Too many guys from defence.pk are lurking on this forum

[vsdoc]

It means "greater Afghanistan"

Yes i am a Pakistani Pashtun, a law abiding citizen of Pakistan........and no, i would for things to improve in Pakistan rather than praying for its destruction at the hands of India .......if Pakistan disintegrates naturally , i would support merger of Pashtun belt of Pakistan with Afghanistan.....and even then i would desire Punjab to be buffer state between Indian and Afghanistan

Nothing happens "naturally"

You are a mature guy.

Cheers, Doc

[vsdoc]

You see [MENTION=18842]Samandri[/MENTION]

THIS (your post) is the difference.

No Punjabi, on either side of the border, would want the other half (yes they want the land, the gurudwaras and mosques, the fields and mangos, etc. etc etc - NOT the people!).

But Sindh - you are seeing it unravel in front of your own eyes.

Balochistan - they have never accepted since the first days of creation of your nation state. Why will they start now?? For what?

And your Pashtun areas - we all know what Pashtuns think. Especially when Pakistanis talk about refugees. Rich coming from a nation that is squatting on someone else's land. The writ of the state has never worked, there. Will never work there, with or without the army and its zarb-e-infinity's.

Kya bacha pakistan ka dost? That which "Pakistan" always was. A virulent strain of elitist Punjabi Muslims who did not want to live under the larger Hindu populace.

And dragged the rest of the jokers along for the epic ride.

Cheers, Doc

[Samandri]

You do know that Balochistan is going first, and your chance is next right?

Balochistan can not win independence on their own.......as they are absent from power structure of Pakistan, so their rebellion is not crumbling Pakistan from within, they are marginal and very small in numbers. They are not wining, ..........and the Baloch fighters on mountains are unable to carry on a deadly insurgency.......

yes human rights violation is going on in Baluchistan....the ones with separatist voices are getting disappeared.....and the huts of innocent Balochs are getting burned as collective punishment......India is burning Balochistan at low temperature, just to annoy Pakistan in tit-for-tat for kashmir

[vsdoc]

India is burning Balochistan at low temperature, just to annoy Pakistan in tit-for-tat for kashmir

India is doing that, and has been doing that more north west.

We have no beef with the Afghans. Nor with the Iranians. And Pashtunistan (if you allow the loose phrase) has no importance for India. That is where the irritant value lies. To take the PA away from Kashmir.

Balochistan is vital. There is no minor irritant value there. It is huge stakes.

Balochistan will not break away on its own.

Just as Bangladesh never broke away on its own.

Cheers, Doc

[vsdoc]

Let me put it more clearly.

If tomorrow pakistan reforms and quits meddling in Kashmir.

Balochistan will still be lost.

Cheers, Doc

[Samandri]

You see @Samandri

THIS (your post) is the difference.

No Punjabi, on either side of the border, would want the other half (yes they want the land, the gurudwaras and mosques, the fields and mangos, etc. etc etc - NOT the people!).

But Sindh - you are seeing it unravel in front of your own eyes.

Balochistan - they have never accepted since the first days of creation of your nation state. Why will they start now?? For what?

And your Pashtun areas - we all know what Pashtuns think. Especially when Pakistanis talk about refugees. Rich coming from a nation that is squatting on someone else's land. The writ of the state has never worked, there. Will never work there, with or without the army and its zarb-e-infinity's.

Kya bacha pakistan ka dost? That which "Pakistan" always was. A virulent strain of elitist Punjabi Muslims who did not want to live under the larger Hindu populace.

And dragged the rest of the jokers along for the epic ride.

Cheers, Doc

Punjab is just enjoying the benefits of being in majority...........the real creators of Pakistan were Muslim elites from present-day India......pre-partition politics of Punjab was mostly dominated by Unionist Party which believed in unity of Muslims, Hindus and Sikhs of Punjab....

The Punjabis are not absolute villains.....if Balochs were majority in Pakistan, they would have oppressed other Pakistanis in very brutal manner, as they are more prone to be oppressors (for example the oppressing landlords or waderas in Sindh and South Punjab are mostly Baloch by descent)......if Pashtuns were majority in Pakistan, they would run the things like they are running in Afghanistan......in my own province, the Pashtuns from Peshawer valley (who dominate the politics of province) are unjust and biased towards Pashtuns of southern districts which are very backward. Majority is unjust towards minority in third world country

[vsdoc]

Punjab is just enjoying the benefits of being in majority...........the real creators of Pakistan were Muslim elites from present-day India......per-partition politics of Punjab was mostly dominated by Unionist Party which believed in unity of Muslims, Hindus and Sikhs of Punjab....

The Punjabis are not absolute villains.....if Balochs were majority in Pakistan, they would have oppressed other Pakistanis in very brutal manner, as they are more prone to be oppressors (for example the oppressing landlords or waderas in Sindh and South Punjab are mostly Baloch by descent)......if Pashtuns were majority in Pakistan, they would run the things like they are running in Afghanistan.

History is great. But 70 years have passed.

We (India) recognizes what it faces across the border today.

We recognize what is in our interest. What we want. And what needs to be done to make it happen.

And like any other nation, with the means and the will, we are working towards it.

Your analogy of slow fire is very correct. Years ago I had used the same on PDF, much to every Pakistani's chagrin.

The difference between dropping a frog in a pot of boiling water and bringing to boil the water in a pot with the frog inside.

Cheers, Doc

[Samandri]

LOL.

Truckloads of the famed braveheart SSG turning tail and fleeing.

On land they have always held.

Please give us a break with your fairy tales. There are many in India who have actually seen the footage of what we did to you.

Ghar mein ghuss kar maara tumko. Kya ukhaad loge?

Chetawni. Agli baar tumhare gharon mein ghusenge. Sudhar jao. Nahin to bhari padega.

The difference between Indian army and Pakistan army can be observed in seeing how they deal with militants........Indian soldiers , led by an officer of colonel or major rank, will be tackling the militants in in Kashmir in bold gun-fight.......Pakistani officer of colonel on the other hand wont come to battle ground , wont dare to face militants in gun-battle, and would order shelling of the entire houses or area through artillery or tank , and would even seek help from F-16 Jets and Gunship helicopters.....thus causing great losses of innocent lives so they themselves suffer no casualty...they do not desire martyrdom and are generally afraid of death with few exceptions. In the beginning of Taliban insurgency , dozens (even hundreds on occasions) of Pakistani soldiers were surrendering to Taliban.....but as Taliban were beheading such soldiers, so they stopped surrendering and had no choice but to fight.

I am no fan of India or Indian army but I am just calling spade a spade

[vsdoc]

The difference between Indian army and Pakistan army can be observed in seeing how they deal with militants........Indian soldiers , led by an officer of colonel or major rank, will be tackling the militants in in Kashmir in bold gun-fight.......Pakistani officer of colonel on the other hand wont come to battle ground , wont dare to face militants in gun-battle, and would order shelling of the entire houses or area through artillery or tank , and would even seek help from F-16 Jets and Gunship helicopters.....thus causing great losses of innocent lives so they themselves suffer no casualty...they do not desire martyrdom and are generally afraid of death with few exceptions. In the beginning of Taliban insurgency , dozens (even hundreds on occasions) of Pakistani soldiers were surrendering to Taliban.....but as Taliban were beheading such soldiers, so they stopped surrendering and had no choice but to fight.

I am no fan of India or Indian army but I am just calling spade a spade

Fact remains their army has lost its nerve after Kargil.

They (you) were never supposed to lose from those heights.

And we ripped through you from below while never crossing the LOC.

That (in a soldier's psyche) is a mortally crippling blow. It makes lesser men pause and give in to doubt.

And from doubt comes fear.

Cheers, Doc

[Kakar-Wardak]

There is only one weak hadith, mentioned in less reliable book of 915 AD,.....some scholars say that it might refer to the invasion of Sindh by the Arabs under Muhammad bin Qasim in the eighth century........Masnad of Ahmad ibn Hanbal, , mentions that the "Muslim army that would attack India would be sent in the direction of Sindh and Hind".

Other believe that it is possible that this hadith report is not genuine at all and that it might have been fabricated at the time of Muhammad bin Qasim’s invasion of Sindh in order to justify it....


Whatever is the case, the so called "Ghazva-Hind" has already been waged against ancestors of modern day Pakistanis in Sindh and in Multan (south Punjab) in 8th century

That might be the case but what about the hadith in Sunan nisai something like two groups from my ummah will be saved from the hellfire one which invades hind and the other which takes Jerusalem this is to the beat of my memory so I might not have quoted exact.

[Samandri]

That might be the case but what about the hadith in Sunan nisai something like two groups from my ummah will be saved from the hellfire one which invades hind and the other which takes Jerusalem this is to the beat of my memory so I might not have quoted exact.

Also note that references of these hadith are appearing on "wordpresses" and "blogspots"......a screenshot from actual book of sunan nisai is needed

[Samandri]

Fact remains their army has lost its nerve after Kargil.

They (you) were never supposed to lose from those heights.

And we ripped through you from below while never crossing the LOC.

That (in a soldier's psyche) is a mortally crippling blow. It makes lesser men pause and give in to doubt.

And from doubt comes fear.

Cheers, Doc

The paramilitary force from Gilgat-Baltistan on Kargil heights, actually fought very bravely and recklessly against Indians..........they are different from regular, traditional army of Pakistan.........its just that the Pakistani army left those irregulars to mercy of the Jet bombardment and artillery shelling of Indian army.........they were used like cannon fodder

And Indian soldiers did suffer hundreds of casualties in attempt of climbing Kargil hills , they did not succeed through this approach so had to revise it. India won because regular Pakistan army was not bold enough to face Indian army directly, while the irregulars from Gilgat-Baltistan displayed reckless bravery.

[Kakar-Wardak]

Also note that references of these hadith are appearing on "wordpresses" and "blogspots"......a screenshot from actual book of sunan nisai is needed

Go to sunnah.com and type India in the search box it is one of those hadith.

[Kakar-Wardak]

Also note that references of these hadith are appearing on "wordpresses" and "blogspots"......a screenshot from actual book of sunan nisai is needed

Go to sunnah.com and type India in the search box it is one of those hadith.

[vsdoc]

Go to sunnah.com and type India in the search box it is one of those hadith.

Lol some friendly advice.

Stop obsessing about India and pick on someone your own size.

Being religious is fine. Just don't go loony tunes.

Cheers, Doc