honor killing by afghan family in Canada

[IamDZJ]

o please..lie detector test my foot. even if a stranger had killed his cat he would have showed more remorse than he did at the death of his wife and three children. he probably killed the young one so she doesn't end up being like the rest of them. he is angry my foot.

[Alchemist]

that wire tape was from a discussion the parents had with that fob translator...where the fob did 80% of the talking ..and managed to get the father to curse his own daughters ..without knowing he was being recorded...

I am sure even your own parents have given you worse scolding in the heat of their afghan temper...

[کیش]

o please..lie detector test my foot. even if a stranger had killed his cat he would have showed more remorse than he did at the death of his wife and three children. he probably killed the young one so she doesn't end up being like the rest of them. he is angry my foot.

Please stop hurting your poor foot.

A lie detector is better then having a jury "by your peers." nobody happily goes to do jury duty. A lie detector test can accurately show he's lying or telling the truth.

[faye]

Yea, but he didn't confess to say "khob kar khatam ma". The pops undoubtley was real pissed at the two older daughters, but why would he kill his 12 yr old to kill his other daughters?
Did the prosecution complete a lie detector test?
His other wife was the mother of the three daughters btw

kais, you can see by all the torturing of muslims that they don't yet have lie detector tests that work on them. even though they can invent everything else under the sun, this has been one invention they have failed to design, funny that.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

No one is seeing the writing on the wall here. One of the current tenants of the Red Cell memo that Julian Assange so wonderfully released to the world indicated that Central Command would do their best to cast the Afghan war (and by extension the war on terror) as a values issue. The goal was to tell Europeans: how can you leave the coalition of the willing since women in Afghanistan will be thrust back into the stone age if we leave? This would be sort of a surrogate ethnic cleansing guilt type thing inflicted on the Europeans.

Study the Shafia case. Who are the Shafias? Lets assume guilt. So the current blasting of this case on the news, and making it front page in Canda, Europe, and the Americas serves what purpose? Note that the Shafia's have no history or links to the Taliban. In fact, any discerning reader will see that their ethnic group is not stressed, but they are confirmed to speak dari as their primary language. The public though is being hammed by a series of repeated bullet points:

1) ooooo the scary Afghans
2) Double wives
3) Kill daughters
4) Honor killing

A series of blanks are left in place so as to let the reader connect the dots. If you look at the CNN commentary most of it runs at the bottom line this:

oooo Afghans are (blank ---> Muslim) ---> (blank ---> Muslims) have double wives) ---> Muslims kill daughters for (blank --->Islam) ----> honor killing

And then what happens? This gets packaged to the public as: If you dont support us there... just know that we cant stop all the Shafias that want to put the clamp down on their daughters!

The details are never fleshed out. Let us take Mr. Shafia's own transcript. He makes it clear that Islamic law doesnt advocate the approach he took. This in fact is true. In the worst case scenario, if this was a zina crime (which has not been proven) there is no indication the death penalty would be on the table for any of the girls.

That aspect of the case is not discussed in any detail.

Why is this important at all? Well, look at who the Shafias are.

The claim against Muslims being made in these commentaries is that they bring their baggage from their own countries and deposit it at the door step of their adopted nations.

The devil is in the details though.

They are not a family that is integrated into Canadian society. These are not members of a community that has been present since the 1970s and are in school in Canadian universities! In fact, they needed dari translators. The Son, Hamed, arrived to Canada as late as 2007. His high school essay said: "tradition is to be followed to the end of one's life."

Here are a series of articles about the family and killings:

http://www2.macleans.ca/tag/shafia-trial/

Canadians and Americans should actually take the reverse message of what the widespread advertisement of this case is attempting to do:

You cannot change folks who inherently, in their traditions and roots, are not suited to change to your vein of thinking. If their own religious philosophy could not prevail upon them to not committ this act... how can invading armies dare to think they can convince the diet Coke version of Mohammad Shafia to adopt the aspects of imposed Western tradition and culture that have nothing to do with material gains (lest Lavanaay Zalmaay pipe in in usual fashion and say that he was all too willing to adopt the Lexus and the armaani suits [ these are material gains and not changes in memes)]

The moral of the story?: If you cannot change a possibly NON PASHTUN Mohammad Shafia by bringing him to your society, giving him all the wealth your system can bestow on him, and where he has no insurgents breathing down his neck, and where his lifestyle does not mirror that of a religionist... how the heck do you think you can nation build a mindset in a country you are occupying!

[faye]

if a white christian family did this, it would also be on the headlines, barakzai.

[Alchemist]

if a white christian family did this, it would also be on the headlines, barakzai.

as honor killing?


LOL


you are funny...


throll.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

if a white christian family did this, it would also be on the headlines, barakzai.

Once again its how the issue is pitched. Faye. Here are a series of cases of child killing in the US:

http://chestercountyrants.wordpress....he-bible-belt/

The most notorious of which was the Susan Smith case. Susan Smith's bible belt upbringing was never discussed.. nor was her step father's attachment to organizations associated with American Mullah Pat Robertson.

The issue here is when you read the commentary at the bottom of any stories from CNN in the era where Susan Smith was becoming a household name, not a single world or judgement was passed on Christianity. Rightly so I might add. There is certainly no precept in Christianity that calls for taking the lives of your children. The closest we get to a religious order to kill one's own kin is in the Old Testament when the jews worshipped the calf. Moses is claimed to have told the Israelites to begin killing eachother for the sin.

Yet, whenever these issues come up ... go the bottom of any webpage, even the Al Jazeera site and what you will immediatly see is a smug arrogance of sorts of those that pass judgement on Islam without any evidence based approach. The commentary at the bottom of the CNN webpage devoted to Shafia is chalk full of this stuff.

Yet the Bible belt babes that killed their babes have stories that see no discussion of religiousity or of kindred that were "religious" and affected the lives of these women negatively.

The closest you see to a focus on other folks for gender based killing is a discussion of the ballooning problem of female fetacide in India:

http://www.pbs.org/frontlineworld/ro..._girlinks.html

Yet once again, the story could be emphasized by a clever writer from two angles. The proper angle is the way that the story is told, which pretty much leaves the Vedas and other hindu texts out of the discussion. There is not an iota of evidence that Hinduism allows for infantacide.

Yet the Dravidian Indian customs that usually result in a reverse dowry where a woman has to provide a dowry to a man has certainly contributed to this situation. To marry a woman off in India has become a major economic hinderence.

The situation has become so bad that whole villages are overpopulated in a very lopsided ratio of men being in the greater number. This has caused social upheavel because men cannot find women to marry in some remote regions. Elizabeth Vargas goes into good detail about this issue:

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headline...as-gendercide/

Conservative parties in India generally squelch the discussion around this issue. These conservative parties are very aligned with Hindu extremist elements that want to limit Western interventionalism in India. This aspect is not at all discussed by Vargas. Once again, I think that is fine because to go into great detail about such issues would give the reader the false impression that Hinduism sanctions such actions.

So I agree that some issues make the news, coming from other religious sectors. However, the discussion rarely if ever gets into the religoius ideologies of others.

[faye]

as honor killing?

LOL

you are funny...

throll.

are you calling me a throll, alchemist? don't be so insulting.
of course a christian wouldn't be doing an honour killing. we all know they can't possibly posses honour

[Talal]

thats not really an uncommon story in our communities here..either parents put up with it or they don't.

Personally i think what the parents did was immoral, no matter what the girls did...The right to take life rests with the one who gave it, if things were too out of hand for them they should have just cut em lose

I don't have any sisters so i guess i can't really see the parent's point of view, but regardless sooner or later i think we all have to face these kinda issues..if not now then maybe down the road..point is you need to be able to pick up behavioural changes in young kids/teens at a much earlier stage so you can remedy the situation before it leads to something irreversible.

[faye]

barakzai, before 9/11, which you yourself believe was done by osama bin laden, i never used to hear about muslims in the press. apart from a controversial rape case here in australia.
the things that have been happening since 9/11, with bombings around the world and the wars, have brought muslims into the mainstream. of course there is going to be some prejudice against muslims where people have been affected by bombings, said to be by muslims. just as there is prejudice against western countries for their bad deeds. even westerners are angry at the western countries for their interferences in muslim lands and their wars.
believe me, when 9/11 happened, nearly every australian i spoke to said, that america had asked for it because of their bullying and interferences around the globe.
every ordinary aussie i speak to is aware of the b.s. of all these wars.
the muslims need good spokespeople to come forward and counteract these negative propagandas.
i am not excusing newspaper predjudicial leanings but if they are there, it is for some of the reasons i mention plus the owners of the media, might just have an agenda. not naming anybody

[Alchemist]

Oh yeah?

Every aussie you spoke to?

What is that? 4 aussies in the outback hunting crocodiles and tending sheep?

Why is australia in afghanistan then if not to fight "the war on terror"? what does 9/11 have to do with canada or australia?

aussies are just stool pigeons of britain.

[faye]

yeah...bro.
no we're not. we are supposedly helping america, so they will stick by us if we ever need a hand. them's politics, my boy.
america and the israel lobby is even helping choose our leaders and helping our politicians to not criticise israel. aren't they kind?

[emkhan]

You have such a filthy...mind.

:

You munafiq and liar telling me I have such a filthy mind. Do you think I don't know you ?
and who told you to quote me ?

[emkhan]

you fink?


Ya...Kabulies were liberal minded since kabul came into existence..if anything kabulies got the rest of the world liberalized ..so you keep your village mentality and stop hating on us.

I don't hate Afghans, they are highly respected to me. You people got me wrong. I was talking about the open minded liberal no matter they are Afghans or Pakistanis or whatever.