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The Lies in Pakistani History - The Myth Victory of 1965 War

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  • The Lies in Pakistani History - The Myth Victory of 1965 War

    Army attemps to prevent book sales

    The Army has bought all copies of a book written by a former intelligence chief fearing it may explode the myth victory in the 1965 war with India, a source has said.

    By Amir Mir, Correspondent Published: 00:00 October 1, 2006

    Lahore: The Army has bought all copies of a book written by a former intelligence chief fearing it may explode the myth victory in the 1965 war with India, a source has said.

    The source said the General Head Quarters (GHQ) of the Pakistan Army bought up 22,000 copies of the book by Lt Gen Mahmood Ahmed, fearing that its contents could malign its image.

    The book titled The Myth of 1965 Victory, which was published by the Oxford University Press, was found to be "too sensitive" by none other than the Army Chief General Pervez Musharraf.

    The sources said that General Mahmood Ahmed had submitted the manuscript of his book to the GHQ as per the rules in vogue.

    Manuscript

    However, after going through the contents, the GHQ referred the manuscript to General Musharraf who noted on the file that Mahmood should review some sensitive parts of the book as well as the title especially use of the word myth in relation to the 1965 war.

    As General Mahmood was subsequently suggested some major deletions by the GHQ, he refused to oblige, saying that it was already in the printing stage.

    Under these circumstances, the sources said, the GHQ directed the Army Book Club to immediately buy all the 22,000 copies worth millions of rupees directly from the publishers to stop it from being marketed.

    When some leading distribution houses contacted the Oxford University Press, they were informed that the book has already been sold out.

    Even otherwise, the sources said, there was a binding on the publishers under a revised contract not to provide it for general distribution.

    The sources said that Gen Mahmood, who is considered a hawkish pan-Islamist himself, tried to get a few hundred copies for his own library but could not get permission from the GHQ.

    Being a former ISI chief, Mahmood is already at the centre of a controversy for having quoted former American Deputy Secretary of State Richard Armitage of threatening to "bomb Pakistan back to stone age" in September 2001.

    Interviews

    Musharraf recently made a mention of Mahmood's book in one of his interviews to foreign press in the US while describing his former aide's post-retirement activities and referring to it as unpublished yet.

    The sources said Mahmood has already joined the Tableeghi Jamaat after being relieved of his post-retirement assignment to head Fauji Fertiliser Corporation.

    Source:
    http://gulfnews.com/news/world/pakis...sales-1.258770
    Pir Rokhan

    http://Pashtoonkhwa.blogspot.com

  • #2
    Re: The Lies in Pakistani History - The Myth Victory of 1965

    I have a lot to tell you brothers if I am alive.You will not believe your eyes and ears.You do not know what these Punjabis have done to the poor people of Pakistan.Let my weekend come ka khair wee.
    Pir Rokhan

    http://Pashtoonkhwa.blogspot.com

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: The Lies in Pakistani History - The Myth Victory of 1965

      Originally posted by pir_Rokhan
      I have a lot to tell you brothers if I am alive.You will not believe your eyes and ears.You do not know what these Punjabis have done to the poor people of Pakistan.Let my weekend come ka khair wee.
      You have me anticipated now lol.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: The Lies in Pakistani History - The Myth Victory of 1965

        Pir rokhan, have you also tried in pakistani forums.
        if yes then what was their response to your facts?
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        Comment


        • #5
          Re: The Lies in Pakistani History - The Myth Victory of 1965

          Ofcourse there r many lies in pakistan history but it is straight and simple fact that pakistan won 1965 war and lose 1971 war.

          why afghans love cow-piss-drinkers so much that they r twisting even facts in favour of them?
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          Comment


          • #6
            Re: The Lies in Pakistani History - The Myth Victory of 1965

            Originally posted by shlombay
            Aren't you an ethnic Afghan yourself?
            yes i am.
            At the moment i am questioning afghanistan citizens.
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            Comment


            • #7
              Re: The Lies in Pakistani History - The Myth Victory of 1965

              Originally posted by shlombay
              Aren't you an ethnic Afghan yourself?
              yes i am.
              At the moment i am questioning afghanistan citizens.
              [B]
              .............
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              Comment


              • #8
                Re: The Lies in Pakistani History - The Myth Victory of 1965

                address me by jodigul.

                Yes i love afghanistan and most of pakistani pashtuns historically originate from afghanistan actually.

                but i cant claim to be afghan citizen.
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                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: The Lies in Pakistani History - The Myth Victory of 1965

                  Originally posted by jodigul
                  Ofcourse there r many lies in pakistan history but it is straight and simple fact that pakistan won 1965 war and lose 1971 war.

                  why afghans love cow-piss-drinkers so much that they r twisting even facts in favour of them?
                  Jodigul

                  Please read the article again.It is in plain and simple English and for your information it is not written by any Indian or Pashtun ,it is written by an Ex. Pakistani person.Does it ring bells in youre mind or you ares till in the state of denial.
                  Moroever I took this reference from an Indo-Paki forum itself as I do not like military field.I am amazed when Pashtuns /Afghans start advocating false and anti Pakhtuns notions,if Punjabis do it it makes sense.
                  Pir Rokhan

                  http://Pashtoonkhwa.blogspot.com

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: The Lies in Pakistani History - The Myth Victory of 1965

                    Very interested read, thanks for posting Roshan sahab.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: The Lies in Pakistani History - The Myth Victory of 1965

                      Hi,

                      This is from a neutral source, Also Chuck Yeagers, if you already dont know is the greatest among the world war 2 heroes, was the first person to break the sound barrier and is one of the most respected pilots of modern aviation history

                      Gen. Chuck Yeagers (yes, the one who broke the sound barrier), who 'refereed' the 1971 war and flew up and down the region collecting wreckage of IAF aircraft shot down by the PAF. One of the greatest pilots of all times, Here is what he says in his autobiography,

                      "the Pakistanis scored a three-to-one kill ratio knocking out 102 Indian jets and losing 34 of their own. I am certain about the figures because I went out several times a day in a chopper and counted the wrecks below. I counted wrecks, documented them by serial numbers, identified the components such as engines and rocket pods"


                      USA - Aviation week & space technology - December 1968 issue.

                      "For the PAF, the 1965 war was as climatic as the Israeli victory over the Arabs in 1967. A further similarity was that Indian air power had an approximately 5:1 numerical superiority at the start of the conflict. Unlike the Middle East conflict, the Pakistani air victory was achieved to a large degree by air-to-air combat rather than on ground. But it was as absolute as that attained by Israel."

                      UK - Air International - November - 1991

                      " the average PAF pilot is almost certainly possessed of superior skills when compared with, say, an average American pilot. As to those who are rated above average, they compare favourably to the very best "

                      Encyclopaedia of Aircraft printed in several countries by Orbis publications - Volume 5

                      "Pakistan's air force gained a remarkable victory over India in this brief 22 day war exploiting its opponents weaknesses in exemplary style - Deeply shaken by reverse, India began an extensive modernisation and training program, meanwhile covering its defeat with effective propaganda smoke screen."


                      If you feel more at ease with German and French, then also checkout the followings

                      Air Action (France) December 1988 and January 1989
                      Flugzeug (Germany) February (2) 1989
                      It's enough that I know, Our time had a home, In your heart..Was a place..But the glass always breaks..

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: The Lies in Pakistani History - The Myth Victory of 1965

                        Originally posted by Credere
                        Hi,

                        This is from a neutral source, Also Chuck Yeagers, if you already dont know is the greatest among the world war 2 heroes, was the first person to break the sound barrier and is one of the most respected pilots of modern aviation history

                        Gen. Chuck Yeagers (yes, the one who broke the sound barrier), who 'refereed' the 1971 war and flew up and down the region collecting wreckage of IAF aircraft shot down by the PAF. One of the greatest pilots of all times, Here is what he says in his autobiography,

                        "the Pakistanis scored a three-to-one kill ratio knocking out 102 Indian jets and losing 34 of their own. I am certain about the figures because I went out several times a day in a chopper and counted the wrecks below. I counted wrecks, documented them by serial numbers, identified the components such as engines and rocket pods"


                        USA - Aviation week & space technology - December 1968 issue.

                        "For the PAF, the 1965 war was as climatic as the Israeli victory over the Arabs in 1967. A further similarity was that Indian air power had an approximately 5:1 numerical superiority at the start of the conflict. Unlike the Middle East conflict, the Pakistani air victory was achieved to a large degree by air-to-air combat rather than on ground. But it was as absolute as that attained by Israel."

                        UK - Air International - November - 1991

                        " the average PAF pilot is almost certainly possessed of superior skills when compared with, say, an average American pilot. As to those who are rated above average, they compare favourably to the very best "

                        Encyclopaedia of Aircraft printed in several countries by Orbis publications - Volume 5

                        "Pakistan's air force gained a remarkable victory over India in this brief 22 day war exploiting its opponents weaknesses in exemplary style - Deeply shaken by reverse, India began an extensive modernisation and training program, meanwhile covering its defeat with effective propaganda smoke screen."


                        If you feel more at ease with German and French, then also checkout the followings

                        Air Action (France) December 1988 and January 1989
                        Flugzeug (Germany) February (2) 1989
                        Whom shall we believe the one who has been a part of the fight and institution all his career in Pak or or the one who commented on the war in US ???
                        Pir Rokhan

                        http://Pashtoonkhwa.blogspot.com

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: The Lies in Pakistani History - The Myth Victory of 1965

                          I think Pakistan lost the war from India, India is way too powerful.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: The Lies in Pakistani History - The Myth Victory of 1965

                            Originally posted by Punjabi
                            I think Pakistan lost the war from India, India is way too powerful.
                            Originally posted by pir_Rokhan
                            Originally posted by Credere
                            Hi,

                            This is from a neutral source, Also Chuck Yeagers, if you already dont know is the greatest among the world war 2 heroes, was the first person to break the sound barrier and is one of the most respected pilots of modern aviation history

                            Gen. Chuck Yeagers (yes, the one who broke the sound barrier), who 'refereed' the 1971 war and flew up and down the region collecting wreckage of IAF aircraft shot down by the PAF. One of the greatest pilots of all times, Here is what he says in his autobiography,

                            "the Pakistanis scored a three-to-one kill ratio knocking out 102 Indian jets and losing 34 of their own. I am certain about the figures because I went out several times a day in a chopper and counted the wrecks below. I counted wrecks, documented them by serial numbers, identified the components such as engines and rocket pods"


                            USA - Aviation week & space technology - December 1968 issue.

                            "For the PAF, the 1965 war was as climatic as the Israeli victory over the Arabs in 1967. A further similarity was that Indian air power had an approximately 5:1 numerical superiority at the start of the conflict. Unlike the Middle East conflict, the Pakistani air victory was achieved to a large degree by air-to-air combat rather than on ground. But it was as absolute as that attained by Israel."

                            UK - Air International - November - 1991

                            " the average PAF pilot is almost certainly possessed of superior skills when compared with, say, an average American pilot. As to those who are rated above average, they compare favourably to the very best "

                            Encyclopaedia of Aircraft printed in several countries by Orbis publications - Volume 5

                            "Pakistan's air force gained a remarkable victory over India in this brief 22 day war exploiting its opponents weaknesses in exemplary style - Deeply shaken by reverse, India began an extensive modernisation and training program, meanwhile covering its defeat with effective propaganda smoke screen."


                            If you feel more at ease with German and French, then also checkout the followings

                            Air Action (France) December 1988 and January 1989
                            Flugzeug (Germany) February (2) 1989
                            Whom shall we believe the one who has been a part of the fight and institution all his career in Pak or or the one who commented on the war in US ???
                            Believe what you may, you just quoted a source that points to Pakistan being rendered some earth shattering defeat. If that was the case I would be more of a myth than this story, it is important to understanding the underlying events and the battle tactics that went on in the 1965 war. Here is a quote from one of the Indian lt. generals regarding the operation that the aforementioned general elaborates on.

                            "Lieutenant General Harbaksh Singh, one of the very respected senior Indian military commanders, was one of the few to have appreciated the full military value of Operation Gibraltar as a part of Grand Slam rather than seeing the two in isolation. According to him, “The plan of infiltration was brilliant in conception,” and as for Grand Slam, he thought it was “aptly named Grand Slam for had it succeeded, a trail of dazzling results would have followed in its wake, and the infiltration campaign would have had a fresh lease of life,” and that “it was only the last minute frantic rush of reinforcements into the sector . . . that prevented this debacle from deteriorating into major catastrophe.”
                            It's enough that I know, Our time had a home, In your heart..Was a place..But the glass always breaks..

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: The Lies in Pakistani History - The Myth Victory of 1965

                              @pir-rokhan
                              i have read some of your posts, it seems you are on some kind of mission. Your main focus is pakistan and its evils. its not a bad idea but let me tell you pakistani pashtuns are fully aware of evils of pakistan but still they consider pakistan their country and are not thinking about independence.
                              [B]
                              .............
                              [/B]

                              Comment

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