Do you see Islam as a means to an end?

[badmash_khel]

Do you see Islam as a means to an end or an end in itself?

What I mean by this question is that do you see Islam as a way to englightment (iman), or do you become enlightened (mumin) by just outwardly expressing your faith in Islam as being a true religion?

[Badlun]

Very pertinent question. I being a Muslim considers Islam to be an end towards my moral and spiritual goals. Islam tells me not to tell lies, not to kill and not to adulterate, and I practice it and I reach a goal. Sufi Islam gives me enlightenment, spiritual gratification and peace of mind. Salafi Wahabi Islam is a nightmare for me.

Beliefs and practices of Islam are good but extreme monotheism brings anti-life elements like no art(sculpture is prohibited). Also fatalism, determinism are the outcome of extreme monotheism.

Prayers are just rituals and need to be more spiritual. Zakat is making people beggars and there is a need of reinterpretation of the Zakat system so that Zakat is invested in grand projects not spent just a charity.

Fasting is good but if one cannot keep fast then should have alternative. Quran gives alternatives but Mullah does not. Hajj should be once in life and rest of the time Muslims may visit other holy places like Mazar Sharif, Konia, Rahman baba shrine, Saidu baba shrine, Kakakhel mazar, Multan shrines and other places in Iran, Iraq, Mali etc.

Islamism is a curse and giving bad name to Islam. Politics for politicians not for Mullahs.

[RevolutionThroughReason]

Good question; I see it more as a means, Islam is like a way of problem solving, NOT a problem solved. If you think you have achieved everything by simply believing then you cannot grow and if you cannot grow how can one be enlightened? Enlightenment implies possessing a higher state of awareness and limiting awareness thus stifles enlightenment

It is strange and ironic that both narrow minded types like Wahhabis and Secularists look at Islam the same way. They want to limit the power and potential of Islam. Some secularists argue that Islam has never created a utopia; but Islam never says it is here to create utopia, Islam indicates it is here to give a method of problem solving, which means it is up to US on how we use it. That's why Islam is always relevant and always applicable because we use the Models given by Islam to address the problems we have today.

So people who try to limit Islam are ignorant of Islam and are ignorant of enlightenment.

[Karachi]

[QUOTE=badmash_khel;723538]Do you see Islam as a means to an end or an end in itself?

What I mean by this question is that do you see Islam as a way to englightment (iman), or do you become enlightened (mumin) by just outwardly expressing your faith in Islam as being a true religion?[/QUOTE]

I think people who that are enemys of Islam. Unfortunately we way too many people like that in the muslim world. They are nothing but liars and they even lie to themselves

[badmash_khel]

It is very important for every person to ask this question of themselves because many of us are just happy calling ourselves muslims and doing the daily rituals. Do we really have the strength of character which Islam helps to build to deal with the hardships that life throws at us? We have to ask ourselves wether we have utilized the tools given to us by Islam to their fullest which will help us become better human beings and deal with our problems better. I think the majority of people who claim to follow a religion do so because of their upbringing, If everyone followed their religion sincerely, the world will definetly be a better place.

[Shamlawar Khurasani]

Everything you do, every thought you have and how you feel about things is linked to your life and the hereafter. When people practice without realizing this, they wont see any change within themselves.

[badmash_khel]

Everything you do, every though you have and how you feel about things is linked to your life and the hereafter. When people practice without realizing this, they wont see any change within themselves.

People are too easily fooled by the illusion of Time. We say we will change tomorrow but as they say tomorrow never comes. The only time is "NOW".

[Shamlawar Khurasani]

People are too easily fooled by the illusion of Time. We say we will change tomorrow but as they say tomorrow never comes. The only time is "NOW".

True. The reason for Muslims weakness and backwardness is because we live in the past with regards to achievements and success. With regards to improvements we live in the future. We somehow fail to live in the present and realize we need to act.

[DaZahroJaam.]

Neither

[Badlun]

It is very important for every person to ask this question of themselves because many of us are just happy calling ourselves muslims and doing the daily rituals. Do we really have the strength of character which Islam helps to build to deal with the hardships that life throws at us? We have to ask ourselves wether we have utilized the tools given to us by Islam to their fullest which will help us become better human beings and deal with our problems better. I think the majority of people who claim to follow a religion do so because of their upbringing, If everyone followed their religion sincerely, the world will definetly be a better place.

Religion is for the change in your heart and soul not mind or body or society or state or institutions. If you want a a spiritual or moral change go for Islam, if you want a better state then democracy is the solution not Islam. Islam has its limited sphere of influence. You cannot change every thing with the tool of Islam. Every tool has its scope and applicability.

[badmash_khel]

Neither

Care to elaborate?

Religion is for the change in your heart and soul not mind or body or society or state or institutions. If you want a a spiritual or moral change go for Islam, if you want a better state then democracy is the solution not Islam. Islam has its limited sphere of influence. You cannot change every thing with the tool of Islam. Every tool has its scope and applicability.

Democracy is a waste of time and it doesn't work. Democracy is an illusion anyways. What we need is a strong socialist state with Islam as its guiding force. All the laws and conduct of the state within the framework of islamic morality.

For example why waste time on debating abortion when 99% of the country is made up of muslims who consider abortion unlawful except under certain circumstances such as rape and risk of death to the mother. Why should the tax payer's money be wasted on paying useless technocrats who debate endlessly in parliment what is right and wrong?

The Pashtun system of Jirga is perfect for us. It is both in accordance with our culture and our religion. Western parlimentary democracy is not suited for pashtuns. One size doesn't fit all.

[randolph85]

Democracy with no ideological system to support it is worthless. In secular nations, political office is won with money. The total spending in the Obama/Romney campaigns was well over a billion dollars and in other democratic systems like say Tajikistan or nations like that, the campaigning can be bypassed altogether and bought outright.

Islamic groups who by virtue of circumstance were able to legitimately participate in and win political office without unlimited amounts of money have been overthrown by the secularists with the big pockets. They turned the system upside down and hit the reset button like nothing happened. Such examples being Egypt, Turkey, and Algeria.

[hk1992]

Islam is a tool to achieve an end, I agree with this statement but only if we do not change the laws and regulations of islam, im open to new ideas and constructive criticism as long as they improve islam and not change anything in the quran. however Separating the Islamic state from the religion and saying that there is no politics in Islam. Such a belief denies the Qur'an and the Sunnah and the life of the Prophet.
heres an interesting passage:
Regarding the point of secularism and how Islam views it, the prominent Muslim scholar Sheikh Yusuf Al-Qaradawi, in his book How the Imported Solutions Disastrously Affected Our Muslim Nation, states the following:
Secularism may be accepted in a Christian society but it can never enjoy a general acceptance in an Islamic society. The New Testament itself divides life into two parts: one for God, or religion, the other for Caesar, or the state: "Render unto Caesar things which belong to Caesar, and render unto God things which belong to God" (Matthew 22:21). As such, a Christian could accept secularism without any qualms of conscience. Furthermore, Westerners, especially Christians, have good reasons to prefer a secular regime to a religious one. Their experience with "religious regimes" - as they knew them - meant the rule of the clergy, the despotic authority of the Church, and the resulting decrees of excommunication and the deeds of forgiveness, i.e. letters of indulgence.
For Muslim societies, the acceptance of secularism means something totally different. Since Islam is a comprehensive system of `Ibadah (worship) and Shari`ah (legislation), the acceptance of secularism means abandonment of Shari`ah, a denial of the Divine guidance and a rejection of Allah’s injunctions. It is a total falsification to claim that Shari`ah is not proper to the requirements of the present age. The acceptance of a legislation formulated by humans means a preference of the humans’ limited knowledge to the Divine guidance: [Say! Do you know better than Allah?] (Al-Baqarah 2: 140).
For this reason, the call for secularism among Muslims is atheism and a rejection of Islam. Its acceptance as a basis for rule in place of Shari`ah is a downright apostasy. The silence of the masses in the Muslim world about this deviation has been a major transgression and a clear-cut instance of disobedience that has led to a sense of guilt, remorse, and inward resentment, all of which have generated discontent, insecurity, and hatred among committed Muslims because such deviation lacks legality.
Secularism is compatible with the Western concept of God which maintains that after God had created the world, He left it to look after itself. In this sense, God’s relationship with the world is like that of a watchmaker with a watch: he makes it then leaves it to function without any need for him. This concept is inherited from Greek philosophy, especially that of Aristotle who argued that God neither controls nor knows anything about this world. This is a helpless God as described by Will Durant. There is no wonder that such a God leaves people to look after their own affairs. How can He legislate for them when He is ignorant of their affairs? This concept is totally different from that of Muslims.

We Muslims believe that Allah, Glory be to Him, is the sole Creator and Sustainer of the Worlds. He is Omnipotent and Omniscient; that His mercy and bounties encompass everyone and suffice for all. In that capacity, Almighty Allah revealed His divine guidance to humanity, made certain things permissible and others prohibited, commanded people observe His injunctions and to judge according to them. If they reject this guidance and follow their own whims and man-made laws, then they commit transgression against Allah’s laws.

[Badlun]

Islam is a tool to achieve an end, I agree with this statement but only if we do not change the laws and regulations of islam, im open to new ideas and constructive criticism as long as they improve islam and not change anything in the quran. however Separating the Islamic state from the religion and saying that there is no politics in Islam. Such a belief denies the Qur'an and the Sunnah and the life of the Prophet.
heres an interesting passage:
Regarding the point of secularism and how Islam views it, the prominent Muslim scholar Sheikh Yusuf Al-Qaradawi, in his book How the Imported Solutions Disastrously Affected Our Muslim Nation, states the following:
Secularism may be accepted in a Christian society but it can never enjoy a general acceptance in an Islamic society. The New Testament itself divides life into two parts: one for God, or religion, the other for Caesar, or the state: "Render unto Caesar things which belong to Caesar, and render unto God things which belong to God" (Matthew 22:21). As such, a Christian could accept secularism without any qualms of conscience. Furthermore, Westerners, especially Christians, have good reasons to prefer a secular regime to a religious one. Their experience with "religious regimes" - as they knew them - meant the rule of the clergy, the despotic authority of the Church, and the resulting decrees of excommunication and the deeds of forgiveness, i.e. letters of indulgence.
For Muslim societies, the acceptance of secularism means something totally different. Since Islam is a comprehensive system of `Ibadah (worship) and Shari`ah (legislation), the acceptance of secularism means abandonment of Shari`ah, a denial of the Divine guidance and a rejection of Allah’s injunctions. It is a total falsification to claim that Shari`ah is not proper to the requirements of the present age. The acceptance of a legislation formulated by humans means a preference of the humans’ limited knowledge to the Divine guidance: [Say! Do you know better than Allah?] (Al-Baqarah 2: 140).
For this reason, the call for secularism among Muslims is atheism and a rejection of Islam. Its acceptance as a basis for rule in place of Shari`ah is a downright apostasy. The silence of the masses in the Muslim world about this deviation has been a major transgression and a clear-cut instance of disobedience that has led to a sense of guilt, remorse, and inward resentment, all of which have generated discontent, insecurity, and hatred among committed Muslims because such deviation lacks legality.
Secularism is compatible with the Western concept of God which maintains that after God had created the world, He left it to look after itself. In this sense, God’s relationship with the world is like that of a watchmaker with a watch: he makes it then leaves it to function without any need for him. This concept is inherited from Greek philosophy, especially that of Aristotle who argued that God neither controls nor knows anything about this world. This is a helpless God as described by Will Durant. There is no wonder that such a God leaves people to look after their own affairs. How can He legislate for them when He is ignorant of their affairs? This concept is totally different from that of Muslims.

We Muslims believe that Allah, Glory be to Him, is the sole Creator and Sustainer of the Worlds. He is Omnipotent and Omniscient; that His mercy and bounties encompass everyone and suffice for all. In that capacity, Almighty Allah revealed His divine guidance to humanity, made certain things permissible and others prohibited, commanded people observe His injunctions and to judge according to them. If they reject this guidance and follow their own whims and man-made laws, then they commit transgression against Allah’s laws.

What matters is human being not the country or the East or the West. If secularism works in the West why it will not work in the Muslim world or for Muslims? The same Muslims who are now living in the west in millions, are doing very well in the West being citizens of different non Muslim countries.

What is secularism? It is simply putting religion and politics in its own place. A Mullah can very well run a mosque but not a government. This is why right from the time of the Prophet no Mullah ever ran any government. All the caliphs, sultans, amirs and other Muslim rulers were never religious scholars or Mullahs. There was always Qadi, Sufi, Mullah on one side and the Sultan on the other side.

At that time local customs were mixed with the religious injunctions and the legal system was evolved but now we have proper legal penal, criminal and civil codes along with constitutions so we do not need religious laws for governance.

[Shamlawar Khurasani]

Islam is a tool to achieve an end, I agree with this statement but only if we do not change the laws and regulations of islam, im open to new ideas and constructive criticism as long as they improve islam and not change anything in the quran. however Separating the Islamic state from the religion and saying that there is no politics in Islam. Such a belief denies the Qur'an and the Sunnah and the life of the Prophet.
heres an interesting passage:
Regarding the point of secularism and how Islam views it, the prominent Muslim scholar Sheikh Yusuf Al-Qaradawi, in his book How the Imported Solutions Disastrously Affected Our Muslim Nation, states the following:
Secularism may be accepted in a Christian society but it can never enjoy a general acceptance in an Islamic society. The New Testament itself divides life into two parts: one for God, or religion, the other for Caesar, or the state: "Render unto Caesar things which belong to Caesar, and render unto God things which belong to God" (Matthew 22:21). As such, a Christian could accept secularism without any qualms of conscience. Furthermore, Westerners, especially Christians, have good reasons to prefer a secular regime to a religious one. Their experience with "religious regimes" - as they knew them - meant the rule of the clergy, the despotic authority of the Church, and the resulting decrees of excommunication and the deeds of forgiveness, i.e. letters of indulgence.
For Muslim societies, the acceptance of secularism means something totally different. Since Islam is a comprehensive system of `Ibadah (worship) and Shari`ah (legislation), the acceptance of secularism means abandonment of Shari`ah, a denial of the Divine guidance and a rejection of Allah’s injunctions. It is a total falsification to claim that Shari`ah is not proper to the requirements of the present age. The acceptance of a legislation formulated by humans means a preference of the humans’ limited knowledge to the Divine guidance: [Say! Do you know better than Allah?] (Al-Baqarah 2: 140).
For this reason, the call for secularism among Muslims is atheism and a rejection of Islam. Its acceptance as a basis for rule in place of Shari`ah is a downright apostasy. The silence of the masses in the Muslim world about this deviation has been a major transgression and a clear-cut instance of disobedience that has led to a sense of guilt, remorse, and inward resentment, all of which have generated discontent, insecurity, and hatred among committed Muslims because such deviation lacks legality.
Secularism is compatible with the Western concept of God which maintains that after God had created the world, He left it to look after itself. In this sense, God’s relationship with the world is like that of a watchmaker with a watch: he makes it then leaves it to function without any need for him. This concept is inherited from Greek philosophy, especially that of Aristotle who argued that God neither controls nor knows anything about this world. This is a helpless God as described by Will Durant. There is no wonder that such a God leaves people to look after their own affairs. How can He legislate for them when He is ignorant of their affairs? This concept is totally different from that of Muslims.

We Muslims believe that Allah, Glory be to Him, is the sole Creator and Sustainer of the Worlds. He is Omnipotent and Omniscient; that His mercy and bounties encompass everyone and suffice for all. In that capacity, Almighty Allah revealed His divine guidance to humanity, made certain things permissible and others prohibited, commanded people observe His injunctions and to judge according to them. If they reject this guidance and follow their own whims and man-made laws, then they commit transgression against Allah’s laws.

Yusuf al Qaradhawi is a democrat himself. His ideas and views are not consistent with his preaching and his prescription for Islamic movements around the world.