War Between Heaven and Hell

[ذو الفقار]

such fundamental Zoroastrian beliefs as the belief that what transpires in finite time makes a decisive difference, so far as Ahura Mazda’s claim to supremacy is concerned; or the belief that human beings are genuinely free; or the belief that the battle against evil is no mere play-acting but a struggle which is dead serious and all-consuming, both for Ahura Mazda and for his creatures.

Although I have criticized Zoroastrianism on the thread "Kurdish disaster", I do appreciate one of its core ideas vis-a-viz the cosmic War between Heaven and Hell. Both the forces of Light and Darkness are waging a serious struggle against each other that is being played out in our human realm. But I believe it is the Abrahamic tradition which has identified the main geopolitical conflict on this planet (centered in the Middle East of course) as part of this greater cosmic War between Heaven and Hell. This is evident if you read Jewish and Christian apocalyptic literature, such as the Book of Daniel and Book of Revelation.

The Abrahamic tradition, apparently like Zoroastrianism, firmly declares that Heaven is bound to win this war. Everything is leading toward one final apocalyptic battle, the climax of this ancient struggle.

Now like all wars, this War too is being fought for a prize. It isn't territory or material resources, but the human soul itself. This much is made clear in the Holy Quran when we read the dialogue between God and the Devil.

Islam's conception is that Hell already knows it is bound to lose. I don't know if this is true in Zoroastrianism. In our theology, the Devil is on a very short leash. Being a creation of God, the Devil possesses no independent power or authority. Everything he is allowed to do in terms of tempting people, manipulating them, whispering evil thoughts, slowly driving people insane, and stripping them of their humanity due to desires for power and lust, is all due to God's permission.

And as for the geopolitical conflict that is intimately part of the broader cosmic war between Good and Evil, the devil's involvement is in manipulating his "pawns", but the "master plan" is his own strategy, he only manipulates those pawns to carry it out. Again, remember, the Devil cannot coerce or force anyone to do anything, unless, perhaps, he has taken such extensive control of the human mind which simply failed to resist his influence previously (that is going into the disputed realm of demonic "possession")

The paradox remains, why does Hell continue to fight against Heaven if it knows it is bound to lose? And how is victory or defeat even defined in this War? The above quote from an academic journal discusses the idea that in Zoroastrianism the Devil is truly an independent force, and although Light will ultimately triumph over Evil, that is due to the nature of Light as an intrinsically superior force.

But we as Muslims believe Heaven will win because God Himself has written (ordained) it. In the Quran al-Karim, the Devil, after being sentenced to eternal damnation, asks God for a period of respite, in order to be the one to tempt mankind. God grants the Devil this respite and dispensation to do his worst in leading mankind astray.

This gives us a clue as to Hell's motivation. It is ultimately because of the Devil's desire for revenge and his burning hatred of mankind. The parable of Adam and the Devil is emphasized in the Quran to explain this very important issue of the (philosophical) "problem of evil".

[ذو الفقار]

In the Qur’an, the preferred terminology is Light (Nur) and Darkness (Zulumat). I believe one of the reasons these terms are used instead of “Heaven” vs “Hell” or “Good” vs “Evil”, is because they express the true nature of both Good and Evil. In other words, the true natue of Evil is its obfuscation and confusion. I believe that creating “confusion” is the greatest weapon of the Devil. This is the reason for such abundance of “false religion” in our world. People believe in and practice false religion, dooming their souls to Hell, with the best of intentions. It is the devil’s plan to maintain some of the moral teachings of God but mix them up with theological lies, as that is a much easier way to misguide the masses of humanity. The evil of Christianity, a religion which very much emphasizes morality and righteous living in servitude to God, is its confounding of the truth about the Oneness of God, i.e., doctrines of trinity and divine incarnation. By simply twisting the original truth while maintaining an unmistakable resemblance to it, the Devil manages to hoodwink people and come to them in the guise of an Angel. It may be asked, if the moral teachings are being maintained or at least stressed and recognized, what difference does it make if one’s theology isn’t exactly the Truth?

Theological differences are to be expected, but the manifest and quite obvious alteration of the most fundamental religious truth – there is only One God – for that of Trinity is undoubtedly one of the Devil’s most damaging lies. Only those afflicted with blindness cannot discern this liquid that has seeped into their religion like a stain, and fail to realize their souls are in the Fire.

Failure to acknowledge and worship only One God is in fact the greatest sin because it is open defiance. Other sins, no matter how despicable, are not necessarily, in their essence, open defiance of God, but examples of man falling to temptation against his better judgment, something which God can and does overlook. But open defiance and rebellion against Him, challenging of His very Godhood by believing with one’s heart and mind in another god (Christianity) or rejection of God altogether (atheism) cannot be overlooked. It would be like a criminal brought to a court but failing to even acknowledge the validity of the court or judge. This is how apparently ‘abstract’ theology has a very real effect on the human soul.

[salman47]

Come on there's no war between Heaven or Hell. I don't think so Heaven or Hell will competing for 'Who accommodates more'.
Also both of them are creation of ALLAH, as are everything else.
From Quran, only Humans and Jinns have been given free will, rest of the creation obeys Allah without a word.(Ma Sha Allah, Subhan Allah)
Whether Heaven or Hell likes something or not, whatever Allah commands them they have to obey.

P.S. Forgive me Allah if I have said something wrong. Forgive us All. Amin.
Thanks God for Islam.

[ذو الفقار]

Come on there's no war between Heaven or Hell. I don't think so Heaven or Hell will competing for 'Who accommodates more'.
Also both of them are creation of ALLAH, as are everything else.
From Quran, only Humans and Jinns have been given free will, rest of the creation obeys Allah without a word.(Ma Sha Allah, Subhan Allah)
Whether Heaven or Hell likes something or not, whatever Allah commands them they have to obey.

P.S. Forgive me Allah if I have said something wrong. Forgive us All. Amin.
Thanks God for Islam.

I’m using the terms ‘Heaven’ and ‘Hell’ differently than what you might be understanding them in this context. Basically, Heaven is referring to God and His side, and Hell is referring to the devil and his side.

Now if you are asking is there actually a ‘war’ between God and the devil, that is a legitimate question from the perspective of Islamic theology. As I mentioned in the OP, in our theology, the Devil is not an independent force in the sense of having authority in his own right. He is on a short leash and his powers are determined by Allah. This is how Islam differs from Zoroastrianism.

Now where Islam differs from Judaism’s view of Satan is that Islam does say that the Devil too possesses free will, that he is wicked, evil and rebellious against God. In Judaism, as least as explained by contemporary orthodox rabbinical stream, the devil is merely a synonym for man’s evil inclinations. So in our Faith, we make a distinction between Satan as an external force, and the ‘Nafs’ of man, the internal inclinations. We see the Devil as constantly trying to corrupt the ego, but not synonymous with the ego. The Devil is a real, conscious person.

[ذو الفقار]

Though the Quraan teaches that the Devil is aware that the Light can never be defeated, his aim is only to capture as many human souls as he possibly can and drag them along with him to Hell. Nevertheless, there are times when this struggle between Light and Darkness manifest into physical combat in the human realm. The most famous examples are from the Sira of the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him). It’s interesting that Iblis himself was intimately involved in the actual activities of persecution and opposition to the Prophet (peace be upon him). One could say that more than any other time, during the life of the Prophet (peace be upon him), Iblis was most active in doing everything he possibly could to resist the rise of Islam. For example, his personal dealings with the chieftains of the pagan Quresh, goading them to oppose the Prophet (peace be upon him), and his personal appearance at the Battle of Badr. Badr was a defining moment in human history. In Islamic theology, Badr has to be understood as not merely another historic war, but as the physical manifestation of the greatest intensification so far in the cosmic struggle between Light and Darkness.

It was narrated that Ibn ‘Abbaas (may Allah be pleased with him) said: Iblees came on the day of Badr bringing a troop of devils with him. I saw him in the form of a man from Banu Mudlij, in the form of Suraaqah ibn Maalik ibn Ju‘sham. The Shaytaan said to the mushrikeen: No one of mankind can overcome you this day (of the battle of Badr) and verily, I will be your protector. Then when the people had drawn themselves up in battle array, the Messenger of Allah (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) picked up a handful of dust and threw it in the faces of the mushrikeen, and they turned and fled. Jibreel came to Iblees and when he saw him, his hand was in the hand of one of the mushrik men. Iblees pulled his hand away, and turned and fled, he and his party. The man said: O Suraaqah, did you not say that you would protect us? He said: ‘Verily! I see what you see not. Verily! I fear Allah for Allah is Severe in punishment.’ That was when he saw the angels.

Perhaps something that will strengthen the meaning of these two reports is a mursal hadeeth that was narrated by Maalik in al-Muwatta’ (944) from Talhah ibn ‘Ubaydullah ibn Kareez, according to which the Messenger of Allah (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) said: Iblees is never seen on any day smaller, more humiliated, more defeated and more angry than on the day of ‘Arafah, because of what he sees of the descent of mercy and forgiveness for sins, except what he saw on the day of Badr.” They said: O Messenger of Allah, what did he see on the day of Badr? He said: “He saw Jibreel organising the angels.”

These above cited narrations are an indication of how human battles in the earthly realm, such as Badr, and the future Great Battle (Malhama al-Kubra or ‘Armageddon’) are in fact examples of the intensification of an ongoing spiritual struggle that takes the form of a physical war. The fact that Angels literally descended on the battlefield during Badr, led by Gabriel, general of the Heavenly forces, decked in armor and riding on horses, is very significant for Islamic theological conception of the ‘war between Heaven and Hell’ and the future apocalyptic battles which conclude with the appearance of the Messiah.

[maneatinglizard]

Though the Quraan teaches that the Devil is aware that the Light can never be defeated, his aim is only to capture as many human souls as he possibly can and drag them along with him to Hell. Nevertheless, there are times when this struggle between Light and Darkness manifest into physical combat in the human realm. The most famous examples are from the Sira of the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him). It’s interesting that Iblis himself was intimately involved in the actual activities of persecution and opposition to the Prophet (peace be upon him). One could say that more than any other time, during the life of the Prophet (peace be upon him), Iblis was most active in doing everything he possibly could to resist the rise of Islam. For example, his personal dealings with the chieftains of the pagan Quresh, goading them to oppose the Prophet (peace be upon him), and his personal appearance at the Battle of Badr. Badr was a defining moment in human history. In Islamic theology, Badr has to be understood as not merely another historic war, but as the physical manifestation of the greatest intensification so far in the cosmic struggle between Light and Darkness.

It was narrated that Ibn ‘Abbaas (may Allah be pleased with him) said: Iblees came on the day of Badr bringing a troop of devils with him. I saw him in the form of a man from Banu Mudlij, in the form of Suraaqah ibn Maalik ibn Ju‘sham. The Shaytaan said to the mushrikeen: No one of mankind can overcome you this day (of the battle of Badr) and verily, I will be your protector. Then when the people had drawn themselves up in battle array, the Messenger of Allah (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) picked up a handful of dust and threw it in the faces of the mushrikeen, and they turned and fled. Jibreel came to Iblees and when he saw him, his hand was in the hand of one of the mushrik men. Iblees pulled his hand away, and turned and fled, he and his party. The man said: O Suraaqah, did you not say that you would protect us? He said: ‘Verily! I see what you see not. Verily! I fear Allah for Allah is Severe in punishment.’ That was when he saw the angels.

Perhaps something that will strengthen the meaning of these two reports is a mursal hadeeth that was narrated by Maalik in al-Muwatta’ (944) from Talhah ibn ‘Ubaydullah ibn Kareez, according to which the Messenger of Allah (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) said: Iblees is never seen on any day smaller, more humiliated, more defeated and more angry than on the day of ‘Arafah, because of what he sees of the descent of mercy and forgiveness for sins, except what he saw on the day of Badr.” They said: O Messenger of Allah, what did he see on the day of Badr? He said: “He saw Jibreel organising the angels.”

These above cited narrations are an indication of how human battles in the earthly realm, such as Badr, and the future Great Battle (Malhama al-Kubra or ‘Armageddon’) are in fact examples of the intensification of an ongoing spiritual struggle that takes the form of a physical war. The fact that Angels literally descended on the battlefield during Badr, led by Gabriel, general of the Heavenly forces, decked in armor and riding on horses, is very significant for Islamic theological conception of the ‘war between Heaven and Hell’ and the future apocalyptic battles which conclude with the appearance of the Messiah.

You should cite your references and quote them, rather than copying them as if they were your own words. That's plagiarizing.

Also, anyone else notice that this guy doesn't really talk about Islam the way Muslims normally do? This entire thread is pretty foreign to Islamic discourse. A war between Heaven and Hell? What is this a video game lol?

There was also that thread where he was talking about a "Yahwist" concept of God. When has a Muslim ever referred to their understanding of God as "Yahwist"? The Jews were anthropomorphists who went as far as to claim that God wrestled with (and lost to) a human. While they do commit shirk like Christians do, neither of them have a correct understanding of God.

[ذو الفقار]

You should cite your references and quote them, rather than copying them as if they were your own words. That's plagiarizing.

I clearly stated: "These above cited narrations"

And the narration is referenced to Muwatta of Imam Malik.

So when did I ever even imply those narrations are my own words? They are clearly not.

[maneatinglizard]

I clearly stated: "These above cited narrations"

And the narration is referenced to Muwatta of Imam Malik.

So when did I ever even imply those narrations are my own words? They are clearly not.

You stole a part of an IslamQA answer. It was obvious because your post mentions two narrations, but you only quoted one (before the mursal one). You also left out the actual reference that was present in the IslamQA answer.

Here it is for everyone to see:

How could the Shaytaan appear to the disbelievers in the battle of Badr when he is chained up during Ramadan and the battle was in Ramadan? - islamqa.info

I know you're unable to admit fault, so let's see you squirm your way out this one lol.

[ذو الفقار]

You stole a part of an IslamQA answer. It was obvious because your post mentions two narrations, but you only quoted one (before the mursal one). You also left out the actual reference that was present in the IslamQA answer.

Here it is for everyone to see:

How could the Shaytaan appear to the disbelievers in the battle of Badr when he is chained up during Ramadan and the battle was in Ramadan? - islamqa.info

I know you're unable to admit fault, so let's see you squirm your way out this one lol.

Are you saying I should cite IslamQA for translating those two narrations? IslamQA is only a secondary source, the original source are the books of Hadith wherein these narrations are reported.

And it is not necessary to cite the book of Hadith either, just the Hadith.

For example, the Prophet (peace be upon him said): "Actions are based on intentions"

See, no citation or reference. That's because I said those are the Prophet's words. Likewise, in the other post it is stated those are the words of Ibn Abbas.

[ذو الفقار]

Also, anyone else notice that this guy doesn't really talk about Islam the way Muslims normally do?

You mean I'm not boring and have my own vocabulary and don't just parrot things.

Criticize the substance of what I say, not my choice of vocabulary or style of writing.

This entire thread is pretty foreign to Islamic discourse. A war between Heaven and Hell? What is this a video game lol?

You obviously didn't read or understand anything. The sign of a small mind that cannot comprehend. You cannot see, hear or understand anything. Sumum Bukmum Umyum.

This is 100% Islamic discourse. The struggle between Light and Darkness, the nature of the Devil, the war for human souls, the problem of evil. Again, its too much for your puny mind to understand such things, but just because your mind cannot understand it doesn't give you the right to say this isn't Islamic discourse.

The Jews were anthropomorphists who went as far as to claim that God wrestled with (and lost to) a human.

Once again your puny mind at work courtesy of eating haram lizards and not getting proper Halal nutrition.

Firstly, what you are quoting about Jacob wrestling was wrestling with a "man" (interpreted as an Angel in the form of a man) not actually with God:

And Jacob was left alone; and there wrestled a man with him until the breaking of the day. (Genesis 32: 24)

Secondly, it is a parable to explain the origin of a theophoric name "Israel", not meant to be taken literally. Israel means "wrestles with God", it describes the relationship with God and the one given the name as a rocky one with ups and downs.

The Quraan also acknowledges the name of Sayyidina Yaqoob (alaihis salaam) as "Israaeel"

[maneatinglizard]

Are you saying I should cite IslamQA for translating those two narrations? IslamQA is only a secondary source, the original source are the books of Hadith wherein these narrations are reported.

You lazily copy-pasted the IslamQA answer. You didn't even bother removing their commentary. You cry about the lack of acedemic rigor here but can't even be bothered to properly cite the references you shamelessly steal material from.

And it is not necessary to cite the book of Hadith either, just the Hadith.

For example, the Prophet (peace be upon him said): "Actions are based on intentions"

See, no citation or reference. That's because I said those are the Prophet's words. Likewise, in the other post it is stated those are the words of Ibn Abbas.

Stupid Qadiani, maybe it's not necessary to cite references in your religion, but in Islam it is absolutely necessary to establish the legitimacy of any saying attributed to Rasulullah (salla Allahu alayhi wa salam).

Your attribution of a statement to Rasulullah (salla Allahu alayhi wa salam) is rejected merely on account of your baatil Aqeeda, never mind the 1400 years of time between the two of you.

Stick to quoting your prophet, Ghulam Ahmad. He probably doesn't care if you reference him properly or not. The punishment of the grave is likely too distracting for him to mind.

[MENTION=103]tor_khan[/MENTION], can this guy be banned already? He's distorting Islam and trying to spread Qadiani propaganda. Not to mention how he's constantly trying to passively-aggressively bash Pashtuns.

[salman47]

I’m using the terms ‘Heaven’ and ‘Hell’ differently than what you might be understanding them in this context. Basically, Heaven is referring to God and His side, and Hell is referring to the devil and his side.

Now if you are asking is there actually a ‘war’ between God and the devil, that is a legitimate question from the perspective of Islamic theology. As I mentioned in the OP, in our theology, the Devil is not an independent force in the sense of having authority in his own right. He is on a short leash and his powers are determined by Allah. This is how Islam differs from Zoroastrianism.

Now where Islam differs from Judaism’s view of Satan is that Islam does say that the Devil too possesses free will, that he is wicked, evil and rebellious against God. In Judaism, as least as explained by contemporary orthodox rabbinical stream, the devil is merely a synonym for man’s evil inclinations. So in our Faith, we make a distinction between Satan as an external force, and the ‘Nafs’ of man, the internal inclinations. We see the Devil as constantly trying to corrupt the ego, but not synonymous with the ego. The Devil is a real, conscious person.

Ohh you mean the 'Good vs Bad' from the Ancient Cultures.
In Islam there is no war compared to other religions as you said. In Islamic Philosophy it is absolutely defined who is losing. From Quran, when committed the sin of not obeying Allah, he was doomed to Hell forever. But he also said that he will take whoever he can from the Jinns and Humans to hell with him. And I think everyone knows the rest.
So it is Absolutely defined that the Satanic Force is going to hell under every possible circumstance.

[ذو الفقار]

shamelessly steal material from.

Listen lizard-eater, there is no such thing as "Stealing" religious material. The rules of plagiarism don't apply to Hadith if you quote the words as attributed to the Prophet (peace be upon him)

but in Islam it is absolutely necessary to establish the legitimacy of any saying attributed to Rasulullah (salla Allahu alayhi wa salam).

Only if you dispute its authenticity. If you dispute the authenticity of the Hadith I cited I will be glad to establish the soundness of its Sanad.

Your attribution of a statement to Rasulullah (salla Allahu alayhi wa salam) is rejected

Wow what an idiot you are. So anytime someone with a "Baatil" aqida cites an authentic Hadith of Rasul Allah (Sallallahu alaihi wasallam) you reject the Hadith out of hand because the one citing it has a wrong aqida.

Look how stupid you are, is this the criterion for determining the authenticity of a Hadith, or is it the Sanad. Do you even know anything about Hadith sciences? Or are you a typical Pashtun that is stupid and knows nothing and has contributed nothing to Islamic thought except chewing Naswaar and engaging in bacha bazi?

[ذو الفقار]

Ohh you mean the 'Good vs Bad' from the Ancient Cultures.
In Islam there is no war compared to other religions as you said. In Islamic Philosophy it is absolutely defined who is losing. From Quran, when committed the sin of not obeying Allah, he was doomed to Hell forever. But he also said that he will take whoever he can from the Jinns and Humans to hell with him. And I think everyone knows the rest.
So it is Absolutely defined that the Satanic Force is going to hell under every possible circumstance.

As I said, we have to define what is winning and losing in the context of this struggle between Light and Darkness. For sure it is a struggle. But in this struggle, the Devil already knows he is doomed to Hell, his aim is to bring as many humans with him there as possible. The Devil even knows that he won't be able to mislead the pure, chosen servants of Allah ('the elect'). But even the Devil doesn't know who exactly they are, so he tries to mislead everyone, and exerts his greatest effort on those who are going on the Right Path.

[maneatinglizard]

Listen lizard-eater, there is no such thing as "Stealing" religious material. The rules of plagiarism don't apply to Hadith if you quote the words as attributed to the Prophet (peace be upon him)

Listen British boot licker, You didn't quote a Hadith. You quoted someone's translation of a Hadith, as well as their commentary. But you presented it as if it were your own. Quoting translations is one thing (the fact that you do it so sloppily and without any verification shows your lack of academic rigor though), but you included IslamQA's analysis as well, as if it were your own.

That's plagiarism. You can lie to yourself and pretend that you didn't present someone else's work as your own out of laziness, because it's pretty obvious one of your mental illnesses prevents you from accepting that you made a mistake, but no one else is fooled.

Your blog is full of this stuff, by the way. I thought it was odd that the writing style in your blog entries changes frequently, so I search up some phrases and realized you're basically just copy-pasting stuff online and adding in your own commentary. All without any reference or attribution to the original writers. In some cases, the reason is obvious (wouldn't want anyone to know you're parroting polemics from Qadianis after all), in other cases, it appears to be either out of laziness, or some pathetic attempt at appearing more educated than you actually are.

Really sad. You talk about intellectualism and academic discussion, but it's all just a sham. Just like your obsession with Islamic appearances and identity, it's clear your harping on academics is really just about putting forth a certain appearance. Of course, you could just leave Qadianism and learn about Islam properly, and make the image you want others to have of you a reality, but you're probably too lazy and mentally weak to do that.

Only if you dispute its authenticity. If you dispute the authenticity of the Hadith I cited I will be glad to establish the soundness of its Sanad.

Moron, you have to establish authenticity first, not the other way around. In Islam, we reject the authenticity of a statement until its authenticity is established. This is literally a basic principle in Hadith (and just about anything else in Islam, or any other academic field really). The fact that you seem to think it's the opposite shows just how ignorant you are about Islam.

Wow what an idiot you are. So anytime someone with a "Baatil" aqida cites an authentic Hadith of Rasul Allah (Sallallahu alaihi wasallam) you reject the Hadith out of hand because the one citing it has a wrong aqida.

You talk a big talk for an ignorant monkey. You didn't cite an authentic Hadith. Without citing a sanad, your Hadith becomes mu`allaq. While we know the hadith you mentioned is authentic, it is not based on your narration, which is rejected.

You don't seem to get it, so I'll explain it again: but your words are not reliable. Your aqeeda is baatil, so anything you say regarding Islam will not be trusted by a Muslim. When you don't even bother to provide your reference, it is completely rejected. You think we should all just blindly accept the words of a deviant Krishna follower, when in fact we treat everything you say with the utmost scrutiny.

Look how stupid you are, is this the criterion for determining the authenticity of a Hadith, or is it the Sanad. Do you even know anything about Hadith sciences?

lol you're such an ignorant baboon. You literally have no idea about how ahadith are authenticated, beyond whatever you found in the 5 minutes you spent googling it before writing this post. Let me make it very clear to you, since I can tell you're a little (a lot) slow:

YOU DID NOT PROVIDE A SANAD. THE ONLY PERSON IN YOUR SANAD IS YOU.

That's the first thing you don't seem to get. The second:

A SANAD IS JUDGED BY THE NATURE OF THE NARRATORS THAT COMPOSE IT. AQEEDA IS AN IMPORTANT FACTOR IN DETERMINING THE SOUNDNESS OF A NARRATOR

Simple enough for you?

Now, because you're dumber than the filth your beloved Krishna died in, let me explain it a little further. Ever notice how kuffar are not included in the sanad of any hadith? You want to know why? Because their Aqeeda is baatil. Even if they're honest people, they can't be trusted to pass on the words of Rasulullah (salla Allahu alayhi wa salam).

Now, would anyone trust the words of a stupid follower of Krishna, who also happens to be a liar and racist? Not in hadith, nor in any other Islamic discipline.

I could get into the fact that the sanad is not the only factor in determining the authenticity of a hadith, but I wont bother beyond pointing out that your claim otherwise is yet another display of your ignorance.

Or are you a typical Pashtun that is stupid and knows nothing and has contributed nothing to Islamic thought except chewing Naswaar and engaging in bacha bazi?

Look dumbo, I know you guys feel emasculated in the presence of Pashtuns, and so you try to look tougher by spouting racist garbage, but it just makes you British slaves look even more pathetic. For all your talk about sophistication and intellectualism, we put a little heat on you and you revert to feral monkey mode and go all tribal on us. If you want to act like that, it's fine, as we all know you'll be the one who gets triggered in the end. But cut this veneer of intelligence when you expose your dumb racist self like this.

Oh, and how does it feel knowing that the stupid, naswar-chewing Pashtun bacha baz is still better than a filthy Krishna disciple like you? How does it feel that you have to live in Canada, because your own Punjabi Pakistani government considers you a dirty kafir? Your entire country rages whenever a politician shows the slightest bit of softening towards your kind, while no one doubts the Islam of even the worst Pashtun bacha baz? You're hated more than pedophiles lol.