Where do you draw the line?

[MeemWawMeemNoon]

This is what ozymandias has said in another thread.

A discussion in a forum with Muslim people is not a good place to learn about Islam.

I feel that it is people with this type of approach who are responsible for giving Islam a bad name more than a few Muslim radicals and lunatics.

If you are not going to learn about Islam from Muslims, as a whole, then what right do you have to judge Islam based on those who only care about spreading negative propaganda about Islam? Where do you draw the line?

When you take away accountability for one's actions and thoughts then you create a society where people can do whatever they want. It becomes a society where might is right.

This type of thinking destroys the peaceful aspect of our social fabric. These types of mentalities are responsible for breeding hatred and resent.

[IamDZJ]

Lol... Line. Far away from ourselves... very very far away.

[ozymandias]

Ok, this will be my one and only post in this thread. The quote from me is not only altered, but it is taken out of context, and has been twisted to mean the opposite of what I actually said.

I have already addressed my concerns regarding these deliberate, and intentional lies concerning what I have said, and the biased and unfair way that those words have been presented.

That quote is *NOT* from me, nor does it honestly reflect any belief I have or have expressed -- and instead is a deliberate lie on the part of MeemWawMeemNoon -- and he has already been confronted regarding this issue in this post of mine:

http://www.pashtunforums.com/showpost.php?p=32943&postcount=921

I wash my hands of this thread and want nothing to do with it -- I do not intentionally continue conversations with liars and frauds.

[MeemWawMeemNoon]

The quote is taken from your post. I do sincerely apologize if I took it out of context.

[ozymandias]

The quote is taken from your post. I do sincerely apologize if I took it out of context.

I know I said I would not respond, but I will:

*You* said that this is not a good place to learn about Islam, and I responded with

A discussion in a forum with Muslim people is not a good place to learn about Islam?

Please note the *QUESTION MARK*, and the fact that my original *QUESTION* was placed immediately after a quote of you stating:

You might be thinking that you are learning truths, but you are just wasting your time. You are not looking in the right places.

You even correctly quoted my question the first few times you quoted it -- but later on you replaced the original *QUESTION MARK* with a *PERIOD* turning my request for clarification and incredulous query over *YOUR* statement that this is not a good place to learn about Islam.

I find it very interesting that not only did you change my question into a statement, you essentially swapped our positions -- you stated that this is not a good place to learn about Islam, but latter falsify a quote from me to indicate I said that -- and then you attack me for the very position *you*.

I feel that it is people with this type of approach who are responsible for giving Islam a bad name more than a few Muslim radicals and lunatics.

I agree. This is why I *DELIBERATELY* made an attempt to join in this community and discuss Islam with 'the man on the street' so that I can make my own judgment -- and not rely on the mass media, or impressions from a vocal minority that make it to the news.

Again, it is *YOU* that stated that this is not a good way to learn about Islam -- and you still have not stated what a good way to learn about Islam is.

If you are not going to learn about Islam from Muslims, as a whole, then what right do you have to judge Islam based on those who only care about spreading negative propaganda about Islam? Where do you draw the line?

Once again, learning about Islam from Muslims is why I am here, which I have made very clear repeatedly -- and I have already replied to this accusation from you -- but instead of replying or acknowledging that, you started a new thread.

In the original thread, after *correctly* quoting my reply, here is what you said:

You do realize what you just said--what I have been claiming the whole time--you are biased. This is very hypocritical of you.

At this point I remind you that you took that quote out of context, as that is the only possible way you could interpret it to mean the exact opposite of what it said.

At this point, you make the following statement:

I am not taking you out of context.

Please don't act like the victim. The victim here is Islam and you are the aggressor. It is written all over your posts.

I do not have a preconceived notion of you, and I am not twisting things. In fact, you have a preconceived notion about Islam and you are the one who is twisting things and are picking and choosing whatever suits your arguments.

I offered to discuss any topic with you so that we could clear up misunderstandings; however, this is the response that I got:


Quote:
Originally Posted by ozymandias

A discussion in a forum with Muslim people is not a good place to learn about Islam.

Do you find this fair? You be the judge.

Please note that in the course of a sinlge post, you falsely claim to not be taking me out of context, claim not to be twisting things, and then for the first time falsify the quote, changing a question into a statement. It's not as if you 'accidentally' left the question mark off -- you actually *replaced* the question mark with a period. Forgetting the punctuation would have been bad enough, and understandable as a mistake due to sloppy copy/pasting, but you actually edited my statement and changed the meaning by changing the punctuation.

You end with a comment asking if I find that fair -- No. I do not. You are being dishonest, and dirty and using dishonorable tactics and attempting to smear me on things I never said, implied, nor supported -- in fact they are the opposite of the things I did say, explicitly, and supported.

When I point this out, you reply with

ozy, who are you trying to kid?

To which Admin Khan requests we stay on topic -- and then you take the post I had already replied to, with the falsified quote, and start a new thread, completely blowing off my criticisms of your low down, dirty tactics and smear campaign you are starting.

It is *very* clear that this was not an honest mistake, as it was a deliberate editing, and you insisted on repeating the false quote, even though I pointed out you were lying. An honest mistake would have resulted in an apology that you made a mistake, and we could move on. As it is, you insisted on defending your lies and continuing to attack me for the false quote -- that you modified into supporting *your* original position.

At this point in time, there is little you can do besides apologize, both to me, and to the forum, for the lies you have made, and the shameful way you have acted. This is the *only* way you can restore any credibility you might have once had, and wipe the slate as clean as we can. How else can we be expected to trust a single thing you say, when you have been caught at such an obvious lie, and insisted on defending it?

[MeemWawMeemNoon]

Nothing was done intentionally.

I also think that you took me out of context, now that I see your explanation. Otherwise, I don't think that we would have had this whole confusion.

Nonetheless, I sincerely apologize.

[MeemWawMeemNoon]

Let us just continue with this thread.

http://www.pashtunforums.com/showthread.php?t=1663

I hope you will take advantage of this and learn about Islam.