Some more about the South Park Vs. Islam.

[imb706]

Thunderf00t has made some videos about the topic, pretty interesting:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y7RvTw4qEq4&playnext_from=TL&videos=q7WfNUZlW90&feature=rec-LGOUT-exp_fresh%2Bdiv-1r-1-HM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6OWaZVMBw1E&feature=youtube_gdata

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZcJwRCv9g88&feature=channel

Muslims now hate Thunderf00t, with Viacoms backing XD. He's like an Atheist Maddox, he's actually won against billionaire companies.gl

[IamDZJ]

first i will buy me a burqa and then i will make me a youtube account....

[imb706]

There was this babe that was called "Why I wear the Burqa" on YouTube and would talk about weird things, like how to wear a condom and such. Then she flashed herself and got kicked off...lol.

[Khushal Khan Khattak]

There was this babe that was called "Why I wear the Burqa" on YouTube and would talk about weird things, like how to wear a condom and such. Then she flashed herself and got kicked off...lol.

The real problem with these things is that we the people dont know how to act !!

South Park is a sarcastic cartoon > CARTOON !!!.

It makes fun of Jews, Judaism, Christianity, Jesus PBUH, Islam, Muhammad PBUH and many other things.

As a Muslim I know that making fun of any of the above is un Islamic, including making fun of Jews.

So, if I am a Muslim and am offended, I should:

1) Advocate to avoid South Park. Thats all it requires.
2) If I am still not contended, then use legal means to sue them for the hurt that they have caused.

still the best way is just to not watch South Park. Ignore it.

[imb706]

Well, finally, a sensible muslim with a sensible plan. Well, mostly.

2) If I am still not contended, then use legal means to sue them for the hurt that they have caused.

That's even worse, trying to get the government to censor for you. Hell no. Don't like muhammad cartoons, just don't watch cartoons.

Thanks for the feedback.

[Khushal Khan Khattak]

Well, finally, a sensible muslim with a sensible plan. Well, mostly.

That is why I said at the end aka the bottomline >

still the best way is just to not watch South Park. Ignore it.

However, freedom of press/expression does not mean to go around making fun of the important sentiments of billions.

With power comes responsibility.

Freedom of press/expression also means caring about others that would not agree with you.

You differ in your opinion > good,

You want to express it > better still,

You want to express it and make cheap fun of the others , > shame on you!!

[imb706]

However, freedom of press/expression does not mean to go around making fun of the important sentiments of billions.

Well, actually it does. Everyone from Thomas Paine, to Charles Darwin, to Martin Luther King Jr to pretty much everyone who offended the sentiments of millions couldn't have done their profound contributions without protection of their freedom of speech, hell, the first two I just listed didn't even have that good protection. They had to fight for it.

Freedom of press/expression also means caring about others that would not agree with you.

It has nothing to do with caring, it just means anyone can say what they want without legal sanctions.

[Khushal Khan Khattak]

Well, actually it does. Everyone from Thomas Paine, to Charles Darwin, to Martin Luther King Jr to pretty much everyone who offended the sentiments of millions couldn't have done their profound contributions without protection of their freedom of speech

Thomas Paine, to Charles Darwin, to Martin Luther King Jr to pretty much everyone

Yes the list is big, like, Isaac Newton, Max Plank, Yohannes Kepler, Galileo and on and on and on.

BUT..........

Argument invalid, here is why!!!


Take anyone of these, for example, Yohannes Kepler or Galileo, who said the earth was not the center of the universe and that it was round.

This is against the bible which says:

1) Earth is center of the universe.
2) Earth is flat.

People and the clergy made sure these scientists were made to suffer.

Still they did not falter, and today we know the earth is round and science advanced greatly.

However,

Drawing Yahweh or Moses as a radiant oblong/oval gooish light and him talking goofy things does not serve science or anything constructive.

What will this achieve?

Instead your'e making sure that Jews, Christians, Muslims are offended.

Why?

[imb706]

Yes the list is big, like, Isaac Newton, Max Plank, Yohannes Kepler, Galileo and on and on and on.

BUT..........

Argument invalid, here is why!!!


Take anyone of these, for example, Yohannes Kepler or Galileo, who said the earth was not the center of the universe and that it was round.

This is against the bible which says:

1) Earth is center of the universe.
2) Earth is flat.

Um, it's irrelevant since they offended millions of people and the socio-political establishment of their times? Um...how?

Drawing Yahweh or Moses as a radiant oblong/oval gooish light and him talking goofy things does not serve science or anything constructive.

It doesn't? It doesn't bring to light real problems with a major religion which obviously doesn't share the same values that made modern society modern in the first place? So when a political cartoonist draws a lampooning image of someone to draw attention to a real issue, that doesn't do any good?

But the ironic thing is the muhammad cartoons and such weren't even trying to do that, they were simple caricatures.

Instead your'e making sure that Jews, Christians, Muslims are offended.

All those groups got offended horribly by the people I listed. The US founding fathers were labeled as heretical satanist by Christians because they supported secularism and since many were not Christians and tolerated non-christians, even tolerated atheist and non believers. You have to offend people to get things done.

[ozymandias]

http://friendlyatheist.com/2010/05/04/update-on-wisconsin-college-atheist-group-drawing-muhammad-on-campus/

Protest done right.

[Free Thinker]

I do believe this shows lack of academia even though defending freedom is the main objective. Yet I also believe we will not achieve our goals by acting like children.

[imb706]

Well I don't see how terrorism is defending freedom, at least not in this context. The muslim terrorist aren't fighting for freedom, they're fighting against it. They're the biggest babies on Earth.

[Khushal Khan Khattak]

Sorry for the late reply, something happened so .........
Well in continuity of the previous posts about how freedom of expression demands responsibility, here is the concluding argument........

--------------------------------

Person A & B have opposing views. Both believe in freedom of expression. Both want to express their views which are contradictory. A believes he is right, B believes he is right. With the socially advanced times that we live in, what does the higher moral ground demand of us? How should A & B go about expressing their views.

Resolution 1 - The Saner way:

So, for example, Galileo says the Earth is not the center of the universe, the Church says it is, Galileo does not make fun of Jesus but goes to the lab and produces raw data and evidence, the Church analyzes it, whether it accepts it or not, Galileo does his part. Galileo wins. If the Church accepts, which it eventually did, it wins as well. It is a win win.


Freedom of expression also includes the realization that one should not go beyond bounds since this impinges upon the freedom of expression of the opposite side.

Simply put, if exercised out of control what you are doing is that you are denying the freedom of expression of the other. This in itself is against the freedom of expression. It violates others' rights.


Resolution 2 - The I dont care way:

Galileo calls the Church idiots and fools who believe in something that cannot be proven, Galileo at this time is one man, the Church represents millions, Galileo enrages all those millions, the Church is angry since its authority is challenged, it declares Galileo a heretic, bans him from scientific research, The Theory of Motion and therefore Gravity is delayed by another century or so.

Galileo loses, the Church and Humanity loses, all sides lose.


----------------------------------------------

All that said, this South Park fiasco is much more childish and non nonsensical, what do they actually hope to achieve for mankind by making unwanted and useless fun of the Prophet Muhammad PBUH??

So defending them in the name of the freedom of expression is not a just cause. It doesnt even serve the very noble cause of the freedom of expression.

[ozymandias]

All that said, this South Park fiasco is much more childish and non nonsensical, what do they actually hope to achieve for mankind by making unwanted and useless fun of the Prophet Muhammad PBUH??

Supporting free speech. One group out their seeks to limit the exercise of free speech through fear. This is unacceptable and wrong.

So defending them in the name of the freedom of expression is not a just cause. It doesnt even serve the very noble cause of the freedom of expression.

How so? It brings to light the irrational actions of a group. It (should) be driving a wedge between these amoral people, and those they seek aid and succor from by highlighting exactly how irrational they are acting.

In the case of South Park, they actually gave Islam very special treatment, and treated Mohammad far, far better than they did any other religion. They refused to even treat Mohammad on par with an average citizen (image only, no mocking), while they stooped to extremes to mock the religious leaders and icons of other religions. They stated that they were afraid of irrational, violent reprisals from the Muslim community as a reason to avoid doing more. What happened? They got irrational, violent reprisals and threats from the Muslim community.

The very action they were highlighting and trying to expose for the restriction on free speech that it is -- got them the very behavior they were lampooning.

It served a very important goal, and as disrespectful as it was, it was very important that they did it.