ignorant of history and facts e.g. the Ottomans legalized homosexuality in 1858.

Groups like Hizbut Tahrir, thrive on ignorance and false romanticized pseudo-history.

That article you posted was helpful. Thank you for that.

However, what are your thoughts about your own commentary above potentially glossing over just how middle class Bengladesh is?

http://www.tradingeconomics.com/bangladesh/rural-population-percent-of-total-population-wb-data.html

72% of the country is still considered rural as opposed to middle class.

Nearly half of that rural mass lives in poverty:

http://www.ruralpovertyportal.org/ar/country/statistics/tags/bangladesh

Apparently, this is where the jamaat derives a large level of support from:

http://www.ibtimes.com/bangladesh-declares-illegal-largest-islamist-party-jamaat-e-islami-blocking-it-fielding-candidates

"Further protests were expected, Reuters said, as Jamaat is very popular in rural areas."

I would say the reference to Turkish history is a bit simplified. Pretty much every quote available that claims the Tanzimat laws legalized homosexuality either attempts to group this claim under the shift away from the hadd laws, or they all cite, nearly in unity, this single source:


Legal Recognition of Same-sex Partnerships: A Study of National, European and International Law, page 438 to be exact, which is unavailable for any view and has to be examined for partiality. We need to get to page 438 to see exactly where in the Turkish Ottoman law codes they see this.

All of the quotes emanate from this paper which completely misses the mark but has become popular fodder for secularist discussion:

http://faith-matters.org/images/stories/fm-publications/the-tanzimat-final-web.pdf

It attempts to debunk the Caliphate concept, which is not at all a big deal, because most experts that analyze the words and motivations of the Islamists find that the Caliphate discussion encompasses something like 1% of their dialogue. The majority of their dialogue centers around grievances with respect to occupation and intervention in the Muslim world:

http://www.ruclip.com/video/zXJWikW0Gj8/emerson-vs-scheuer.html

Beck: Do you really think that (Al Qaeda terrorists) would stop (targeting America) if we -- I mean, what behavior is it that we could possibly change that would stop them when they`re looking for a global caliphate?

Scheuer: Well, I think a global caliphate is kind of the last refuge of the neoconservatives after they`ve been wrong about everything else. There`s no chance of a caliphate in our world any more than there is of all Christians turning the other cheek, sir. (emphasis added)

As another example:

https://blogs.law.harvard.edu/mesh/2008/09/osama_bin_laden_man_of_love/

"In this highly selective collection, Mr. Ibrahim picks and chooses from the enormous corpus of writings, statements, and interviews by bin Laden and al-Zawahiri to produce a slim volume which he claims will once and for all prove that Al Qaeda and its allies are bent on imposing a worldwide Caliphate to be governed by what the Necons are pleased to call Islamo-fascism. While the Caliphate is certainly a goal of bin Laden and other Islamists—because God has said the world will eventually be all Islamic—the Islamists know that it is as unlikely to appear in their or their grandsons’ lifetimes as Christians know that a uniform world of turning-of-the-cheek or loving-thy-neighbor is at best light years over the horizon. And though it must be agreed by all that the world is rife with Islamo-fascists, they all happen to be on the side of the United States, governing and terrorizing the Muslim populations of such states as Egypt, Algeria, Kuwait, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, the UAE, and other Muslim states." - Scheuer

[Badlun]

In rural areas where poverty prevail always religion will have an appeal because it ensures you at least peace in hereafter. The poor when cannot eat well, dress well and enjoy life materially seek at least some satisfaction in the religious stories.
If religion was something that good then why it cannot make inroads in urban developed parts of a country?

[BarakzaiAbdali]

In rural areas where poverty prevail always religion will have an appeal because it ensures you at least peace in hereafter. The poor when cannot eat well, dress well and enjoy life materially seek at least some satisfaction in the religious stories.
If religion was something that good then why it cannot make inroads in urban developed parts of a country?

It can and has for instance in Anatolia. The predominant issue is that even in urban areas, Islam does have a strong emphasis. The real issue is militant and disproportionately vocal secular fascists. Once this group is dealt with it definitively then there will be a nice lasting harmony between the urban and rural folks as there should be.

[RevolutionThroughReason]

In rural areas where poverty prevail always religion will have an appeal because it ensures you at least peace in hereafter. The poor when cannot eat well, dress well and enjoy life materially seek at least some satisfaction in the religious stories.
If religion was something that good then why it cannot make inroads in urban developed parts of a country?

That has more to do with historical policies established by the British and French to promote people who forgo their religion for material rewards than actual relationship between education and religiosity

[asad71]

Sukhranjan puts incumbents (Awami League) in the spot

NEW Age stands vindicated by the Kolkata-based daily Telegraph’s report that Sukhranjan Bali, a war crimes witness who, we reported on May 16, was abducted from the International Crimes Tribunal premises on November 5, 2012 allegedly by local law enforcers, illegally detained for about six weeks and then smuggled to India near the end of December, on Friday pleaded with the Indian Supreme Court not to deport him to Bangladesh.

As mentioned in New Age on Sunday, the Telegraph quotes Sukhranjan as having told the court that Sheikh Hasina’s government would eliminate him as he had turned hostile during the ongoing trial.

It is worth noting here that on May 22, less than a week after New Age had run the report on the alleged abduction, the foreign minister said the Bangladesh mission in Kolkata could not ascertain whether Sukhranjan was among the 130 Bangladeshis detained in Kolkata jail. The Telegraph report certainly establishes that the Awami League-led government may not have told the whole truth.

Such vindication leaves us rather sad though because it once again accentuates some unpleasant questions about the war crimes trial that seem to be increasingly gaining traction in society. We have written in these columns time and again that, although the perpetrators of war crimes and crimes against humanity during Bangladesh’s war of liberation in 1971 should have been probed, prosecuted and punished a long time back, the AL-led government deserves credit for getting the process under way. Moreover, we have maintained all along that the involvement of Jamaat-e-Islami and its top leaders in war crimes and crimes against humanity is historically proven. Yet, we have always insisted, as have conscious and conscientious sections of society, that the trial needs to be credible and transparent, and must meet the international standards, because we believe the trial is also a test for Bangladesh and its people to prove their commitment to the rule of law and justice.

Regrettably, however, almost from the start, the incumbents have sought to own the outcome of the trial as a partisan trophy of sort. Coupled with ineptitude and insincerity of most of the prosecutors, such partisan overkill has naturally raised questions about fairness of the trial and even independence of the tribunal itself.

Moreover, questions have also been raised about the possibility of mistaken identity in case of at least two convicts — one of them has been sentenced to death and other to life imprisonment. Sukhranjan’s appeal to the Supreme Court in India against deportation to Bangladesh only lends credence to such questions and also allegations that the incumbents may be influencing, directly or indirectly, the trial and are willing to go any length to do so.

Suffice to say, the AL-led government has a lot of explaining to do to the people, primarily, and also to the international community, which has been closely following the proceedings of the war crimes trial. First of all, the government needs to come up with an unequivocal statement about the claims made by Sukhranjan and constitute an independent inquiry into allegations of foul play by a section of the law enforcers. Also, it needs to arrange for repatriation of Sukhranjan and maximum security for him upon his return. Most importantly, Sukhranjan must be allowed to speak to the media without fear or favour.

Sukhranjan puts incumbents in the spot

[RevolutionThroughReason]

I actually feel Indians should retake Bangladesh and make it apart of India. It would help with Bangladesh's overpopulation.

Afghans should help India in accomplishing this. We should actually send Afghans to Bangladesh since Bangladeshis are willing to kiss Pashtuns feet and then use that to undermine Bangladeshi political autonomy to allow India greater inroads.