Courtship of Iran and Taliban

[Insight]

Courtship of Iran and Taliban



Hassan Barari
Published — Sunday 12 July 2015
Last update 11 July 2015 11:38 pm








Not a while ago, Foreign Affairs magazine ran an article on the growing ties between Iran and the Taliban. Ahmad Javid, the author of the article, points out to a number of reports that document Iran’s ongoing effort to recruit and train Taliban fighters. Iranian policy in this regard, according to Ahmad Javid is alarming.
Of course, it is not as if this is the first time Iran is meddling in the internal matters of other countries. Earlier on two occasions, the international forces in Afghanistan did seize shipments of Iranian ammunitions and weapons en route to Afghanistan. Ahmad Javid argues that the shipments in 2007 and in 2011 were big enough, therefore the Iranian authorities must have known about them. Commenting on Iran’s policy, former US Army general David Petraeus believed that Iran was not oblivious to the fact that its help to the Taliban would not change much but Iran sought to make the American task in Afghanistan a difficult one.
Iran has been driven by its security concerns. In fact, the objective is primarily to make the Americans bleed rather than to help the Taliban return to power. In the past, Iran opposed the Taliban rule in Afghanistan lest Taliban joined forces with Jundallah, a Sunni militant group that operates inside Iran. In 1998, Iran was about to launch an attack against the Taliban. Moreover, Iran supported the United States’ effort in 2001 to bring down the Taliban regime.
All along, Iran remained opposed to any reconciliation between Taliban and the Afghan government. But Iran changed this policy in 2011 and became supportive of peace talks after the appointment of Burhanuddin Rabbani to chair the Afghan High Peace Council, a new body tasked with facilitating talks with the Taliban, but remained opposed to any direct US talks with the militants.
Iran’s meddling in Afghanistan has been designed to offset the United States. The new security arrangement between the Afghan government and the United States, whereby the United States can maintain military bases close to Iran’s borders, has set alarm bells ringing in Tehran particularly among the hard-liners. Against this backdrop, Iran changed its strategy in Afghanistan.
Seen in this way, Iran is most likely to maintain its support to the Taliban for years to come so as to ensure failure of the United States but not to help them return to power. Additionally, by assisting the Taliban, Iran seeks to have influence over this group in case the Afghan government and the Taliban reconcile in the years to come. In his article, Ahmad Javid makes the case that Iran’s sophisticated strategy of embracing certain Taliban groups has made Iran effectively “both a peacemaker and a spoiler.”
There is another component of Iran’s strategy in the region as a whole. Over the last two years, Iran has also been alarmed by the emergence and rise of the so-called Islamic State or Daesh. The latter has made spectacular gains in various parts of the region. For Taliban, Daesh has been recruiting some of Taliban’s supporters. In other words, Daesh is eyeing both Taliban supporters and its funds. Therefore, Iran seeks to exploit the competition between the two Sunni militant groups. In fact, Iran’s relationship with the Taliban is also designed to counter influence of Sunni groups in the region. It is known that many of Taliban figures prefer Daesh to the Taliban who, according to them, is serving Pakistan rather than Islam. Some Taliban fighters made it perfectly clear that they found Daesh as a better vehicle for them to realize their Islamic ideals.
Iran is expected to continue its current policy in Afghanistan as the best strategy to deal with the multiple security concerns. The ruling elite in Iran and its supporters thinks that Iran has some legitimate stakes in Afghanistan. Hence, Iran is right to embrace the Taliban as a part of a wider regional strategy. To be sure, Iran does not trust the Taliban. In fact, Tehran may change course in the future to suit its interests.

http://www.arabnews.com/columns/news/775176

[marwat]

the irony is they paved the way for american to invade Afghanistan, and now when american is leaving, and kabul regime is week they are now paving the way for Persian and punjabi to safeguard their interest in kabul and to help them dominate a major chunk of Afghan foreign policy.
the irony is that illiterate donkey fool warlord think he is liberating Afghanistan like shah shuja once was liberating Afghanistan with the help of ranjeet and bacha saqa with the help of english.
there was once a chance of fully Afghan led and Afghan owned peace process but then that time the donkey mullah was saying he is not going to talk to puppet regime, and our friend like khushal and barakzai dramabaz vouched for it.
but now foreign forces are leaving and Afghanistan is at the weakest point now they are talking and suddenly a puppet regime become a halali regime. their delegation is backed by Foreign Secretary Aizaz Ahmad Chaudhry and officials of Pakistani foreign ministry and military intelligence ISI who are clearly there just to direct the talks as preferred by Islamabad.
wat a moron enemy we got

[Insight]

the irony is they paved the way for american to invade Afghanistan, and now when american is leaving, and kabul regime is week they are now paving the way for Persian and punjabi to safeguard their interest in kabul and to help them dominate a major chunk of Afghan foreign policy.
the irony is that illiterate donkey fool warlord think he is liberating Afghanistan like shah shuja once was liberating Afghanistan with the help of ranjeet and bacha saqa with the help of english.
there was once a chance of fully Afghan led and Afghan owned peace process but then that time the donkey mullah was saying he is not going to talk to puppet regime, and our friend like khushal and barakzai dramabaz vouched for it.
but now foreign forces are leaving and Afghanistan is at the weakest point now they are talking and suddenly a puppet regime become a halali regime. their delegation is backed by Foreign Secretary Aizaz Ahmad Chaudhry and officials of Pakistani foreign ministry and military intelligence ISI who are clearly there just to direct the talks as preferred by Islamabad.
wat a moron enemy we got

The NATO supply routes came from Rawalpindi and Islamabad, not from New Delhi, Beijing, Tehran, or even Tel Aviv.

Lets stick to hard facts. Most nations in the world attended Bonn conference which is not equivalent to giving NATO supply routes as Pakistan Army did.

[marwat]

The NATO supply routes came from Rawalpindi and Islamabad, not from New Delhi, Beijing, Tehran, or even Tel Aviv.

Lets stick to hard facts. Most nations in the world attended Bonn conference which is not equivalent to giving NATO supply routes as Pakistan Army did.

let's stick too it, the nato supply routes are not meant for puppet regime, pakistan was never that much graceful, who will help us to fight our internal enemy. it is meant for the one who invaded Kabul and overthrown Taliban.
for the puppet regime they sent haqqani and talib with ak47.
the irony is taliban are fighting against america and their allies while sitting in the lap of their supposed front line enemy who are the front line Allie of America.
no one ever is humiliated in a history as much Pakistan did humiliate taliban and handed to US container full of them. even diplomats were not spared.
you may don't understand very well, but to many Talib they don't like saying they are defending Afghanistan,they say they are defending and fighting to defend islam, to their belief watan and country is related to nationalism which is kufar.

[Badlun]

There are so many ironies and so many paradoxes. Islamic State is doing exactly what Saudi is doing , implementing the same Sharia of flogging , beheading but both are enemies. Iran and Saudi are enemies but they both are the enemies of Islamic State.

Israel is the enemy of Arabs but not of Islamic state and vice versa. Iran is against Salafism but becoming friend of Taliban. Saudis are the mentors of Taliban but now distancing itself. USA is the promoter of democracy but the friend of the dictatorship of Saudis. Pakistan is destroying Taliban on its own land but encouraging them for Afghanistan.

I don't know who can solve these conundrums.

[Insight]

[QUOTE]

let's stick too it, the nato supply routes are not meant for puppet regime, pakistan was never that much graceful

Buddy, NATO supplies AND use of Pakistani airspace that supported a US military intervention/war in Afghanistan resulted in the following..........[you can address each one.]

1) UN and US sanctions being lifted due to Pakistan's nuclear test. Don't you dare downplay this. Iran has been in on and off talks for a decade to get these same sanctions lifted. These sanctions have crushed the Iranian economy. I am objective enough to judge a nation on whether or not it has pride. Iran is no PROSTITUTE like Pakistan. It's pride has resulted in the entire Western community bowing down to it out of fear of a military conflict. Thats a plain fact.

2) Billions of US dollars paid to Pakistan for the NATO supply routes/airspace use/permitted drone strikes. As you know, this is called Coalition Support Funds (CSF)

One way Pakistan met its budget

3) Billions of dollars in relaxed IMF loans opened up as a result of Pakistan support for the NATO supply routes

The rest of the way Pakistan met its budget.

4) Increased trade with the US and Europe.

Anyways, this probably will trickle down after the US exit. In fact, it already is as we speak. See, Pakistan will not be the one to have voluntarily closed the NATO supplies, its because Obama decided for a full US withdrawal.

, who will helpusto fight our internal enemy. it is meant for the one who invaded Kabul and overthrown Taliban.

I was under impression you were an ANP or Afghan nationalist? By "us" you mean Pakistan right? You previously have been speaking about how Pakistan has been interfering in Afghanistan by supporting Taliban. Interesting, was that an intellectual exercise to indirectly say something by saying something else?

for the puppet regime they sent haqqani and talib with ak47.

You overestimate Pakistan support for the Taliban insurgency. If Pakistan controlled the Taliban insurgency, then care to explain to me how Taliban insurgency was able to develop contacts with Iran? Or do you believe that Pakistan allowed it? because that would be absurd.

the irony is taliban are fighting against america and their allies while sitting in the lap of their supposed front line enemy who are the front line Allie of America.

What is ironic is that both US/NATO and Taliban insurgency probably realize that Pakistan is a prostitute that can be used and abused for its own purposes. Pakistan as the prostitute got paid billions for the NATO supply routes.

no one ever is humiliated in a history as much Pakistan did humiliate taliban and handed to US container full of them. even diplomats were not spared.

True, Pakistan is the only nation in the history of the world that has arrested Ambassadors and diplomats for financial gain! Greeks and Persians never arrested diplomats even when they were engaged in war.

[marwat]

[QUOTE=Insight;767928][QUOTE] Buddy, NATO supplies AND use of Pakistani airspace that supported a US military intervention/war in Afghanistan resulted in the following..........[you can address each one.] [\QUOTE]

Buddy you got me whole wrong.
'puppet regime' that was a satire.

I was under impression you were an ANP or Afghan nationalist? By "us" you mean Pakistan right?...

by us i mean Afghan.

You overestimate Pakistan support for the Taliban insurgency. If Pakistan controlled the Taliban insurgency, then care to explain to me how Taliban insurgency was able to develop contacts with Iran? Or do you believe that Pakistan allowed it? because that would be absurd.

nothing is overestimated, taliban and pakistan relations are simply complex that of persistent mutualisms.
israeli use a term called "facts on the ground". it's a fact Taliban can't put up a fight without pakistan help, in a return pakistan get what they want from the puppet regime.
As far Pakistan controlling the taliban insurgency, yes they do irrespective of Talib intentions. either Moulawi want it or not. you are underestimating Paksitan.
i will give you some example.
1. when karzai was trying to hold peace talks directly with Taliban leadership back then bypassing pakistan. how on earth Pakistan intentionally feed CIA information and arrested Mullah Ghani barader co founder of taliban from Karachi probably from ISI safe house to spoil peace talks.
The Afghan government was reportedly holding secret talks with the Baradar and his capture was a significant shift in Pakistan's position. that gave Pakistan seat at the peace table.

2. taliban were reluctant to talk to puppet regime kabul, they were saying they will talk to kabul once foreign forces leave that was a pre condition.
it is understandable,otherwise their cause is self defeating. amazingly it changed once pakistan agreed to talk. talks already did happened, not with american but with puppet regime even mullah Omar vouched for it and the de facto leader Mansoor gave a green signal.
these peace talks fractured Taliban, Qatar based leadership and their online press release indirectly disown talks and warned pakistan. later online press was removed. now we know taliban don't want to submit to pakistan but facts on the ground want them to submit. pakistan is boss here.

3.i believe it was ISI who killed Rabani simply to kill the idea of peace talk with Taliban.

4. Senior Taliban leadership and their families are living in ISI safe houses and are under house arrest. pakistan can any time blackmail them and can milk them.

5.pakistan finance them and arm them. any objection?

6. wounded soldiers are treated inside pakistani hospitals and hospitals authorities are directed to do so. there are special hospitals run by Jummat ud dawa a pakistani based jihadi organization who only treat Taliban soldiers. similarly Taliban runs their own medical facilities inside quetta under the nose of ISI. any problem ?

7. in 2014 only some 5 member of Taliban leadership mysteriously died inside pakistan. maybe NDS work, but maybe ISI stick and carrot policy which is notorious for killing and dumping those who don't want to agree with them.

8. Mullah omar tried his best to persuade TTP leader Baitullah Mehsud to gave up on Pakistan and not to engage pakistan army and fight Kabul. he sent 11 member delegation led by Mullah Abdullah a former Guantanamo detainee on the request of his pakistani master.

9.pakistani madrassah provide them foot soldiers and pakistan turned a blind eye to them.

What is ironic is that both US/NATO and Taliban insurgency probably realize that Pakistan is a prostitute that can be used and abused for its own purposes. Pakistan as the prostitute got paid billions for the NATO supply routes.

probably realized?, as far US/NATO is concerned they knew it from the start but for them pakistan is much important than Afghanistan. then simply can't bear an unhappy Allie which can be of great use in future too. also an unstable nuclear state is not in the interest of West.
but Taliban deliberately turned blind eye to the fact that their regime ended and Afghanistan was invaded because of Pakistan support to US. this is a fact no one can swallow that much easily as taliban did.

then care to explain to me how Taliban insurgency was able to develop contacts with Iran? Or do you believe that Pakistan allowed it? because that would be absurd.

do you believe Taliban is a single entity? why Qatar based political leadership indirectly disown peace talks then? controlling insurgency means you have the capability to direct it the way you want by using your leverages even if that mean you had to bomb them, kill them or simply giving a threat of ending their sanctuaries. taliban are not puppet or agents of pakistan who will do whatever they are told. Taliban is a very loose movement and pakistan do not hold any leverage on those outside pakistan.

i can't say pakistan is happy with taliban contact with iran or not. my guess is it gave Taliban movement legitimacy and favorable in a long run for both taliban and pakistan. however pakistan will not like increased cooperation between them.

now how are you going to explain Pakistan threat to Taliban of ending their sanctuaries and handling their whole leadership with their families in a container to kabul like they did in past. ending their financial and logistic support, banning all the madrassah who provide them foot soldiers. banning medical facilities? do you think Mullah Omar will consider this a joke. do you think it's a fantasy?

[Insight]

[QUOTE=marwat;767934][QUOTE=Insight;767928]

Buddy, NATO supplies AND use of Pakistani airspace that supported a US military intervention/war in Afghanistan resulted in the following..........[you can address each one.] [\QUOTE]

Buddy you got me whole wrong.
'puppet regime' that was a satire.


by us i mean Afghan.



nothing is overestimated, taliban and pakistan relations are simply complex that of persistent mutualisms.
israeli use a term called "facts on the ground". it's a fact Taliban can't put up a fight without pakistan help, in a return pakistan get what they want from the puppet regime.
As far Pakistan controlling the taliban insurgency, yes they do irrespective of Talib intentions. either Moulawi want it or not. you are underestimating Paksitan.
i will give you some example.
1. when karzai was trying to hold peace talks directly with Taliban leadership back then bypassing pakistan. how on earth Pakistan intentionally feed CIA information and arrested Mullah Ghani barader co founder of taliban from Karachi probably from ISI safe house to spoil peace talks.
The Afghan government was reportedly holding secret talks with the Baradar and his capture was a significant shift in Pakistan's position. that gave Pakistan seat at the peace table.

2. taliban were reluctant to talk to puppet regime kabul, they were saying they will talk to kabul once foreign forces leave that was a pre condition.
it is understandable,otherwise their cause is self defeating. amazingly it changed once pakistan agreed to talk. talks already did happened, not with american but with puppet regime even mullah Omar vouched for it and the de facto leader Mansoor gave a green signal.
these peace talks fractured Taliban, Qatar based leadership and their online press release indirectly disown talks and warned pakistan. later online press was removed. now we know taliban don't want to submit to pakistan but facts on the ground want them to submit. pakistan is boss here.

3.i believe it was ISI who killed Rabani simply to kill the idea of peace talk with Taliban.

4. Senior Taliban leadership and their families are living in ISI safe houses and are under house arrest. pakistan can any time blackmail them and can milk them.

5.pakistan finance them and arm them. any objection?

6. wounded soldiers are treated inside pakistani hospitals and hospitals authorities are directed to do so. there are special hospitals run by Jummat ud dawa a pakistani based jihadi organization who only treat Taliban soldiers. similarly Taliban runs their own medical facilities inside quetta under the nose of ISI. any problem ?

7. in 2014 only some 5 member of Taliban leadership mysteriously died inside pakistan. maybe NDS work, but maybe ISI stick and carrot policy which is notorious for killing and dumping those who don't want to agree with them.

8. Mullah omar tried his best to persuade TTP leader Baitullah Mehsud to gave up on Pakistan and not to engage pakistan army and fight Kabul. he sent 11 member delegation led by Mullah Abdullah a former Guantanamo detainee on the request of his pakistani master.

9.pakistani madrassah provide them foot soldiers and pakistan turned a blind eye to them.




probably realized?, as far US/NATO is concerned they knew it from the start but for them pakistan is much important than Afghanistan. then simply can't bear an unhappy Allie which can be of great use in future too. also an unstable nuclear state is not in the interest of West.
but Taliban deliberately turned blind eye to the fact that their regime ended and Afghanistan was invaded because of Pakistan support to US. this is a fact no one can swallow that much easily as taliban did.


do you believe Taliban is a single entity? why Qatar based political leadership indirectly disown peace talks then? controlling insurgency means you have the capability to direct it the way you want by using your leverages even if that mean you had to bomb them, kill them or simply giving a threat of ending their sanctuaries. taliban are not puppet or agents of pakistan who will do whatever they are told. Taliban is a very loose movement and pakistan do not hold any leverage on those outside pakistan.

i can't say pakistan is happy with taliban contact with iran or not. my guess is it gave Taliban movement legitimacy and favorable in a long run for both taliban and pakistan. however pakistan will not like increased cooperation between them.

now how are you going to explain Pakistan threat to Taliban of ending their sanctuaries and handling their whole leadership with their families in a container to kabul like they did in past. ending their financial and logistic support, banning all the madrassah who provide them foot soldiers. banning medical facilities? do you think Mullah Omar will consider this a joke. do you think it's a fantasy?

Yes, man Pakistan is the center of the world.

US thinks about Pakistan day in and day out. Raheel Sharif and Nawaz came to Washington begging US to stay in Afghanistan and keep CSF going, they got neither promise. I agree with you, Pakistan is still very important to the US though.

On a serious note. That makes real sense, Pakistan wants its Taliban proxy to have ties with Iran so much so that its proxy no longer has to depend on it. Listen to yourself!! You try to flavor every piece of fact to Pakistan's advantage where there is none! In nearly every sentence you write despite pretending to be anti-Pakistani, you exaggerate Pakistan's importance, but you responded to the NATO supply issue by saying it doesn't really mean much for Pakistan. Well then explain likes I kindly requested.

Please address the great benefits of the NATO supply routes for Pakistan. Thank you in advance for your responses. i have bolded it in case your eyes darted over it and missed it

1) UN and US sanctions being lifted due to Pakistan's nuclear test. Don't you dare downplay this. Iran has been in on and off talks for a decade to get these same sanctions lifted. These sanctions have crushed the Iranian economy. I am objective enough to judge a nation on whether or not it has pride. Iran is no PROSTITUTE like Pakistan. It's pride has resulted in the entire Western community bowing down to it out of fear of a military conflict. Thats a plain fact.

2) Billions of US dollars paid to Pakistan for the NATO supply routes/airspace use/permitted drone strikes. As you know, this is called Coalition Support Funds (CSF)

One way Pakistan met its budget

3) Billions of dollars in relaxed IMF loans opened up as a result of Pakistan support for the NATO supply routes

The rest of the way Pakistan met its budget.

4) Increased trade with the US and Europe.

Anyways, this probably will trickle down after the US exit. In fact, it already is as we speak. See, Pakistan will not be the one to have voluntarily closed the NATO supplies, its because Obama decided for a full US withdrawal.