Pashton civil war Unavoidable?

[Azmal]

The easy the ISI proxies are targeting Pashton nationalist, tribal elders and intellectual it looks like there will be a show down...sooner then later...there is no common ground between Talibi ideology and Pan-pashtonism...taliban wants a total control of not only gov but even peoples life, the way ppl dress, the way they eat and they way they act. So the question arise when the civil war which i believe had already started gets hotter...which powers can back pashton nationalist against the Taliban and their ISI masters?
What you guys think US, China, Suadi Arabia(unlike) even Iran…which one of these countries interest is to promote pashton nationalist?

[BLS_1919v2.0]

Also Pakistan would love to see Taliban back in Kandahar because it wants to see an uneducated Afghan generation that is brainwashed.

Yaraa Aseer I don't think taliban are as monolithic of a group as before nor as dependent on Pakistan. They are getting arms from other countries as well and it is not as if Pakistan can play the same game of the 90s. A really huge civil war in Afghanistan will spillover in Pakistan and we know how that will play. 90s playbook worked because US, UK, and China as well as Saudi were either willing to foot the bill or support them. Those days are gone. And regional players have expanded in power.

[Azmal]

Thanks for you reply, i wanted to discuss the inter-war between religion extremist--supported by Pakistani establishment--Taliban and Pashton nationalist...not the other ethnic groups…but anyways since you have mention them...here are my 2 cents.

In Afghanistan it will be as follows.

Pakistan will support Pashtuns and have them force for an independent Talibanized Southern Afghanistan.

You mean Taliban NOT PASHTON! For if a real Pashtons take power in kabul..that will be Pakistan worst nightmare. The only Pashtons Pakistan like and backs are those brainwashed into illusion of Islamic brotherhood, those simple village people that can be manipulated and used.

Iran will support Hazaras.

hum Iran is extending their scope and are trying to fallow a multi-dominions politics in Afghanistan...its simple not Shiaism, but even Farsi-ism and then some are talking about opening to nationalist pashtons..Radio Iran has recently extending their Pashto services and Irani embassy in Kabul are actively developing interaction with Pashton politicians. Off course Iran can never sellout their Shia counterparts..so yes in long run Iran will continue Hazara support.

India will support Tajiks.

This is again very complicated, there was an article a while ago which stated India is trying to open up communication with Taliban...the fact is Indians know for sure that they have to relay on Pashtons to achieve their objective...now how will Pashton nationalist open up to India and developed their relationship is something to be seen.

The only people who I see backing us up is Russia. Yes you head me we need Russian support. Russias enemy is the USA and Pakistan since both are allied. Russia would love to see Pakistan break apart.

I don't think so, first b/c Russia paid dearly by supporting Pashton nationalist, second Pakistan and USA are not allied as some Pakistani generals are trying to make us believe...USA views Pakistan with hostility and there are even talk of attack Pakistani nukes. I think in long run USA can more actively support Pashton nationalist...i don't think USA will leave the ground open for Pakistani proxies Taliban...but then this must be seen...will USA once again rely on islamist fanatics to reach her goal in central and euro-Asia? or USA have learned their lesson and will not repeat their past mistake---relying on Pakistan to do their bidding.

[Nick]

I am very glad that we have such great smart people in here although divided in mind but share great knowledge and love.

Azmal you have some Good points, Good Job,

Aseer jaan yes you are right in some points yes Pakistan doesn't want an aggressive, educated Afghan government but rather Puppet like Karzai or idiotic Mullahs who doesn't know how to read or write.

But from Other prospective I personally think you are into this ISI "Media" trap. Because ISI wants people like you and me to be influenced by such rubbish of their past deeds that Pakistan loves Taliban and they want Taliban back. Otherwise why would they openly say "Ohh We Pak*is created them" and supported them, and now are trapped" in Reality they are not trapped but rather they are fighting Pashtun nationalism, with Pashtun Nationalism also comes Taliban elements, an old friend now an enemy, what's interesting they never bring the issue of Pashtun nationalism and always associate it with Taliban/Terrorism. At the same time their own ISI media posts some Ironic claims that ISI said this and agreement with Taliban on this and that etc, which is all lies. In reality they are in war with Taliban, and Pashtun nationalism, and they want non of them being stronger. Not in Afghanistan or in Pakistan.This is true. Also look at this whole Wiki stuff is part of this great game to make Afghans think twice and at the same time reject Taliban, and America altogether this would mean American Agenda remains along with a Puppet Government. I have read some these Wiki Leak stuff is weird but somehow USA is not commenting. Why? because they also want to leave. Americans need to win the war in Iraq as well and they have broader agenda, so Afghanistan is not their only mission but many other missions planed ahead. But yet Americans still have their puppet stalled a Powerful pro-Western Government like Pakistan, and strong agency like ISI so that Game goes on once a while. Perhaps Early British Creation of Pakistan might give u an idea of how British wanted their pro-western agenda remained in Pakistan, which is what we witnessed during many occasions, and sensitive issues. Yes its also true that there are fake Taliban who bomb mosques and tombs and civilians under banner of Taliban, usually attack on Pashtu population.


Therefore consider BSL's point view, Pakistan had one chance in 90s and Pakistan lost that. Despite the fact I agree with you that Taliban are uneducated, but in reality now people are way educated and as well as the Taliban who learned from their mistakes. I am very sure if American Agenda is taken out of Puppet Government, or at least USA leaves Taliban will also disappear and won't be in position of running the Government or if so they need to teach themselves clicking into computers. To my eyes Taliban of 1990s are death and modern Taliban are of those same Mujahiden of 80s. This time may Allah help us and help them to win this war, but these Taliban Commanders need to learn from 1990s and they need to be careful with whom to battle and not become another Mujahideen turning into warlords of 1990s. <<< This is what people are scared of another era of 1990s.

[Millatpal Noorzai]

"To my eyes Taliban of 1990s are death and modern Taliban are of those same Mujahiden of 80s"

Mr.Nick,
I guess i wasted my whole time reading your post to conclude with such illogical outcome!
A force of 150,000 armed and well trained fighters who took over 95% of Afghanistan in a year or so is dead and the psuedo Mujahideens who fought in 80s who are most likely weak and old enough to hold or fire a weapon, are running the show?????
Mujahideen of 80s tranformed themselves into Rapists,Robbers Murderers and traitors who are not in people's good books and should be considered part of the history.

Please don't respond to my post i am going to bed.

[Palwasha]

Civil war, as in Pashtuns against Pashtuns? God forbid! It would truly be the end of us.

It has crossed my mind before, but I sincerely hope nothing of the sort ever occurs, InshAllah.