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  • Afghan Taliban to Open Office in Turkey

    The Turkish foreign minister has confirmed that preparations are underway for opening an office in Turkey for the Afghan Taliban. During a recent visit to Turkey, the president of Pakistan, together with his Turkish counterpart, made a commitment to support political initiatives to end the war in Afghanistan. Ankara has been calling for talks with the Taliban, and having strong ties with both Afghanistan and Pakistan is seen as a key element in facilitating talks.

    Turkey says it is willing to host a political office for Taliban militants from Afghanistan in order to promote talks to end the war there. An unnamed Afghan official is quoted as saying that planning for the office is already in progress.

    Turkish President Abdullah Gul voiced support for initiatives to stabilize conflict-torn Afghanistan at a joint press conference Wednesday with his Pakistani counterpart Asif Ali Zardari. Mr. Gul said these initiatives include efforts to improve dialogue with the Taliban.

    "We are interested in the Afghanistan issue in a very wide framework," said President Gul. "We will always take part in any activity that contributes to peace and aims for a permanent peace process. We are involved there not only in the war, but to help the Afghan people normalize life there."

    Turkish Foreign Minister Ahmet Davutoglu on Monday confirmed that he held talks last month with Burhanuddin Rabbani, the former Afghan president who heads a peace council set up by the Afghan government to work toward a political solution.

    Turkey has traditional strong ties with both Afghanistan and Pakistan and has used those contacts successfully to mitigate Afghan-Pakistani tensions. Turkey also has several hundred soldiers stationed with the NATO-led ISAF forces in Afghanistan. However, according to Soli Ozel, an international relations expert at Istanbul's Kadir Has University, their strictly non-combat role means all sides still view Turkey as neutral.

    "The Turks are a legitimate force in Kabul and may be contributing to at least the relative stability in that part of the country,"said Ozel. "Look, if you do have in Kabul a situation where other countries soldiers' are wearing Turkish uniforms because it's lot safer in the streets, that tells you something about the kind of prestige that the Turkish soldiers enjoy in Kabul."

    Turkish officials say they are waiting for a formal request from the Afghan government to open an office. Last December, Afghan President Hamid Karzai welcomed the initiative in principle at a summit with his Turkish and Pakistani counterparts in Istanbul.

    "It has been discussed with me previously by gentlemen, dignitaries close to the Taliban movement," said President Karzai. "The idea of Turkey serving as [a] place where gatherings take place, where a representation can be established in order to facilitate a reconciliation and integration, has been discussed. If Turkey can be kind to provide for such a venue, we the government of Afghanistan will be pleased and happy to see that facilitation take place by Turkey."

    For now, the Taliban is sending out conflicting messages over whether it would be prepared to talk. But Ankara is reportedly using all its diplomatic influence to find a political solution to the conflict. That stance is supported by the Turkish former civilian head of NATO-led forces in Afghanistan, Hikmet Cetin, who says talking with the Taliban is a necessity.

    "Well, I do agree there should be some talk with them, because they are there," said Cetin. "We have to accept Taliban is an important element in Afghanistan and Pakistan and one way [or] another we have to deal with them. Especially with the non-criminal ones. And if the Afghan government itself is able to go further for reconciliation and [is] supported by military as well, the situation would get better as well, I think."

    Observers say such sentiments are growing throughout the NATO-led forces and it is only a matter of time before some form of talks with the Taliban start. Turkey is working hard to be the venue for such talks.


    .....

    note: i doubt this will happen ...but at least turkey is trying...unlike iran.

  • #2
    Traditionally - on a popular level at least including their media - Turks have been sympathetic to Dostum and the Uzbeks.

    There is the intense romanticization of the "eternal Turkish-Pakistani brotherhood" by the Turkish media, with all its historical fallacies. Some Turks even believing that "Pakistan" helped them in their war of independence in the 1920s (Pakistan did not exist back then). The Pakistani ambassador to Ankara has even seriously suggested having a Turkey-Pakistan union with Turks and Pakistanis having the same passport. However in real hard diplomatic terms, the Turks never supported Pakistan over Kashmir in the way the Arabs did including the many Arab volunteers who fought there.

    Nor did Turkey support the Pakistan-backed Taliban government of the 1990s unlike Saudi or the UAE.

    It will be interesting to see what Turkey (which is actually run by the US, and a US proxy, I cannot go into depth) does in Afghanistan.

    The irony is on the one hand there is Pan-Turkism (thus support for Uzbeks of both Uzbekistan and Afghanistan) and Pakistanophilia, with the two conflicting with Dostum's hatred of the Taliban and Pakistan's agenda for the country.
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    • #3
      If pakistan is involved it is a corrupt concept.
      bengal you are right turkey did save dostum time to time but turkey has no emnity against Afghans.

      We should all watch out for pakistani involvement,first they were cashing in on propaganda of "taliban isi connection" and now this corrupt entity wants to play a role in the future of our country which we will not tolerate.

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      • #4
        Turks have a positive opinion of both Afghanistan and Bangladesh whom they view as "brother countries", though many, if not most, view Pakistan as their no.1. friend/brother/ally in the world and will write semi-poetic euologies of how much they love Pakistan.

        However in the real world of international politics, Turkey has no hostility towards Afghanistan and is not going to promote Pakistani interests at the expense of Afghanistan, in other words all this talk of "Turk-Pak eternal brotherhood" is exaggerated hype (its more from the Turkish side who are brainwashed by their media to adore Pakistan).

        Pakistan as a geo-political "power" is a joke.

        They lost East Pakistan after oppressing the people there and starting a massacre.

        They could not capitalize on the Sikh rebellion against Hindu India.

        They are hated by Afghans.

        43% of their country, Balochistan, is a no-go area for Punjabis and Mohajirs with the Pakistani flag or anthem not flown or sung.

        Karachi was in a state of low-intensity civil war.

        Their economic growth is down to 2%, Bangladeshi economic growth is now 7%.

        Despite the misuse of the whole "Muslim brotherhood" card.

        a: Iran has better relations with India than Pakistan.
        b: Saudi is now doing major naval exercises with India.
        c: Muslim Republics of Central Asia e.g. Uzbekistan have far better relations with India than with Pakistan. I think they have a very relaxed visa policy (or a no visa policy) for Indians.
        d: Turkey is doing more and more business and deals with India and actually softening its stance on Kashmir (despite the inevitable rhetoric of eternal love for Pakistan).
        e: Gulf Arab countries are doing lots of business with India and respect India more than Pakistan in terms of the image they have of Indian professionalism and education.
        f: India is enjoying a lot of popularity and business in Afghanistan.

        I am however no fan of India which is disliked by us Bangladeshis, but in the India v Pakistan rivalry it is India that is winning.

        The only success the Pakistanis enjoyed was helping Sri Lanka to defeat Indian supported Tamil separatists.

        Other than that the Pakistanis do not know how to play politics and have nothing to offer anyone, and their country is seen as a complete mess and disaster.
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        • #5
          Yes, Turkey is under NATO influence.
          But I suspect that there is a rift in Turkey between the military and the elected leaders. And these talks are being coordinated by Gul's Administration and not the military. But the taliban are probably aware that if they did have an office in Turkey, NATO would be all over it.

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          • #6
            Alchemist wrora, are you KHIDR?

            Sorry, I'm not that regular on this forum so not sure if you are him or a completely different person.
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            • #7
              Originally posted by Bengal_Tiger View Post
              Alchemist wrora, are you KHIDR?

              Sorry, I'm not that regular on this forum so not sure if you are him or a completely different person.
              no, we are different people...

              I don't see khidr around often...only read 3 or 5 of his posts so far.

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              • #8
                Ok...

                Khidr was a prolific poster in the Afghansite forum when I used to read it a few years back (not that I would read that trash ever again) and was a good quality poster I used to enjoy reading...

                I guess you enjoy reading Paolo Coelho
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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Bengal_Tiger View Post
                  Ok...

                  Khidr was a prolific poster in the Afghansite forum when I used to read it a few years back (not that I would read that trash ever again) and was a good quality poster I used to enjoy reading...

                  I guess you enjoy reading Paolo Coelho
                  Did you (or alchemist) read Coelho's "the fifth mountain?", it's a real good pic.

                  As for thread, am not fan of Turkey, so I wouldn't trust them. Their the same people who kicked Islam out for western lifestyle.

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                  • #10
                    Turkey on paper is a part of NATO, but in reality thats just mere diplomacy.

                    I don't know what the Taliban are saying about this, but I think maybe the Afghan 'government' will end up being in this office.

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                    • #11
                      Nice commentary Bengal_Tiger.

                      But I think there may be other reasons for Turkey deep involvement in these affairs i.e.,

                      1. Like Baluch separatism, Turkey is also faced with Kurd separatism and the unraveling of the political order in Central-South Asia or for that matter any part of the world might be having consequences for Turkey as well. Turkey, therefore, should naturally be concerned about that and involved in any initiative or process to block it.

                      Just think about the destablizing impact that the collapse of Afghanistan and Pakistan might have for Turkey keeping in mind the Kurdish problem both in Turkey and Iraq.

                      2 Then there is the Uzbak connection. As you mentioned, Turkey is the main backer of Rashid Dostum and the Uzbak and Turkaman minorities in Afghanistan. During the Afghan War (Afghan Fasad or Afghan Jehad whatever you call it) Turkamen/Uzbaks were the only minorities whom Turkey extended refuge. And the reason was the ethnic link.

                      3. Central Asian republics and the Pan-Turk feelings might also be a motivating factor for Turkey. Turky sees itself as the lead/core Turk nation of all the Turk people extending from Asia minor to Sinkiang.

                      4. Turkey sees itself an important player in the Middle East, Central Asia, and Balkans as a kind of heir or successor to the Ottoman Empire especially under the current leadership . Enhancing its role/influence in these regions and improving its image seems to be one of its foreign policy objectives. A key role in the resolution of the Afghan problem might be important in achieving these objectives.

                      5. Last there is this NATO connection as well.

                      It seems Turkey will like that the status-quo is maintained in Central-South Asia, that minorities in particular Uzbaks and Turkamen get maximum benefits in any political settlement in Afghanistan vis-a-vis Pashtuns(in particular) and other groups, and that Pakistan's concerns with regard to the Durand Line and strategic depth in Afghanistan are addressed.
                      Last edited by Toramana; 04-16-2011, 06:59 PM.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Timbaktu
                        the only thing which is similar between turkey and pakistan is their corrupt army which likes to keep the real feelings of the poeple under control. both armies are fascist entities who only serve themselvs.

                        Afghanistan was teh first country to reconize the turkish republic, both have close ties. let's hope turkey keeps up its positive role in the region.
                        1. Despite the Turkish media's obsession with praising Pakistan and their eternal brotherhood, a key factor in the close relations between Turkey and Pakistan is that both were part of the US-backed CENTO alliances of the 1960s to counter the USSR and developed ties.

                        2. Ismet Inonu, the arch-secularist (who some say was worse than even Ataturk himself) was friends with another British agent Ali Jinnah.

                        Jinnah however did not support the Khilafah movement of the South Asian Muslims in support of Ottoman Turkey and was not very religious or Islamic man.

                        3. Pervez Musharraf spent time in Turkey when he was young and was an open and unashamed Ataturk-admirer.

                        4. Turks, whilst being raised to hate Arab as "traitors" and primitive, are on the otherhand taught to view Afghanistan, Pakistan and Bangladesh as allies.

                        Secular Bengali poet, Qazi Nazrul Islam (far from Islamic eespite the name) wrote poems praising his contemporary Ataturk, who himself rewarded some Bengali volunteers that had gone to Anatolia to fight, whilst the greatest Bengali of them all Maulana Abdul Hamid Khan Bashani was a staunch supporter of the Khilafah movement and protested strongly when traitor Ataturk abolished the Caliphate.

                        Bashani by the way, and not Mujib, is ultimately the true father of modern Bangladesh and was the one who first spoke of secession in the 1950s and was key in renaming the then "Awami Muslim League" to just the "Awami League", since the sharp and clever socialist-orientated Maulana knew the Pakistani regime were misusing the "Muslim card" to exploit people.

                        The Bangladeshi right-wing by the way view Bakhtiar Khilji, an Afghan Turk from Garamsir as the founder of Muslim Bengal or a sort of "Baba i Qawm" type figure.



                        Another reason why Turkey and Bangladesh have very warm relations is because when Turkey liberated northern Cyprus, Bangladesh was one of its strongest supporters and offered to recognize the state only withdrawing that offer due to US pressure.

                        Turkish and Bangladeshi army ties are close with Turkey providing land and naval defence weaponry and open to the ideas of joint defence projects between the two.



                        Turkish head of army greeting Bangladeshi diplomats to celebrate 40 years of Bangladeshi independence.



                        World's most powerful Muslim man, with world's most powerfu Muslim woman. Erdogan with Hasina. Erdogan is the leader of Turkey which has one if not the strongest military in the Muslim world, with the most powerful Muslim navy, biggest economy alongside Indonesia but the most political influence. Hasina is the leader of the world's 3rd biggest Muslim nation which has the first/second highest number of UN peace keepers.



                        Amberin Zaman, journalist with Bangladeshi and Turkish parents.

                        YouTube - ZENNE HaberTurk 3 Ocak 2010

                        Zaman speaks Turkish on this TV programme to native-speaker standard.

                        YouTube - Riz Khan - Turkey's 'Kurdish Problem' - 09 Apr 09 - Part 1

                        In this video, in the 7th minute Zaman speaks about the Kurdish issue.
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                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Karachi
                          lol. looks like some one is wetting his pants because of pakistani/turkish friendship. As long as pakistan has strong friends like China, Turkey, Saudi etc... no one can do any thing to us, your Banglafishkhor state is like a rat infront of us, we can crush you any time we want
                          Don't boast...In 1971, your army had been squarely beaten, which is one of the history's most humuliating defeat a military ever have had with 1,00,000 of them imprisoned to rust in Indian prisons for the next 4-5 years.
                          Last edited by Toramana; 04-16-2011, 08:41 PM.

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                          • #14
                            Erdogan is a smart man, but I would not call him the most powerful Muslim man. I think this title is still up in the air.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Toramana View Post
                              Nice commentary Bengal_Tiger.

                              But I think there may be other reasons for Turkey deep involvement in these affairs i.e.,

                              1. Like Baluch separatism, Turkey is also faced with Kurd separatism and the unraveling of the political order in Central-South Asia or for that matter any part of the world might be having consequences for Turkey as well. Turkey, therefore, should naturally be concerned about that and involved in any initiative or process to block it.

                              Just think about the destablizing impact that the collapse of Afghanistan and Pakistan might have for Turkey keeping in mind the Kurdish problem both in Turkey and Iraq.

                              2 Then there is the Uzbak connection. As you mentioned, Turkey is the main backer of Rashid Dostum and the Uzbak and Turkaman minorities in Afghanistan. During the Afghan War (Afghan Fasad or Afghan Jehad whatever you call it) Turkamen/Uzbaks were the only minorities whom Turkey extended refuge. And the reason was the ethnic link.

                              3. Central Asian republics and the Pan-Turk feelings might also be a motivating factor for Turkey. Turky sees itself as the lead/core Turk nation of all the Turk people extending from Asia minor to Sinkiang.

                              4. Turkey sees itself an important player in the Middle East, Central Asia, and Balkans as a kind of heir or successor to the Ottoman Empire especially under the current leadership . Enhancing its role/influence in these regions and improving its image seems to be one of its foreign policy objectives. A key role in the resolution of the Afghan problem might be important in achieving these objectives.

                              5. Last there is this NATO connection as well.

                              It seems Turkey will like that the status-quo is maintained in Central-South Asia, that minorities in particular Uzbaks and Turkamen get maximum benefits in any political settlement in Afghanistan vis-a-vis Pashtuns(in particular) and other groups, and that Pakistan's concerns with regard to the Durand Line and strategic depth in Afghanistan are addressed.
                              Toraman wrora

                              you are making it too black and white.

                              Turkey wasnt actively supporting dostum in his crimes or the "uzbek and turkman" people.
                              Turkey gave refuge to dostum after he had to make a run for it.
                              mentioning baluch separatist in one sentence with turkey doesnt make sense.Turkey PM just some time ago visited kurdistan and signed deals about bilateral cooperations.

                              Uzbek and Turkmen are two different people and Turkey didnt back Dostum politically or economically,they just gave him asylem when he had to make a run for it after the incident in kabul where he went to Atta's house and beat him severly.

                              Turkey doesnt have emnity against Pashtuns or have this ethnic bias,they might be helping their turkic speakers in terms of helping them in a crisis but there is no political agenda.

                              Turkey does have an important role to play in helping the muslim countries such as Afghanistan and may even play a elder brother role.

                              Where do you get this information from?

                              Turkey is not involved in with a political agenda in Afghanistan as you say they want the turkmen and uzbek get in power in oposition to Pashtuns.First of all Turkmen and uzbek are two seperate groups.

                              Uzbeks are the ones who got famouse(with a bad name)with Dostum and his ruthless Gilamjam.Btw his top commander in Gilamjam group was a Pashtun.Gilamjam were a bunch of thieves who used to rob the Sikh shop owners in Kabul.they were known as Gilamjam cuz they would come in put everything on the carpet(Gilam)and take it with them(jam).this Gilamjam evovled into dostum etc.this doesnt mean that all uzbek people are involved in this group,many cant stand dostum.Turkman arent involve with dostum or whatever he does and they are quite nice people.So putting these two groups of people together and making dostum their leader and connecting this with Turkey is not logical in my view.



                              Last edited by Guest; 04-16-2011, 07:26 PM.

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