Turkey PM says army group engaged in 'coup attempt'

[Firdousi]

Turkey PM says army group engaged in 'coup attempt'
Jets and helicopters fly overhead in Turkish capital of Ankara, as military closes two major bridges in Istanbul.

Turkish Prime Minister Binali Yildirim has announced that a group of military forces have engaged in a "coup attempt" against the government.

Yildirim made the announcement late on Friday, as he vowed that the "perpetrators" will be contained.

He said that a number of generals are involved in the takeover of the government.

"It seems there is dissent in the military ranks," Al Jazeera's Zeina Khodr, reporting from Gaziantep, said.

Istanbul's Bosphorus Bridge and Fatih Sultan Mehmet Bridge have reportedly been shut down by the Turkish army, local television channels reported, without giving a reason.

Dogan News Agency footage showed cars and buses being diverted, according to Reuters.

Reuters witnesses in Istanbul, Turkey's largest city, also spotted helicopters overhead.

In the capital Ankara, gunshots were heard, as military jets and helicopters were seen flying overhead, a Reuters witness said.

Turkey has had a history of coup attempts, the last time being carried out in 1997, which forced the resignation of then-prime minister Nemettin Erbakan.

[Shamlawar Khurasani]

Sooner or later Erdogan will be deposed and replaced. This is something thick-headed islamist goons won't understand. You can't 'islamize' a country via a system of kufr and shirk (democracy). This is why all Islamist parties eventually fail just like Mursi and Algerian islamists failed before.

Islam teaches us only two ways to bring about social and political change: Dawah & jihad. There is no third way.

When Islamists fail via the ballot box, they resort to terrorism and call it jihad.

[Karachi]

Islamic system has always been a fail, not sure when people will realize this

[Firdousi]

Islamic system has always been a fail, not sure when people will realize this

You are a clown with no contact with ground reality. Your Islamophobia is clouding your mind. Islamic system has been ruling this part of the world for the last 1300 years. Indeed it needs changes but its pretty obvious that Western liberal democracy won't work. Liberal Democracy works on the basis of "individual freedom". Vast majority of the Middle Eastern cultures are highly "collectivists".

You are too biased by your own self-hating mindset. You can't see the reality of your own people and rather you decide to look down on them. Once again, kill yourself, loser. You are disgusting.

[Firdousi]

Sooner or later Erdogan will be deposed and replaced. This is something thick-headed islamist goons won't understand. You can't 'islamize' a country via a system of kufr and shirk (democracy). This is why all Islamist parties eventually fail just like Mursi and Algerian islamists failed before.

Islam teaches us only two ways to bring about social and political change: Dawah & jihad. There is no third way.

When Islamists fail via the ballot box, they resort to terrorism and call it jihad.

You are right to some degree, buddy. But so far Erdogan has done a "good job" by reverting Kemanlism reforms in that country (I am not a huge fan of him btw but I still prefer him over those Kemalist European wannabes). Turkey is now much more Islamic than 20 years ago.

Erdogan represents the Islamic version of Western "Christian democracy".

[Shamlawar Khurasani]

You are right to some degree, buddy. But so far Erdogan has done a "good job" by reverting Kemanlism reforms in that country (I am not a huge fan of him btw but I still prefer him over those Kemalist European wannabes). Turkey is now much more Islamic than 20 years ago.

Erdogan represents the Islamic version of Western "Christian democracy".

Judging Erdogan and his party as a political movement, we can go two ways:

* we can judge them from an islamic perspective where we can look at their moral philosophy, their creed and their conduct and see if it contradicts islam or not.

* Or, we can just look at what they have achieved in the last 15 years in Turkey if we exclude Islam criteria

If we go for the second option, then, we can see how Turkish economy has flourished, Turkish position in international relations has strengthened and Turkish society has turned more open and pluralistic.

If we stick to option one, then we can conclude that Erdogan and his party is un-islamic and what they are doing is kufr and shirk.

But the issue is that most people will probably have difficulty understanding why Erdogan is wrong from an Islamic perspective because they will argue that the observations based on option to are not in contradiction with islam. I would agree. It's true. Striving for prosperity, stability and social progress aren't in contradiction with islam. It would have been perfect if Erdogan could achieve all of that while sticking to basic tenets of Islam.

The truth is, the current world order doesn't allow a non-democratic non-secular state to flourish. You have to play by the rules of the entities in charge. You have to partake in a system which is in stark contrast to islam. You have to lie, deceive, promote and legalize matters which are prohibited in Islam and prohibit aspects of Islam etc etc.


Erdogan has done all of that while maintaining a superficial form of islam as 'state religion' which is meaningless.

I'd rather see an openly secular leader who is honest and doesn't pretend to be acting in accordance with Islam than one who is deceiving people. Both can achieve great things to help people to prosper from a strictly secular perspective. But as a muslim, we are bound to act according to our divine laws.

[DaZahroJaam.]

Looks like the disease is spreading it's self. May they not succeed.

[khushal]

Erdogan has blamed the Gulen movement for the Coup. Ever since their split, the Gulen movement has been trying to dethrone Erdogan by bringing corruption charges against him and his party.

[khushal]

It seems that Erdogan is coming out on top. The coup has failed.

[Firdousi]

Judging Erdogan and his party as a political movement, we can go two ways:

* we can judge them from an islamic perspective where we can look at their moral philosophy, their creed and their conduct and see if it contradicts islam or not.

* Or, we can just look at what they have achieved in the last 15 years in Turkey if we exclude Islam criteria

If we go for the second option, then, we can see how Turkish economy has flourished, Turkish position in international relations has strengthened and Turkish society has turned more open and pluralistic.

If we stick to option one, then we can conclude that Erdogan and his party is un-islamic and what they are doing is kufr and shirk.

But the issue is that most people will probably have difficulty understanding why Erdogan is wrong from an Islamic perspective because they will argue that the observations based on option to are not in contradiction with islam. I would agree. It's true. Striving for prosperity, stability and social progress aren't in contradiction with islam. It would have been perfect if Erdogan could achieve all of that while sticking to basic tenets of Islam.

The truth is, the current world order doesn't allow a non-democratic non-secular state to flourish. You have to play by the rules of the entities in charge. You have to partake in a system which is in stark contrast to islam. You have to lie, deceive, promote and legalize matters which are prohibited in Islam and prohibit aspects of Islam etc etc.


Erdogan has done all of that while maintaining a superficial form of islam as 'state religion' which is meaningless.

I'd rather see an openly secular leader who is honest and doesn't pretend to be acting in accordance with Islam than one who is deceiving people. Both can achieve great things to help people to prosper from a strictly secular perspective. But as a muslim, we are bound to act according to our divine laws.

Brother, once again, you are right, but you are not realistic. Politics its all about lying, deceiving and so on. Democracy did not create this (it has been institutionalized though). The world works like this.

But tell man: do you believe Islam needs reforms? Or how can we bring development, progress and stability to our region? How can be help muslims to leave behind their current state of misery?

[Shamlawar Khurasani]

Brother, once again, you are right, but you are not realistic. Politics its all about lying, deceiving and so on. Democracy did not create this (it has been institutionalized though). The world works like this.

But tell man: do you believe Islam needs reforms? Or how can we bring development, progress and stability to our region? How can be help muslims to leave behind their current state of misery?

Saying islam needs reform suggests that religion is man made and thus can be altered by people to suit their preferences. I strongly disagree with that.


Islam in its essence isn't very complicated. It doesn't need to adapt itself to different times and places like democracy, communism and liberalism.

What is needed is to expand Islamic law to include new circumstances. Short after the revelation of the Quran, expansion of the Islamic law started during the times of Sahaba. Later this expansion took the shame of different schools of law. That's why Muslims had extensive legal systems in place long before Europeans.

However, Muslim world stopped developing itself centuries ago. They stopped producing scholars of religion and law who can conduct research into new territories and derive new rulings in order to guide people.

People have stopped growing intellectually altogether. This was prior to the colonial era. Since then, our societies have become weaker. At first, we were overpowered physically, shortly after, we were overpowered intellectually.

The current religious trends like Deobandism, Salafism, Sufism, jihadism and Islamism are reactions to those events. These modern trends are attempts by Muslims to return to their previous state where religion was guiding the society.

But what these trends fail to understand is that mere ideology can't fix what is broken.

We need education, solid scholarship in both religion and modern sciences. We need a new intellectual elite of Muslims who are well versed in Islam and are able to derive rulings from the Quran & Sunnah for our modern challenges. We need those scholars to be scientists as well. Just like scholars of the Middle Ages.

For as long as we overlook the lack of knowledge, understanding and expertise as a major cause of our weakness, we wont be able to reform our societies.

And to answer your question: No! We don't need to reform Islam. We need to reform societies and people. We need to reform ourselves. We need to adjust ourselves to Islam and apply Islam to our modern life and modern challenges. Therefore we need to know Islam and modernity thoroughly.

most Muslims today study modern sciences but neglect Islam. Other study religion but they detach it from modern challenges. As a result we are now seeing parallel universes of the religious and the secular.

In reality, Islam is not separated from science, society and social and cultural development and progress. It was always applicable to offering times and environments up to the Middle Ages despite huge differences. Why shouldn't it be applicable for our age?

The problem is not Islam. We are the problem. We need reform.

[Firdousi]

Saying islam needs reform suggests that religion is man made and thus can be altered by people to suit their preferences. I strongly disagree with that.


Islam in its essence isn't very complicated. It doesn't need to adapt itself to different times and places like democracy, communism and liberalism.

What is needed is to expand Islamic law to include new circumstances. Short after the revelation of the Quran, expansion of the Islamic law started during the times of Sahaba. Later this expansion took the shame of different schools of law. That's why Muslims had extensive legal systems in place long before Europeans.

However, Muslim world stopped developing itself centuries ago. They stopped producing scholars of religion and law who can conduct research into new territories and derive new rulings in order to guide people.

People have stopped growing intellectually altogether. This was prior to the colonial era. Since then, our societies have become weaker. At first, we were overpowered physically, shortly after, we were overpowered intellectually.

The current religious trends like Deobandism, Salafism, Sufism, jihadism and Islamism are reactions to those events. These modern trends are attempts by Muslims to return to their previous state where religion was guiding the society.

But what these trends fail to understand is that mere ideology can't fix what is broken.

We need education, solid scholarship in both religion and modern sciences. We need a new intellectual elite of Muslims who are well versed in Islam and are able to derive rulings from the Quran & Sunnah for our modern challenges. We need those scholars to be scientists as well. Just like scholars of the Middle Ages.

For as long as we overlook the lack of knowledge, understanding and expertise as a major cause of our weakness, we wont be able to reform our societies.

And to answer your question: No! We don't need to reform Islam. We need to reform societies and people. We need to reform ourselves. We need to adjust ourselves to Islam and apply Islam to our modern life and modern challenges. Therefore we need to know Islam and modernity thoroughly.

most Muslims today study modern sciences but neglect Islam. Other study religion but they detach it from modern challenges. As a result we are now seeing parallel universes of the religious and the secular.

In reality, Islam is not separated from science, society and social and cultural development and progress. It was always applicable to offering times and environments up to the Middle Ages despite huge differences. Why shouldn't it be applicable for our age?

The problem is not Islam. We are the problem. We need reform.

You are right. But let me ask you something: what do you think its going to happen to the Islamic world?

[Shamlawar Khurasani]

You are right. But let me ask you something: what do you think its going to happen to the Islamic world?

I have no idea. However, i do know what I have to do and what other Muslims should do. We need to invest in education and make sure our people are better educated and their knowledge of religion and the sciences are increased.

[Khostai]

Turkey is known for her coups, this is not the first one and also wil not be the last one. Coups in Turkey are almost like tradition....Despite having no war Turkey is quite a politicaly unstable country.

[Firdousi]

I have no idea. However, i do know what I have to do and what other Muslims should do. We need to invest in education and make sure our people are better educated and their knowledge of religion and the sciences are increased.

We the non Western nations got a huge problem: for us "success" means "West". We need to find an alternate way to govern ourselves. Unfortunately brother when you say "we need to educate ourselves", modern science, education and culture are mainly led/hyjacked by the West. So according modern standards in order to get educated you also will get Westernized.