A question that has been bothering me,

[MeemWawMeemNoon]

That is what happens when anything get politicized.

[Niazmina]

It's alot deeper than people "blowing themselves up". Who are these people volunteering to commit suicide? Why do they agree to this? In Pashto we say, Halta Khalak Pa Ywa Rupai Pasai Halaak Wahi, our people don't have the reassurance that tomorrow there will be food on thier table or not, they have zero security and unfortunate circumstances like these can push even a common person to blow up a bomb, only because they know that tomorrow their families will have $200 from (insert political group name here).
Also, how do you think our people feel when they don't even have a single say in what goes on in thier country? Sure we're hospitable people but no one can bear see thier relatives get killed by a bunch of yankees because they "thought" they were "the taliban". We're short tempered people...

and there goes my train of thought.

[Badlun]

So, In my Philosophy of religion class, My professor asked,

"If Islam is a religion of peace, how come its always a Muslim trying to blow up buildings in New York, How come its a Muslim who are suicide bombers, And the regular"

Now my question is, What do you guys think of it? Is Islam truly an alien to the modern world?

Please do not Copy/Paste replies from other sources. Share what you think.

Thanks.

This is because of making Islam a political system too. Taliban and other religious extremists mix religion with politics and a group or individual take the role of state and want to implement sharia and carry out Jihad without a state in the shape of terrorism.

Blowing themselves off is considered a religious duty and a gate way to paradise. Religious extremists like salafis brainwash the young people and give them the entry ticket to paradise by killing others. According to these extremists all non muslims are to be killed and those who support the non Muslims like Afghan or Pakistani forces or all those who oppose these extremists are also non Muslims an dtheir killing is a religious duty and this way the terrorism by Muslims go on.

Ignorance,lack of education, lack mof exposure to modern developed world, poverty, absence of democracy etc are other causes of terrorism.

[Niazmina]

Well you'd think with about 40 countries currently in Afghanistan, it would move forward at least one bit (afterall, according to them they're there to help us out right?) then why is it not?
Anyway, I'm not sure what your idea of "development" is because we do have high end hotels where people throw thousands of $$ away to "celebrate". We've got the big Kabul mall which has almost every store you'd find over in the west. Our younger generation can dress 10X better than the afghans here lol

[Abdali]

In my opinion, The centre of these issues is how we interpret the Quran and Ahadith. We are too busy declaring sects as non-Muslims, we are busy saying Qadiyanis are Kafir, Shais are Kafir, So and so are Kafir. Yet we fail to realize, we all combined are a failed society presently. Look at us, we are the centre of attention. Afghanistan and Pakistan are both countries, That if you say you are from here in Australia, people will get scared of you. They start asking, "Do you believe in Jihad", "Do you believe that you will go to heaven".


Id like to ask our "Religious" scholars, here to come forward and explain this to us in a professional tone.

Thank you mate.

[Mayana]

"If Christianity is a peaceful religion, how come there are Cristians killing innoced civilians In Afghanistan and Iraq?"

Study the religion not the believers.

[Roshina]

I'm not even sorry to say this: He doesn't sound like a well-educated professor -- or a professor at all, mind you. One, because he dared to make such a silly judgment; he shouldn't be thinking that just because a person does something, it's because his parents compelled him to do it. Two, because he generalized about an entire religious group of people.

Professors aren't supposed to do that. I thought that was a law, and they could be fired for saying something like that. (This isn't free speech, by the way. It's saying that "because YOU are violent, your religion must be telling you to be violent." Or "Because YOU are a thief, your parents must be thieves themselves and must be supporting you." No. What about the people who are good because they believe religion tells them to be good?) Professors should know better than to say something as ridiculous and ignorant as "If Islam is a religion of peace, how come its always a Muslim trying to blow up buildings in New York, How come its a Muslim who are suicide bombers, And the regular."

I'm still shaking my head at the thought of a PROFESSOR asking such a question. Seriously? And are Muslims the only ones? Sure, some of the terrorists may justify their violent behavior within Islam using the Quran and hadiths, but at the same time, pacifist Muslims use the Quran and hadiths to explain why they're peaceful or are peace-loving. At the same time, also, Christopher Columbus and other non-Muslim terrorists used their religion to invade other people and rip them off their cultures, their utter existence, even. Did Christianity, or any other religion they claimed to be practicing, tell them to do that so? No, not necessarily.

But what did you say to him in response to his question, by the way? And what did other students say?

Gosh, I still can't believe someone who considers himself a professor would make such a remark. I wish I were there.

[Mayana]

Just tell him that Islam is the religion and if Muslims misinterpret it or misuse it for their own purposes, it doesn't make Islam less peaceful, it makes the people less peaceful.

[Roshina]

Qrratugai, He is an atheist and considers religion to be the root cause of all problems. I honestly said what I tried to say, but he started speaking statistics on how religion has massacred people. How many people have died in the name of religion.

He argued to use common sense and realize, Those countries that have been created for the name of religion are the worst on earth :Pakistan and Israel.

He argued that, Countries like Norway, Sweden have millions of atheists yet they have a great health care system and what not. I am just sad, This questioned bothered me so I stated it here on PashtunForums.

Jinkay Guley, those are two extremely different arguments. I'm against only his argument that "Muslim terrorists are terrorists because Islam is a terroristic religion." If his argument, however, is simply that "Religion is bad for humanity over all," then that's something else, and I totally understand this perspective. You initially made it seem as though he was saying that Muslims are bad because Islam makes them bad. And that's what made me say that this is not how professors are supposed to talk, not to a class, anyway. They may in private discussions.

Nonetheless, we've discussed the topic of whether religion is good or bad and/or whether there is any connection between religion and morality on PF in several threads before. Here, take a look at this one titled "Morality and Atheism."

That would sound like a more philosophy-class topic, anyway. I mean, the whole idea of whether people are good/bad because of religion or not. But if he was pointing out only Islam and Muslims, then that's where he's being absolutely unfair and biased.

Otherwise, it's all good with me.

[Levanaye Zalmaye]

Here's my reply to this:

Muslims should stop saying Islam is a religion of peace. Islam does not bring peace in the same way that Islam does not bring war. Islam does not bring justice just like Islam doesn't not bring injustice and tyranny.

Islam is a set of beliefs, period. Those beliefs have exalted people to pacifism and have driven others to terrorism.

Communism is a set of ideals. It has driven people to good and bad deeds.

Christianity is also a set of beliefs and it, too, has inspired the likes of Florence Nightingale and Mother Teresa as well as Pope Urban II and Cortez.

Therefore, religion X is not a religion of peace. It is a religion of individuals who may follow their own paths.

Lastly, religion X is not a religion of terrorism. Individuals need rallying points when confronting oppression. A state of mostly uneducated masses will see uprising in the name of religion. The just opposition to Al-Saud, Mobarak, Al-Bashar and Zardari therefore comes in the name of religion. Had the inhabitants there been the followers of religion Y, they would've rallied around that banner and not that of religion X.

I'd just like to add one more thing. This adds another perspective to the conversation. The East had been under a steady economic, social, political and scientific decline since the 15th century. This was the time the Silk Route was discarded, the great Arab caliphates ceased to exist one by one and most importantly, this was a time when revolutionary social movements began in Europe, the kind which are yet to take place here. All those factors combined, the Europeans advanced by leaps and bounds.

Here's an example of this - they have the B2 bomber. They spent the US$44 billion developing this and it costs close to US$800 million a piece. They also used the most cutting-edge physics and computer science to bring the plane from the drawing board to the skies. Now what does the east have in comparison? Nothing. Nothing we have even comes close to this. We have neither the know-how nor the resources. Therefore, our governments cannot resort to war with the West and our governments must listen to whatever their diplomats come here and say. Now that Western domination results in frustration among the masses who do not fully understand why it is that they're slaves. They want out. And this frustration is lent out in the form of acts of terrorism. So it just so happens that the Muslim world is scientifically and economically bankrupt and therefore, its individuals take matters into their own hands and since they don't have B2's to bomb them, they use suicide jackets.

[Mayana]

In general, don't argue with atheists about religious matters. All that''s gonna come out of it is them affecting your deen.
I wrote a paper about this and if you want to read it, it's here: http://pashtunforums.com/showthread.php?t=2124&
There are also some quotes form the Qur'an on how it condems violence and suicide etc. But with those kind of people.. you really can't argue. It's not about Islam or Christianity. It's about them being frustrated and cynical because deep inside them, it's dark and they can't find the light they need because their atheism doesn't let them open their eyes =/

[Roshina]

Mayana, he keeps on telling me I am committing a fallacy and starts saying these odd names of fallacies. I really want someone to learn about this.

Don't let it bother you, marey. There will ALWAYS be people who'll think positively of religion only because a few people they know might be good followers of a particular religion. But there will also ALWAYS be people who'll think negatively of religion in general because they might know people who are bad and follow a certain religion. Honestly, though, you can't blame people for judging a religion by its followers. It's only natural. We Muslims do it all the time, but we just don't realize it.

Also, there actually ARE certain interpretations of Islam that permit and support the violence committed by Taliban and other Muslim terrorists. We should never ignore that side of Islam, just as we shouldn't ignore it for other religions. But just as there's this negative, violent interpretation, there are more positive, peaceful interpretations as well. People should be aware of more than one possible interpretations before making up their mind. It's okay if they make up their mind -- and conclude that it's bad over all -- but they need to have looked at the others just to be sure.

[Roshina]

I told him Islam is a religion of peace, That is when all this started. He laughed at me so hard and spoke for 10 minutes and he just intellectually made a fool out of me. I felt so embarassed. He said, "I dont hate Islam, Its just look at what its causing".

Don't feel like a fool. But now you know what REALLY happens when you talk to an intellectual about Peace and Religion! You don't tell them something like this. You REALLY need to know what you're talking about before you make such a statement in front of someone who obviously knows what she/he is talking about.

[شمله ور خراساني]

You tell your philosophy professor that soon, Inshaa allah! Soon he will find out. LOOL

[Levanaye Zalmaye]

Levanye,Mayana.

I told him Islam is a religion of peace, That is when all this started. He laughed at me so hard and spoke for 10 minutes and he just intellectually made a fool out of me. I felt so embarassed. He said, "I dont hate Islam, Its just look at what its causing".

Can you further explain Levanaye,

Wow, a teacher laughing at his students for voicing their opinions.... it doesn't get any lower than that.

I made two points, which one do you think I should elaborate further?

You should ask your 'teacher' this - Okay, so what if we take Islam out of the equation? What if, for argument's sake, let's say that tomorrow, everyone from Morocco to Malaysia converts to Buddhism? Do you think that with that act of mass-conversion, would the Palestinian issue be resolved automatically, would the Chechens get relief, would the killings stop in Iraq and Afghanistan, would the war in FATA end? Ask him, is it as simple as that? His response would obviously be no and he'd say that there are other factors involved as well - factors such as economics, power politics, injustice, unequal distribution of wealth, lack of education, oppression, etc, etc... And THAT should be your argument too - that of course people use Islam to motivate young men to commit acts of terrorism but if Islam is indeed a cause of this, it is a small part of many, many causes of which American foreign policy is a part too. If he doesn't believe you, ask him to refer to Chomsky.