Question to the atheists

[JAMALUDEEN]

I guess you can not read.

He was saying, that how can you be godless and call yourself an Afghan, when god's name is mentioned in the Afghan National Anthem.

I can say the exact same in relation to Afghan customs such as playing the Rabab and doing attan, both are unislamic and pagan by origin.

Does that mean they are not Afghan?

A National Anthem, can be changed and alterred.

Using the Afghan National Anthem to some how emotional blackmail me into following Wahabism is illogical and plain stupid.

As a matter of fact, if God really cared for Afghanistan, he would have never punished Afghanistan as badly as he has done.

How does this answer my question? You somehow seem very angry as you cannot answer my question....and you are mixing all these irrelavant topics into this topic in order to save a face.

[Al Hanif]

I guess you can not read.

He was saying, that how can you be godless and call yourself an Afghan, when god's name is mentioned in the Afghan National Anthem.

I can say the exact same in relation to Afghan customs such as playing the Rabab and doing attan, both are unislamic and pagan by origin.

Does that mean they are not Afghan?

A National Anthem, can be changed and alterred.

Using the Afghan National Anthem to some how emotional blackmail me into following Wahabism is illogical and plain stupid.

As a matter of fact, if God really cared for Afghanistan, he would have never punished Afghanistan as badly as he has done.

So I can be Afghan too ? This anthem talking about non-Berber ethnicities is stupid ? It can be changed and altered as you said. What about Saudis and Punjabis, they can be Afghans too ?

LAWL XOXO ROFLMAO OMG WTF

Have you ever seen a mujahideen being sad when he got shot or before martyrdom ? No, they are always cheering each others. They are smiling and joking.

On the other hand, the non-believers who are scared of death are always sad. The veterans are killing themselves because of psychological issues. There are more US soldiers killed by suicide than killed in action.

Allah SWT has punished the disbelievers like Daud Daud, Wali Karzai, Ghulam Haidar Hameedi and many others. He protected Mollah Omar.

The mujahideens choosed themselves to be killed in action. That was their goal and they will go to Jannah insha'Allah.

A true believer doesn't care about death or material convenience. He is thankful to what Allah SWT gave him and he knows that it's better to live in Kandahar and go to Paradise than living in Vegas and going to hell where you will end.

Afghanistan is in this situation because of traitors like you but now victory will come and the Talibans will not do the same error they did the first time. There will be no concessions.

[Maiwand]

The Prophet Muĥammad expressed disapproval when he heard a Persian youth
extolling his ancestry in the battlefield. `Abd al-Raĥmān ibn Abī `Uqbah reported
that his father, a Persian ‘ally’ of the Anşār, relates that he took part with the Prophet
in the Battle of Uĥud. “As I struck an unbeliever, I shouted, ‘Take it from me; I, a
Persian youth!’ The Prophet turned to me and said, ‘Would it not have been better
for you to say, I, the Anşārī youth. The nephew and the ally of any group of people
belong to them.’“ [Related by Abū Dāwūd]

[Soldat_Amir]

The Prophet Muĥammad expressed disapproval when he heard a Persian youth
extolling his ancestry in the battlefield. `Abd al-Raĥmān ibn Abī `Uqbah reported
that his father, a Persian ‘ally’ of the Anşār, relates that he took part with the Prophet
in the Battle of Uĥud. “As I struck an unbeliever, I shouted, ‘Take it from me; I, a
Persian youth!’ The Prophet turned to me and said, ‘Would it not have been better
for you to say, I, the Anşārī youth. The nephew and the ally of any group of people
belong to them.’“ [Related by Abū Dāwūd]

Then why was you just a mintue ago saying you would be proud to be genetically related to Bani israel.

"Maybe it will have something to do with Bani Israel, I would feel proud if it can be proven genetically that we Pashtuns are the descendants of those prophets of Bani Israel "

http://www.pashtunforums.com/pashtun-history-8/afghan-pashtun-dna-posted-soon-20548/index17.html

This is the thing, people like Maiwand, will oppose Pashtuns who are proud of their ancestry and roots, but support it if its got something to do with Arabs and Jews and other Ambrahmic lunatics from the middle east.

Why this hypocrasy?

Another thing I would like to point out.

We as secularists do not oppose people following god, what we do oppose is sectarism and segregation due to relgion by the masses. We support peoples right to follow a god, but refuse to accept being seen as "dhimmis" and forced to pay a Jizya tax and wear a badge to make us look different from the population.

We do not oppose Islam, rest assured, we just oppose any violent form of bigotry in the name of God, that includes Christians and Jews too.

[Insaaf_انصاف]

This is the thing, people like Maiwand, will oppose Pashtuns who are proud of their ancestry and roots, but support it if its got something to do with Arabs and Jews and other Ambrahmic lunatics from the middle east.

What are our true origins ?
I want to know, europeans are our ancestors ?
Persian / Indians are our ancestors
Please reply, i want to know the truth...

[Badlun]

In the nine lines of this anthem only the last line mentions Allah and that too in the religious or emotional/spiritual sense. All other lines are about Afghan nationalism, Afghan land, Afghan tribes and the international importance of Afghanistan as the heart of Asia.

The mention of God is like a slogan. Its like in the secular USA when they say we trust in God. Its all symbolic, emotional and spiritual nothing to do with Sharia, system of Taliban or promulgation of the so called Islamic laws. Afghan nationalism is the dominant theme of the anthem and not any Pan Islamism , Salafism, wahabism or Talibanism.

Islam as a religion to believe in God is not at all a problem but as mentioned by Soldat Amir , its imposition on others as Taliban did is the real issue. No problem with beliefs, worship and religious ethics but issues with political, economic, cultural , legal and social Islam.

[Soldat_Amir]

What are our true origins ?
I want to know, europeans are our ancestors ?
Persian / Indians are our ancestors
Please reply, i want to know the truth...

Go read a book on Afghan history.

[Soldat_Amir]

In the nine lines of this anthem only the last line mentions Allah and that too in the religious or emotional/spiritual sense. All other lines are about Afghan nationalism, Afghan land, Afghan tribes and the international importance of Afghanistan as the heart of Asia.

The mention of God is like a slogan. Its like in the secular USA when they say we trust in God. Its all symbolic, emotional and spiritual nothing to do with Sharia, system of Taliban or promulgation of the so called Islamic laws. Afghan nationalism is the dominant theme of the anthem and not any Pan Islamism , Salafism, wahabism or Talibanism.

Islam as a religion to believe in God is not at all a problem but as mentioned by Soldat Amir , its imposition on others as Taliban did is the real issue. No problem with beliefs, worship and religious ethics but issues with political, economic, cultural , legal and social Islam.

Thank you Osho. Nicely put.

America uses God, but its society is progressive and well developed.

Plus most Americans are not radical evangelicals, just like how most Afghan Muslims are not Talibs.

[Badlun]

The anthem is so profound and so far reaching in its meaning and connotations that it does not mention Islam, Muslims, Sharia, Mazhab or any other pure Islamic or religious term but just one God and the slogan God is great because Afghanistan is also for non Muslims and there can be non Muslim Afghans as Hindus or Sikhs or even Christians. The concept of God is shared amongst Muslims and non Muslims.

Even atheist can have their God in the shape of nature, state, matter, energy, science etc and these are great for them as the religious God is great.

[Michin Khel]

In anthem even gujjars (punjabis) are mentioned which is surprising.

[akbarkhan]

I'm still waiting for Soldat Amir and LZ's response..

You don't need to wait. Let me tell you...

They will simply replace "God" with Lenin, Marx and Engels - taking turns of course.

[Alchemist]

You know what soldout khamir?


you sound like a broken record to me " Stoning...women...sharia ...music banned"..blah blah. You want a discotheque in Kabul? It's there. Stop whining. And yeah..you can even get your self some wine too when you are down there.


More importantly...its 2012 almost...16 years after the first mention of Taliban back in 1996. So that means, the 30 year old talib commander is now 46 years old...the 20 year old talib is now 36 years old. But you know ...the front line soldier is a 20 year old that back then was only 4 years old. And this 20 year old will be the next commander 10 years from now so he'll be 36 by 2022....AND STILL fighting against NATO. What are you gonna do then? Still chant the same mantra? ...."Oh taliban...sharia....woman ...stoning... oh no ...music ..." ..stfu!

[badmash_khel]

^

lol, that khamir word made me spill my tea. damn it.

[Haris]

Well, one point to note is that Afghanistan is, in its current state atleast, an 'Islami Jamhooriyat' (although I guess it's legitimacy in this regard is debateable).

It is stressed in the constitution and even on the flag, above the emblem, it is written 'la ilaha illallah muhammadur rasulullah'




Certainly the Islamic charactersitcs and nature of the Afghans cannot simply be whitewashed away, even the Americans recognised this when Karzai's transitional government was formed.



My conclusion is that most Atheists prefer a Pashtunistan anyway, a new state with a new constitution, new flag and perhaps a new anthem.
Although they can speak for themselves, i'm sure.

[JAMALUDEEN]

The anthem is so profound and so far reaching in its meaning and connotations that it does not mention Islam, Muslims, Sharia, Mazhab or any other pure Islamic or religious term but just one God and the slogan God is great because Afghanistan is also for non Muslims and there can be non Muslim Afghans as Hindus or Sikhs or even Christians. The concept of God is shared amongst Muslims and non Muslims.

Even atheist can have their God in the shape of nature, state, matter, energy, science etc and these are great for them as the religious God is great.

"This land is Afghanistan – It is the pride of every Afghan
The land of peace, the land of the sword – Its sons are all brave
This is the country of every tribe – Land of Baluch, and Uzbeks
Pashtoons, and Hazaras – Turkman and Tajiks with them,
Arabs and Gojars, Pamirian, Nooristanis
Barahawi, and Qizilbash – Also Aimaq, and Pashaye
This Land will shine for ever – Like the sun in the blue sky
In the chest of Asia – It will remain as the heart for ever
We will follow the one God – We all say, Allah is great, we all say, Allah is great "

Every pashtun tribe and ethnic group in Afghanistan has a religious connection to islam, and this is all reiterated in the last verse, that the people of Afghanistan follow the one "God", and then it repeats.. Wayu Allahu Akbar.. Wayu Allahu Akbar.. It doesn't say.... We all say.. Nature is great or we all say.. Nature is great.. or we all say.. GOds are great..we all say Gods are great

This unites all Afghans under the banner of Islam. It doesn't even mention hindus, sikhs, atheists..for that matter. Hindus cannot relate to Allah as well, Sikhs cannot relate to Allah either.... their beliefs are way different. How can you relate to Afghanistan, if you cannot even understand the verse properly, while you know so much about the US national anthem.

So answer me, how do you guys relate to Afghanistan and the national Anthem? It is crystal clear that you guys reject God and religion... so when you say, we follow the one God, and that Allah is great.. and you don't obviously mean it.. Then you are being dishonest.... to the people of Afghanistan and most importantly muslims.. and what they represent.

Please guys, answer the question as it is, and do not troll away the topic into stuff that is irrelevant. I don't care about the national anthem of the US or India...or what the taliban did..or did not do...