Ummah/Muslim Brotherhood?

[KhalsaWarrior]

This is a thought that strikes me many a times and since this forum is predominantly composed of Muslim members, I think it might be a good place to see what people think -

If I am not wrong, Islam has the concept of Ummah where all Muslims are brothers and part of a larger nation without any division of race, creed ethnicity etc. Now my question is that according to Islam, does Ummah override national loyalties as well? Would a Muslim soldier (say American) battling Iraqi extremists or the Taliban be committing a sin or going against his religion?

I hope my query is not taken in the wrong sense. My post is plainly out of curiosity and to learn more from my fellow members in this forum.

[Dreamer]

depends if his view of the Iraq war was just... most muslims dont support action against fellow muslims...

[KhalsaWarrior]

depends if his view of the Iraq war was just... most muslims dont support action against fellow muslims...

Irrespective of his personal view? A soldier is not expected to let his personal views interfere with his duty.

Ok lets take a different example - An Indian Muslim soldier fighting against a Pakistani soldier?

[Dreamer]

Indian / pakistani conflics are political
Iraq war was abt greed- greed for oil, muslims on the whole dnt kill each other so a non muslim power can help itself 2 said muslims nations oil

[Dreamer]

The concept of umma is as you said it beyond borders and ethnicity... a muslim is 2 feet more affinity with a fellow muslim than a non muslim... thats not 2 say we hate non muslims but as co-religionisits we are more closely bound.... an extended family

[KhalsaWarrior]

The concept of umma is as you said it beyond borders and ethnicity... a muslim is 2 feet more affinity with a fellow muslim than a non muslim... thats not 2 say we hate non muslims but as co-religionisits we are more closely bound.... an extended family

If I hear you right, as long as the conflict is political and not religious a Muslim is supposed to go with his country. Right?

[Dreamer]

nope... a muslim should not raise his arms against a fellow muslim.... jews do the same, its not unique to muslims

[Khushal Khan Khattak]

If I am not wrong, Islam has the concept of Ummah where all Muslims are brothers and part of a larger nation without any division of race, creed ethnicity etc. Now my question is that according to Islam, does Ummah override national loyalties as well? Would a Muslim soldier (say American) battling Iraqi extremists or the Taliban be committing a sin or going against his religion?

This is just an attempt to create a rift between the idea of being an Afghan and a Muslim. So I'll just move onto what Khalsa thinks he is doing.

As a KhalsaWarrior, have you read your own Guru Granth? or are you still a Holy Warrior in the cause of India? have you forgotten what the Hindus did to the Sacred Golden Temple? how they came marching in with boots? killed thousands of helpless worshipers!!!

When will you stop acting like a warrior for those same Hindus and start acting like a warrior for the Khalsa? for your own people?

[Badlun]

Khalsa has raised a very important issue . I am writing an article on this issue which will be soon shared with the knowlñedgabe readers here but briefly I would say that this Umma concept is totally a fantasy of Muslims which has nothing to do with reality. There are about 58 Muslim nation states each one independent of another one. OIC is a paper tiger and there is no any other Muslim world wide effective Muslim organization.

Muslim Umma was shattered when the people of Madina stood againt the selection of Abubakar , the Makkan one and when hazrat Ali and Hazrat Ayesha fought each other and when the grandson of Muhammad was murdered and when Abassids killed Umayyads and when the sons of Aurangzeb killed each other and when Balban fought againt the Ghulaman and the wars among Tughluqs, Syeds, Lodhis, Mughals, Suris etc.

Islam is a religion which deals with individual beliefs, worship and morality and has nothing to do with political concepts of fraternity or alliances or Umma.

[Khushal Khan Khattak]

Islam is a religion which deals with individual beliefs, worship and morality and has nothing to do with political concepts of fraternity or alliances or Umma.

I really cannot think or imagine how you came to that conclusion bro, when there is like a million different reasons from genuine sources saying the complete opposite to that, but, lets see what your article/essay has to say.

[MeemWawMeemNoon]

This is a thought that strikes me many a times and since this forum is predominantly composed of Muslim members, I think it might be a good place to see what people think -

If I am not wrong, Islam has the concept of Ummah where all Muslims are brothers and part of a larger nation without any division of race, creed ethnicity etc. Now my question is that according to Islam, does Ummah override national loyalties as well? Would a Muslim soldier (say American) battling Iraqi extremists or the Taliban be committing a sin or going against his religion?

I hope my query is not taken in the wrong sense. My post is plainly out of curiosity and to learn more from my fellow members in this forum.

The answer to your question is: no.

If a Muslim from Iraq must fight a Muslim from Afghanistan then he must follow the orders of his commander-in-chief--he must follow those who are in authority.

[KhalsaWarrior]

nope... a muslim should not raise his arms against a fellow muslim.... jews do the same, its not unique to muslims

So there's no exception to this rule? An Indian Muslim soldier shouldn't be fighting a Pakistani Muslim soldier?

[KhalsaWarrior]

This is just an attempt to create a rift between the idea of being an Afghan and a Muslim. So I'll just move onto what Khalsa thinks he is doing.

As a KhalsaWarrior, have you read your own Guru Granth? or are you still a Holy Warrior in the cause of India? have you forgotten what the Hindus did to the Sacred Golden Temple? how they came marching in with boots? killed thousands of helpless worshipers!!!

When will you stop acting like a warrior for those same Hindus and start acting like a warrior for the Khalsa? for your own people?

Cut the BS. You obviously have a chip on your shoulder.

Open a new thread or PM me and we can discuss your questions above. I do not wish to derail this thread.

I believed the question of Ummah was an important one especially in relation to contemporary issues facing the Muslims today. And if the Mods think I am trying to create a rift or have ulterior motives behind opening this thread, please close it.