What is the Difference Between Nationalism & Patriotism?

[Nadir Shah]

I disagree, I repeat, you are not listening. As we speak, Provinces like Helmand,Qandahar,Paktiya,Kunar and etc. Not only support Taliban but they have given them a place to stay. Don't fall prey to western media.

In turn, I would advise you not to fall for the ISI and ISPR propaganda. The hoax of the Taliban as a Pashtun Nationalist force is a tool for the Pakistanis to de-stabilize Afghanistan. The people of Helmand, Kandahar, Paktiya and Kunar accepted the Taliban regime under duress and out of fear. Do you think the people of North Korea or Iran support the Kims (or who ever the Eternal President is) and the Mullahs? No. The biggest supporter of the Taliban is Pakistan. All the Mujahids, who fought against the Godless Soviets in the Jihad Fee Sabeel Ill Laah, support the Afghan Government. Their opinion, as the Holy Mujahids, should carry more weight than the opinions of the colonels and generals of ISI.

I've traveled around the world. Don't think of me as house-wife who sits home and watches Indian movies. I have been the Taliban capital. I have been to Kabul and etc.

So, what did you learn from your many world travels? Do the Afghan dispora support the Taliban?

No its was not a support for a Govt. India supported Tajiks so they can force to collapse the Taliban. India, like Iran was scared of the Taliban movement fearing it might influence there Muslim population.

But that is good, right? 'India wanted the Taliban to collapse', that is not a sin. You don't support the Taliban, do you?

India does not care about Afghanistan, What part of you is hard to comprehend Malgariya? India wants to use Afghanistan for its strategic interests against its regional enemy, It starts with a P and ends with stan

Malgare, You are a very good and intelligent person. India wants to use Afghanistan for it's strategic interests against Pakistan, hmmm. Well, I think it is the other way round, but even If this is taken to be true, then the interests of India and Afghanistan converge because it is an established fact that Pakistan is the biggest enemy of Afghanistan.
Malgare, I am not of the opinion that India is helping Afghanistan out of the goodness of heart or out of love for the Afghans, but as long as the relationship between Afghanistan and India is beneficial to Afghanistan, I don't care.

[KhalsaWarrior]

I disagree, I repeat, you are not listening. As we speak, Provinces like Helmand,Qandahar,Paktiya,Kunar and etc. Not only support Taliban but they have given them a place to stay. Don't fall prey to western media.

I've traveled around the world. Don't think of me as house-wife who sits home and watches Indian movies. I have been the Taliban capital. I have been to Kabul and etc.

No its was not a support for a Govt. India supported Tajiks so they can force to collapse the Taliban. India, like Iran was scared of the Taliban movement fearing it might influence there Muslim population.


India does not care about Afghanistan, What part of you is hard to comprehend Malgariya? India wants to use Afghanistan for its strategic interests against its regional enemy, It starts with a P and ends with stan

Jasmine, I would partially agree with both you and NadirShah here. India supported the Tajiks not because they had any enmity with the Pashtuns, but because of Taliban. India would have opposed Taliban regardless of the ethnic group that it comprised of.

And it would be wrong to say India doesnt care about Afghanistan. I dont say Indians are angels, they surely want to serve their interests but I would say they are using the right means to do that. Building infra, hospitals, schools, govt. buildings, training bureaucrats and the armed forces is the way that India chose. Surely India sees this as a way to gain the goodwill and trust of the Afghan people and the govt. India could have also put soldiers on the grounds as a part of the ISAF, but it chose not to. That to me is a clear sign of India's intentions in Afghanistan.

[khyaal]

becoming more loyal to the king than the king himself. Just read Nawaz Sharif's confession in today's news.


"
ISLAMABAD: Pakistan should stop trying to influence affairs in Afghanistan, the opposition leader said Tuesday, while admitting that the pro-Afghan Taliban policy he pursued when he was prime minister in the 1990s was a failure.


Nawaz Sharif's comments come as he tries to gain political traction and deflect criticism that his party is beholden to extremist elements. Just last week, he pushed the government to open talks with elements of the Pakistani Taliban, and the ruling party agreed to his proposal to hold a national conference on stopping terrorism.
The remarks also come as Pakistan tries to weigh in on reconciliation efforts between Afghanistan's government, the US and the Afghan Taliban.
In an interview with Pakistan's Dunya TV that aired Monday and Tuesday, Sharif appeared to renounce a policy he pursued with vigor while twice prime minister in the 1990s.
''Pakistan should abandon this thinking that Pakistan has to keep influence in Afghanistan,'' said Sharif, who heads the Pakistan Muslim League-N party. ''Neither will they accept influence, nor should the pro-influence-minded people here insist on it.''
''Our policy in the past has failed. Neither will such a policy work in future. We have a centuries-old relationship, and we can maintain this relationship only when we remain neutral and support the government elected there with the desire of the Afghan people.''
It was unclear where Sharif would stand on the reconciliation efforts in Afghanistan.....


http://www.dawn.com/wps/wcm/connect/...hanistan-ss-03

[BLS_1919v2.0]

becoming more loyal to the king than the king himself. Just read Nawaz Sharif's confession in today's news.


"
ISLAMABAD: Pakistan should stop trying to influence affairs in Afghanistan, the opposition leader said Tuesday, while admitting that the pro-Afghan Taliban policy he pursued when he was prime minister in the 1990s was a failure.


Nawaz Sharif's comments come as he tries to gain political traction and deflect criticism that his party is beholden to extremist elements. Just last week, he pushed the government to open talks with elements of the Pakistani Taliban, and the ruling party agreed to his proposal to hold a national conference on stopping terrorism.
The remarks also come as Pakistan tries to weigh in on reconciliation efforts between Afghanistan's government, the US and the Afghan Taliban.
In an interview with Pakistan's Dunya TV that aired Monday and Tuesday, Sharif appeared to renounce a policy he pursued with vigor while twice prime minister in the 1990s.
''Pakistan should abandon this thinking that Pakistan has to keep influence in Afghanistan,'' said Sharif, who heads the Pakistan Muslim League-N party. ''Neither will they accept influence, nor should the pro-influence-minded people here insist on it.''
''Our policy in the past has failed. Neither will such a policy work in future. We have a centuries-old relationship, and we can maintain this relationship only when we remain neutral and support the government elected there with the desire of the Afghan people.''
It was unclear where Sharif would stand on the reconciliation efforts in Afghanistan.....


http://www.dawn.com/wps/wcm/connect/...hanistan-ss-03

Ajjb khalk dee che Afghanistan ao Qibaeel kae orr balaedall dyuu ba gaddaedal...khpl strategic depth tha dder khushaala woo. Wuss ae lag oleedall da dhamakae zorr ao thaobagaar shull. Khair this is a good sign, they learned their lesson to leave our gran hewad alone.

[khyaal]

We knew they couldn't sustain it for long but the enemies among us in the guise of Pashtun nationalists were more interested in elections and power politics rather than the blood and miseries of pashtuns/afghans. If only they could get ready for a little sacrifice, things would have settled long ago.

[Nadir Shah]

We knew they couldn't sustain it for long but the enemies among us in the guise of Pashtun nationalists were more interested in elections and power politics rather than the blood and miseries of pashtuns/afghans. If only they could get ready for a little sacrifice, things would have settled long ago.

Khyaal Lala, remember the days when the state apparatus of Pakistan was all for the Taliban. Now the tables have been turned. The Pakistani state is on clutches. It cannot afford losing the 3.5b $ of US Aid.

[khyaal]

I guess this is a reason why we should not fall prey for many of those self-proclaimed nationalistic leaders.

can someone tell me that accomplishments of Achakzai ?

Nazia asked the same question yesterday or the day before and no answer.

Now your theme and agenda is becoming more and more clear. What, btw, do you want them to do, and why you always put achievement as a yard stick of following a purist pashtun political party? What is the achievment of Pakistan for Pashtuns?

[Nadir Shah]

I guess this is a reason why we should not fall prey for many of those self-proclaimed nationalistic leaders.

can someone tell me that accomplishments of Achakzai ?

Nazia asked the same question yesterday or the day before and no answer.

What is the benchmark against which you are comparing Mashar Mahmood Khan? What do you mean by 'accomplishments'?
Malgare, ideological struggles take time. Do not forget that PkMAP is faced with a very formidable state propaganda apparatus. Plus, there are certain other 'home-grown' hindrances which are not approriate to be spoken of here.
PkMAP has the most radical and the most pro-Pashtun manifesto.
Lemme ask you this: Has any other person spoken so clearly and unequivocally defended the Pashtun cause as Mashar Mahmood Khan?

[Nadir Shah]

Do you think Pakistan deserves 4 billion?

This war on terror has costed them 50billion dollars.

Source: The New Nation - Internet Edition

The War on Terror may have cost Pakistan 50 b $ (majority of the destruction has been in Pakistan) but Pakistan has earned much more in the past 30 years through its own War For Terror.

[KhalsaWarrior]

[QUOTE]

India does not care about Afghanistan at all. India hates Pakistan, It wants to see Pakistan collapse.

when Pakistan decides to support Pashtuns by telling them how bad Tajiks are, India does not want to see a Pashtun-dominated Govt backed by the support of Punjabis in ISI.

I would like to disagree with that. I say again, India has no problem with Pashtuns. It just happens that Pak supports the Taliban which is majority Pashtun. Karzai is a Pashtun, do you think India has any problems with him?

Well a relationship can never be beneficial since India will invest where it sees its strategic interests. I sense a fallacy.

I think you are smart enough to understand that no country would do otherwise. Everybody is serving their own interests. The point here is if India's strategic interests align with that of the Afghans (even partially) then shouldnt that be seen as a good thing?

[khyaal]

Do you think Pakistan deserves 4 billion?

This war on terror has costed them 50billion dollars.

Source: The New Nation - Internet Edition

lol. 50 billion dollars. Why didn't they pay their debt first which they owe to the World Bank and IMF for the last several decades?

[KhalsaWarrior]

lol. 50 billion dollars. Why didn't they pay their debt first which they owe to the World Bank and IMF for the last several decades?

This is actually hilarious in many ways. Pakistan creates a problem (the Taliban) uses it to control a country and then when the problem gets out of hand, the world pays them to control the problem.

[Nadir Shah]

[QUOTE=Jasmine;75620]

Historically India has never supported Pashtuns. Why is that?



No, I think different. our interests might seem like they are beneficial but if Pakistan is unhappy do you think they will leave us alone?

So yes I thank you Khalsawarrior for building our parliament. yes I thank you for everything you have done, but Pakistan will just blow it up the next week.

Can you please provide instances from the history?

Pakistan's designs are now exposed throught the world. Pakistan's influence in Afghanistan is fading fast.

[Nadir Shah]

How much do you think they have earned?

Lets put it this way: Pashtuns have lost everything in the past 30 years while the Punjabi generals have become millionaires.

[Nadir Shah]

That money was not what they necessarily SPENT. It was in infra-structure damages,expenses,debt. That is how much it has cost them.

Are you concerned at all about what this Pakistani game has cost the Pashtuns?