The next US President?

[ډګروال]

why in the hell should i do community service when i pay taxes to have it done,hell no.
and as for 3rd party,like i said its not about winning.

offcourse one of the two will win since the majority of voters are christian evagelists and offcourse you need the blessing of the jews.
these two are important groups ,one having enough voters and other control of media and alot of money to spend.Both of these groups have the protection of israel and unconditional support as center of the theme.
the christian evangelists will do what they are asked by the likes of AIPAC and offcourse according to the bible the jews are the chosen ones.

i dont know why it should be deemed unislamic.
if that is deemed unislamic than following the laws of the country you live in is also unislamic since they are made by the same system and people.
offcourse if you dont vote you still have to accept thee laws.

[Pisho]

The most muslims died in obama bibis office he has some Muslim in him but that don't change nothing: source my college professor lol
And voting does nothing anyways ur thinking ur making a change but u ain't doing nothing
I say just sit back and relax and just watch if there is a war that break out just move to another country haha jk

[Gulalai]

why in the hell should i do community service when i pay taxes to have it done,hell no.
and as for 3rd party,like i said its not about winning.

offcourse one of the two will win since the majority of voters are christian evagelists and offcourse you need the blessing of the jews.
these two are important groups ,one having enough voters and other control of media and alot of money to spend.Both of these groups have the protection of israel and unconditional support as center of the theme.
the christian evangelists will do what they are asked by the likes of AIPAC and offcourse according to the bible the jews are the chosen ones.

i dont know why it should be deemed unislamic.
if that is deemed unislamic than following the laws of the country you live in is also unislamic since they are made by the same system and people.
offcourse if you dont vote you still have to accept thee laws.

LOL because its a good way to give back that way ^.^

well ok so if you're a muslim who is voting, then you're voting for the "less bad" person so there for you want the person you're voting for to win. if its not about winning then whats it about?

& i am pretty sure that most if not all of the american muslims i know voted for obama....

from what i've read/heard some deem it to be unislamic or shirk because you're choosing to be a part of a man-made governmental system vs a government based on islam but there are also those who say its ok to vote for the "over all person" so the less bad person

personally i would rather not vote because i dont want my name to be under someone who i dont agree with on big matters like their foreign policy which effects our own countries, and i dont see the point in voting for someone who isn't one of the two who will actually win because its not like the less popular candidates earn something for the votes they get lol
plus since i wouldnt want this government for back home it seems weird taking part in it's process... thats like saying "no i dont like to play this game, its wrong, its bad, i wouldnt want my family playing this game, but ok since im already here and you want me to play then i'll just join that team & i wont play the game but i'll still complain when the leader of the team does things i dont like"
i may be a citizen of this country and i might have some responsibilities as a citizen but i wont let me being a citizen contradict my beliefs as a muslim.. i have the right to vote and i have the right not to vote.

laws like what? like if there was a draft and american muslims had to go to war in muslim countries? im sure muslims would rather sit in a jail cell.
but if its something like paying taxes where the money is used to fund wars you dont support then yeah i guess theres no way around that, but thats a whole other topic on its own :/
but bringing it back to voting, dagha majbori da where as voting is a choice.


anywayssss some say its haram, some say its halal, some say what ever in between so everyone just do what ever you want... in the end Allah knows best & if you're in doubt then its better to avoid doubtful things -.- the worse that can come out of not voting is having people tell you how "un-useful" you are to the contributions of this society and the people of this country etc etc etc

[pashtanajan]

well i can see that you are merely a biased person who thinks taliban are not Afghans who resist occupation of the country.

you are hypcrite one who thinks his views are above an Afghan villagers views or the over majority of Afghans who dont want to be invaded are wrong and isi agents.IF you want a normal discussion to happen first you need ot be unbiased and unhypocritical and also quit the punchlines.

First of all, I'm female – does the 'pashtanajan' give you any clue about my gender? Second of all, me unbiased? I'm all for open-thought and other possibilites, however, you haven't given me any intelligent form of reasoning from which I would be wavered from my views. All you've said is, " you are merely a biased person who thinks taliban are not Afghans who resist occupation of the country." That's quite an intelligent statement you have there, oh yes – of course the Taliban are Afghans and they're fighting the occupation of the country – now I should go support them (this is sarcasm, if you can't detect it).

If suicide bombing, killing children and women is a form of resistance, then I'd rather surrender.

[randolph85]

unless you're voting for either barry o or mittens, your vote doesn't count. it counts even less if you aren't a swing state. voting for a 3rd party candidate is useless and the symbolic nature of doing so means absolutely nothing when voting is used to determine a winner. if you are naive and just want to vote for a 3rd party candidate who will get 0.002 of the overall vote just to give yourself a pat on the back for participating in the democratic process, then by all means.

so if i have to chose between a war criminal, a future war criminal, and a nobody, i think ill sit this one out.

[ډګروال]

First of all, I'm female – does the 'pashtanajan' give you any clue about my gender? Second of all, me unbiased? I'm all for open-thought and other possibilites, however, you haven't given me any intelligent form of reasoning from which I would be wavered from my views. All you've said is, " you are merely a biased person who thinks taliban are not Afghans who resist occupation of the country." That's quite an intelligent statement you have there, oh yes – of course the Taliban are Afghans and they're fighting the occupation of the country – now I should go support them (this is sarcasm, if you can't detect it).

If suicide bombing, killing children and women is a form of resistance, then I'd rather surrender.

sorry about mistaking our gender as im not well versed in english and sometimes just make mistakes.

how is my reasoning wrong?

arent you the one who claims the opposition/taliban are foreign agents and invaders?
if so than doesn that mean you support the occupation by default?
no one is asking your support for taliban neither do they require our support ,they get their support from peopel who constantly live under occupation.
all im saying is lets be unbiased about it and atleast think harder.
are you claiming that taliban aim is to kill women and children?
how do you know know?

[pashtanajan]

sorry about mistaking our gender as im not well versed in english and sometimes just make mistakes.

how is my reasoning wrong?

arent you the one who claims the opposition/taliban are foreign agents and invaders?
if so than doesn that mean you support the occupation by default?
no one is asking your support for taliban neither do they require our support ,they get their support from peopel who constantly live under occupation.
all im saying is lets be unbiased about it and atleast think harder.
are you claiming that taliban aim is to kill women and children?
how do you know know?

This is how the taliban resists 'occupation'. Watch the video, are these freedom fighters?

Let me enlighten you.

Watch this documentary:

Meeting the Taliban part 1/4 - YouTube

Meeting the Taliban part 2/4 - YouTube

Watch from 6:40 and onwards in part 2. This is how the Taliban are trying to 'resist' occupation, by using young boys they've indoctrinated. Tell me, why don't these Talibans strap bombs to themselves instead of young children? Why are they putting young children in the front line? After seeing this, do you agree with this? Also, notice how at 7:15 the journalist asks, "What does he mean by that? Islam is a religion of peace as well..." and the Taliban translating this instead asks the boy in Pashto, "Ta wele da tasmeem newalay che zan walozay (Why have you decided to commit suicide?) –*thus, notice how the Taliban translater completely ignores the part where the journalist has said, "Islam is a religion of peace..." This is sure proof that A. the boy knows only as much of Islam as he has been taught by the Taliban and B. the Taliban are ignoring other fundamental parts of Islam to progress their personal agenda.

Yes... and you call the Taliban resistors? How?

Meeting the Taliban part 3/4 - YouTube

Meeting the Taliban part 4/4 - YouTube

Am I supporting the occupation? Of course not. However, am I doing anything drastic to fight it? I can't. What can I do? Firstly, due to barriers put on females in our culture, I can't do anything. What do you want me to do? All I can do is donate to charity, help the orphans out, try my best to donate to trusted non-profit organizations that try to aid the people of Afghanistan*– all of which I'm doing. However, tell me –*can I join politics – can I, only one person and that too female, fight tyrants, warlords, the Taliban and NATO?

Again, you're being illogical.

For me to do anything, I must have aid from fellow Afghan males, who more often than not are unwilling to help. Those that wish to help, more often than not to do not have the power within their hands to do so –*fighting this occupation is futile and fruitless. Our only way to fight the occupation is through educating Afghanistan's future. What's killing our nation the most is ignorance. We've fought enough with violence —*with force – we must fight with the greatest but least violent weapon –*education.

Now, let me ask you. What are you doing to fight this occupation? It seems you're sitting comfortably in front of your monitor judging others for not doing anything, and calling the Talibans resistors. As I've said before, it seems you're a hypocrite and a bigot.

Moreover, you say the Taliban are gaining support by people who constantly live under 'occupation'. You think, that during the times of the Taliban, civilians were not oppressed? They had their liberties and rights? Furthermore, let me tell you this –*most common Pashtuns (excluding city dwellers) do not support the Taliban or Karzai's government. They still go by their own laws and code. Most Pashtuns still live in a TRIBAL system, a central government means NOTHING to them. Very FEW Pashtuns in Afghanistan ate supporting the Taliban. Both Karzai's government and the Talibans are oppressors in their eyes. Also, our tribal system is one of the reasons all previous and current governments in Afghanistan have only been able to have full control within the perimeters of Kabul.

Here's an interesting recent article:

Fed up with the Taliban closing their schools and committing other acts of oppression, men in a village about 100 miles south of Kabul took up arms late last spring and chased out the insurgents with no help from the Afghan government or U.S. military.

Small-scale revolts in recent months such as the one in Kunsaf, mostly along a stretch of desert south of the Afghan capital, indicate bits of a grass-roots, do-it-yourself anti-insurgency that the U.S. hopes Afghan authorities can transform into a wider movement. Perhaps it can undercut the Taliban in areas they still dominate after 11 years of war with the United States and NATO allies.

The effort in Ghazni Province looks like a long shot. The villagers don’t readily embrace any outside authority, be it the Taliban, the U.S. or the Afghan government.

American officials nonetheless are quietly nurturing the trend, hoping it might become a game changer, or at least a new roadblock for the Taliban. At the same time, they are adamant that if anyone can persuade the villagers to side with the Afghan government, it’s the Afghans — not the Americans.
“If we went out there and talked to them, we would taint these groups, and it would backfire,” said Army Brig. Gen. John Charlton, the senior American adviser to the Afghan military in provinces along the southern approaches to Kabul.

Gen. Charlton, who witnessed similar stirrings in Iraq while serving as a commander there in 2007, said that in some cases the Taliban are fighting back fiercely, killing leaders of the armed uprisings. In Kunsaf, for example, the Taliban killed several village fighters in skirmishes as recently as last month, but the Taliban suffered heavy losses and have thus far failed to retake the village.

The American general visited two military bases in the area last week — one in Ghazni's Ab Band district that was vacated by a U.S. Army brigade as part of September’s U.S. troop drawdown, and the other in nearby Gelan district, where Afghan paramilitary police forces are moving in to fill the gap left by the Americans. Charlton found far fewer paramilitary police there than he says are needed; he is nudging the Afghans to get hundreds more into the area to put more pressure on the Taliban in support of the village uprisings.
Gen. Charlton said the U.S. and its coalition partners are taking a behind-the-scenes role — encouraging the Afghans to court the villagers while finding a role for U.S. Special Forces soldiers to forge the villagers into a fighting force as members of the Kabul-sanctioned Afghan Local Police.

Some have compared the apparently spontaneous uprisings to the Iraq war’s Anbar Awakening of 2007, in which Sunni Arab tribes in the western province of Anbar turned on al Qaeda in their midst, joined forces with the Americans and dealt a blow that many credit with turning the tide of that conflict. The U.S. armed and paid the tribal fighters and sought to integrate them into Iraqi government forces.

By coincidence, the first localized movement to draw outside attention in Afghanistan was in Ghazni's Andar district, about 100 miles south of Kabul. Thus, some U.S. analysts are calling this the Andar Awakening, drawing an Iraq war parallel that even the most optimistic American commanders say is a stretch.

“That just builds some false expectations,” said Army Lt. Col. Kevin Lambert, a 1st Infantry Division battalion commander whose area of operations includes Ghazni. He nonetheless is encouraged that after initially balking, the Afghan government now is trying to leverage the Andar unrest. It has installed a new district governor who Col. Lambert said is sympathetic to the uprisings and made changes in the local security forces. It also has authorized a U.S. Special Forces team to work with the villagers.
“It’s going to take time; it’s not going to be an Anbar (Iraq) sweep,” Col. Lambert said. “It is going to be village by village, district by district, and we may not see the results of this for some years.”

Senior officers at the U.S. military headquarters sound even more cautious.
“So far what we are not seeing is a coalescing of it into a greater movement,” said Australian Maj. Gen. Stephen Day, the plans chief for the international coalition’s joint command. He said that “nothing as substantial” as the Andar uprising is happening elsewhere in the country.
U.S. officials say there are signs of anti-Taliban resistance, or at least sentiment, in a dozen or more villages in Andar and at various locations in the nearby districts of Qarabagh, Moqur and Ab Band. There have been small-scale uprisings also in provinces closer to Kabul, including Laghman and Logar.

The question Gen. Day says he’s asking is, “Is there a golden thread here that we can pull on that will unite them all?”

It is with that possibility in mind — and an awareness that U.S. influence here is likely to shrink as its forces continue to withdraw — that the Americans are encouraging the Afghan military to complete a plan dubbed Operation Solidarity to make what it can of this unexpected new opening in Ghazni province. Gen. Charlton, the American adviser to the commander of the main Afghan army group in this region, said this should be a major focus for the Afghans over the winter, when harsh weather tends to lessen the pace of combat operations.

The three-stage plan, designed with U.S. assistance and launched by the Afghan 203rd Corps in September, begins with an assessment of individual village uprisings and their potential for success. Those deemed worthy of pursuing are then approached by the Afghan military, in some cases to provide weaponry. Gen. Charlton described the third stage as a networking effort “to stitch these groups together into something larger.”

Gen. Charlton, who was a central player in fostering the Anbar Awakening in Iraq as a brigade commander in the provincial capital of Ramadi in 2007, is notably optimistic about the nascent Afghan uprisings.

“Over the course of the winter, if this thing works out right, these groups will be supported, they will come together a little bit more and by the springtime the insurgency will not have the popular support bases that they are used to having,” he said.

Gen. Charlton said he’s not discouraged by the merely incremental progress thus far.

“To me, the Taliban are doing the same thing that al Qaeda was” in Iraq, he said. “They used these really oppressive, violent tactics that eventually alienate these populations. And I see that same dynamic here,” even though that may not be enough to ignite a broader uprising.

“It may not change Afghanistan, but if it can help deny some support bases in Ghazni, we’ll take that. That is something we haven’t had.”

Taken from: http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...#ixzz2BV8W3hVa


You see, the people of Afghanistan are tired of the Taliban, of Karzai, and of NATO. Do Afghans need change? Yes. A new government? Yes. But, by supporting Taliban, most Afghans know they're just going to go back in time.

[ډګروال]

you have just posted a whole load of garbage to make your case for your preconceived view but you FAIL.
as if the CFR link on other thread wasnt enough to know what kind of tool you are.
now you are beginning to sound like a mouthpiece for some thinktank.
i dont have time to waste on drones such as you.

move along.

ps:if i start to give you analysis of these news reports and docs,you will be crying.

[khushal]

you know some people even consider it shirk since you're giving the right to rule and the right of judgement to this government

Those people are uninformed. When you vote your not giving anyone the right to rule, your taking away their right to rule. You can vote for or you can vote against a person or party.

On a side note: this thread is about voting, take the other argument to another thread please.

[khushal]

unless you're voting for either barry o or mittens, your vote doesn't count. it counts even less if you aren't a swing state. voting for a 3rd party candidate is useless and the symbolic nature of doing so means absolutely nothing when voting is used to determine a winner. if you are naive and just want to vote for a 3rd party candidate who will get 0.002 of the overall vote just to give yourself a pat on the back for participating in the democratic process, then by all means.

so if i have to chose between a war criminal, a future war criminal, and a nobody, i think ill sit this one out.

Most of you have turned to sheep. Your vote counts as long as you vote, you dont have to vote for the winner for it to count. If Mittens lose, do you honestly beleive those millions of people that voted for him dont count, lol, it tells barry he has to deal with a people that dont agree with him.
If you vote for a nobody, it basically tells the winner that there are people out there that vote but wont vote for him/her. There will be a day that those voters will be important and are needed by the winner to get elected into office. Do you realize that in Florida, most cuban americans vote and their opinion on the castro regime is what drives american policy towards cuba. If they were sheep like some of you, then no one would listen to them now or ever, why would they since they dont vote.

Most politicians know that Muslim Americans dont vote, so their issues are meaningless to them because when election time comes, they can neither hurt them or help them.

[pashtanajan]

you have just posted a whole load of garbage to make your case for your preconceived view but you FAIL.
as if the CFR link on other thread wasnt enough to know what kind of tool you are.
now you are beginning to sound like a mouthpiece for some thinktank.
i dont have time to waste on drones such as you.

move along.

ps:if i start to give you analysis of these news reports and docs,you will be crying.

Anyone that does not completely agree with how you view the world is a failure.

You tell me I dawdle in conspiracies, but yet when I show you evidence, proof and facts – you tell me it is garbage.

Your arguments are without any 'evidence' (as you so repeatedly ask me for, which I've given).

Your deep analysis of my post concerning Karzai was a 'FAIL' (as you say it), so why should any of your further analysis be of any worth?

Have a nice life– and I'll gladly 'move along', aha!

[ډګروال]

Anyone that does not completely agree with how you view the world is a failure.

You tell me I dawdle in conspiracies, but yet when I show you evidence, proof and facts – you tell me it is garbage.

Your arguments are without any 'evidence' (as you so repeatedly ask me for, which I've given).

Your deep analysis of my post concerning Karzai was a 'FAIL' (as you say it), so why should any of your further analysis be of any worth?

Have a nice life– and I'll gladly 'move along', aha!

Mr Weinbaum from CFR is not evidence.
CASE DISMISSED

[randolph85]

Most of you have turned to sheep. Your vote counts as long as you vote, you dont have to vote for the winner for it to count. If Mittens lose, do you honestly beleive those millions of people that voted for him dont count, lol, it tells barry he has to deal with a people that dont agree with him.
If you vote for a nobody, it basically tells the winner that there are people out there that vote but wont vote for him/her. There will be a day that those voters will be important and are needed by the winner to get elected into office. Do you realize that in Florida, most cuban americans vote and their opinion on the castro regime is what drives american policy towards cuba. If they were sheep like some of you, then no one would listen to them now or ever, why would they since they dont vote.

Most politicians know that Muslim Americans dont vote, so their issues are meaningless to them because when election time comes, they can neither hurt them or help them.

florida is a swing state, california where i live is not.

as for muslim americans, i am willing to bet that most vote for obama. they are no less blind than other obama supporters. there is no large muslim % who's votes are up for grabs.

lol @ you calling non voters "sheep"


go ahead and "rock your vote" p diddy and paris hilton style.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

florida is a swing state, california where i live is not.

as for muslim americans, i am willing to bet that most vote for obama. they are no less blind than other obama supporters. there is no large muslim % who's votes are up for grabs.

lol @ you calling non voters "sheep"


go ahead and "rock your vote" p diddy and paris hilton style.

Randolph, whats the general thoughts over there in Fremont area about how Obama has been using a lot of his presidency to slap Karzai like a clown show, back and forth up and down left and right?

Seems to me that a number of Afghan Americans who are making a killing monetarily off this war and buying Kabul property would want to see Romneymania dominate for the above and this reason.

[randolph85]

hell if i know, i don't have an open line of communication with fremont afghans. but knowing the afghans here and there, they are 95% obama supporters. they support him for the ridiculous notion that he is peaceful, pro muslim, and supports the poor. its as if these people have been hibernating for the last 4 years.