The Last Days of Taliban Head Mullah Omar

[khushal]

...the hell? Sounds like, You are changing goal posts.

https://www.logicallyfallacious.com/tools/lp/Bo/LogicalFallacies/129/Moving-the-Goalposts

But ...Okay another sources:

William Maley, The Afghanistan Wars. p. 220.

https://books.google.com/books?id=Rf8nBQAAQBAJ&pg=PT213&lpg=PT213&dq=On+29+October+1994,+a+convoy+of+trucks,+including+a+notorious+ISI+officer,+Sultan+Amir+...+and+two+figures+who+were+later+to+become+prominent+Taliban+leaders,+entered+Afghanistan.&source=bl&ots=yE3sdzHZar&sig=ACfU3U2Bpd7fdUFYynCJRRQ-OBYmVTQIaQ&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwj0wo-wo6bhAhVMON8KHWEyB9cQ6AEwC3oECAoQAQ#v=onepage&q=On%2029%20October%201994%2C%20a%20convoy%20of%20trucks%2C%20including%20a%20notorious%20ISI%20officer%2C%20Sultan%20Amir%20...%20and%20two%20figures%20who%20were%20later%20to%20become%20prominent%20Taliban%20leaders%2C%20entered%20Afghanistan.&f=false

Here's the Rashid quote, there's a Paywall for this article but this is the quote.

https://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/afghanistan/1999-11-01/taliban-exporting-extremism

Peter Tomsen interview

https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/taliban/interviews/tomsen.html#1

The interview also deals with more with what incriminates the Taliban as Pakistani stooges, but we'll focus on what was requested.

There were FATA Pashtuns fighting in Afghanistan just like they are now but 80,000 is far fetched. What did they do count them. Plus wasn't col imam killed by Talibs and weren't Talibs handed to US forces by ISI.

[khushal]

What does that have to do with whether he was propped up by Nadir Qoli's army?

Being propped up means acquiring power. It doesn't rely on whether a certain presently existing Nation-state existed or not. Seriously, you're too sloppy.

He was a part of NAdir Qolis army.

[khushal]

The Taliban wouldn't permit a porous border if Pakistan opted not to, I mean regulating the border can be just as easily co-opted to their interests if Taliban were in power.

the border is only regulated from one side. Unregulated border benefits both sides but more Afghanistan than Pakistan. Having a real regulated border which has only happened during the US created Afghan gov is detrimental to Afghanistan especially to Pashtuns since the movement of people and goods hence trade ceases.

[Iblis_Efreetzai]

The difference is the Soviets did the fighting for the Afghan gov.

then soviets were stooges of the commie Afghan Govt.?

[Iblis_Efreetzai]

He was a part of NAdir Qolis army.

And propped up by them....read his memoirs.

[Iblis_Efreetzai]

There were FATA Pashtuns fighting in Afghanistan just like they are now but 80,000 is far fetched. What did they do count them. Plus wasn't col imam killed by Talibs and weren't Talibs handed to US forces by ISI.

Col. Imam was killed by Pakistani Taliban , Afghan Taliban are seen by Pakistanis as "good Taliban" since they pander to their interests so they'd kiss this man's feet.

Yes Pakistan gave up Talib leaders, which was part of their "soothe the angry giant" strategy. Talibs are an expendable resource for Pakistan. Which explains why Mullah Umar was scared, he knew it too.

[Insight]

What does that have to do with whether he was propped up by Nadir Qoli's army?

Being propped up means acquiring power. It doesn't rely on whether a certain presently existing Nation-state existed or not. Seriously, you're too sloppy.

Lol now that you made this claim, show me proof that Persian troops were the ones propping him up in Kandahar when he took power and formed his empire

Persians NOT Pashtuns ok. I need your sources

[Insight]

Col. Imam was killed by Pakistani Taliban , Afghan Taliban are seen by Pakistanis as "good Taliban" since they pander to their interests so they'd kiss this man's feet.

Yes Pakistan gave up Talib leaders, which was part of their "soothe the angry giant" strategy. Talibs are an expendable resource for Pakistan. Which explains why Mullah Umar was scared, he knew it too.

Were the Vietnamese stooges of Russia/China due to being backed by them in the same way Taliban is backed by Pak/Iran?

I have answered your questions BUT you lack the ability to answer mine

[Iblis_Efreetzai]

Were the Vietnamese stooges of Russia/China due to being backed by them in the same way Taliban is backed by Pak/Iran?

I have answered your questions BUT you lack the ability to answer mine

I said earlier I'm not going to feed into your attempt to vindicate Taliban by the analogy strategy.

I also noted that this is a false equivalence; you're ignoring the fact that the Taliban were basically engineered by Pakistan. So your lead up to make an analogy with the Taliban wouldn't add up. It is a completely irrelevant smokescreen tactic.

Why do you expect me to entertain a logical fallacy with any legitimacy? Straighten yourself out. learn to debate.

[Iblis_Efreetzai]

or was Washington a stooge of the French for receiving Aid from them against King George.

Was Washington created and engineered by the French as part of their geopolitical strategy to use Washington as a "Pro French" puppet against one of France's rivals?

[Iblis_Efreetzai]

the border is only regulated from one side. Unregulated border benefits both sides but more Afghanistan than Pakistan. Having a real regulated border which has only happened during the US created Afghan gov is detrimental to Afghanistan especially to Pashtuns since the movement of people and goods hence trade ceases.

Not necessarily, it depends on the aims of the geopolitics involved. Right now, closing the border could work as a way to "squeeze" out India ...and since Pakistan is one of the current benefactors for the Taliban, and given the Taliban are desperate for it, I'm sure they'd parlay those aims.

Taliban are neither Noble Muslim Warriors nor are they Patriotic Afghans.

[Iblis_Efreetzai]

Lol now that you made this claim, show me proof that Persian troops were the ones propping him up in Kandahar when he took power and formed his empire

Persians NOT Pashtuns ok. I need your sources

Well I said Nadir Qoli's army, but Okay

https://journals.openedition.org/samaj/3147

The 1773 official court history of Ahmad Khan Abdali, Tarikh-e Ahmad Shahi, by Mahmud al-Husaini (reprinted, Moscow 1974) contains no reference to Ahmad Khan as having, doing, or speaking Pashtu. The words Pashtu and Pashtun are not mentioned in this official history of the founder of the so called Durrani empire. Nor is there any textual reference in this book that connects Abdali, Durani, Sadozai, or Ahmad Khan’s numerous looting forays into India and Khorasan to Pashtu, Pashtun tribes, or Pashtunwali. Ahmad Khan Abdali was born in Multan, raised in Herat, and groomed in the Persianate court of Emperor Nadir Shah Afshar (1738-1747). Ahmad Khan Abdali’s sons were named: Suleiman Mirza, Timur Mirza, Chehab Mirza, Sanjar Mirza, Yazdan Bakhsh Mirza, Sekandar Mirza, Dara Mirza, Parwaez Mirza. These constructs are out of place in the teknonymic traditions of Pashtuns and Afghanistan in general.

[khushal]

Col. Imam was killed by Pakistani Taliban , Afghan Taliban are seen by Pakistanis as "good Taliban" since they pander to their interests so they'd kiss this man's feet.

Yes Pakistan gave up Talib leaders, which was part of their "soothe the angry giant" strategy. Talibs are an expendable resource for Pakistan. Which explains why Mullah Umar was scared, he knew it too.

But the bad taliban had pledged allegiance to M Omar. also the haqqanis and TTP are closely alligned.

The whole game is circular. US funds pakistan, pakistan supports talibs, talibs kill us soldiers -- us fund pakistan......
Therefore US funds the killing of their own soldiers.

Pakistan supports talibs, talibs support TTP, TTP kills pakistani soldiers---- pakistan supports talibs......
Therefore pakistan supports the killing of their soldiers.

Pakistan is a necessary evil that the US needs to keep the region divided While pakistan needs the necessary evil (TAliban) to keep india out of its north and north west.


Saudi supports Taliban, Taliban supports AQ, AQ wants to depose the Saudis---Saudi supports Talibs.....
Therefore Saudis Supports their own ouster

Saudi regards the necessary evil (taliban) to keep Iran contained just like they were against the deposing of Saddam who wanted to invade them to keep iran contained.

Its called Risk management.

[khushal]

Not necessarily, it depends on the aims of the geopolitics involved. Right now, closing the border could work as a way to "squeeze" out India ...and since Pakistan is one of the current benefactors for the Taliban, and given the Taliban are desperate for it, I'm sure they'd parlay those aims.

Taliban are neither Noble Muslim Warriors nor are they Patriotic Afghans.

Again its risk management. Closing borders hurts both sides but it usually hurts the poor neighbor more in this example it would be afghanistan.
Just like closing the US mex border will hurt both sides but it will hurt mex ico more since they are more poor.
Pakistan purpose of closing the border is to punish afghanistan for being friendly with india. It still hurts pakistan economically but they view an india friendly afghan state as a bigger threat to any economic cost.

Pakistan is the desperate one here. Taliban will still exist without pakistan just like the TTP exists without pakistan.

[khushal]

Was Washington created and engineered by the French as part of their geopolitical strategy to use Washington as a "Pro French" puppet against one of France's rivals?

according to king george. yes.

side note here; G washington was convinced that jefferson was a french puppet til his death.