Taliban Capture Yamgan

[Khostai]

i was out of the city for a week,i visited this forum regularly and i saw Barakzai posting and rejoicing Taliban. i thought i will ask him the same question.

He is a taliban propagandist, you just have to read some of his posts. He claims that Kandahar was better off during taliban time lol. Can you belive it, Kandahar now has better facility and even built up small industry, yes it has some problems with power, but which region in south Asia don't? But still he claims that taliban era was better by quating some guy who probably was a chiled during taliban time -_-.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

people call your views unrealistic and impractical because you want to seek all this fortune in taliban..

Nah, that once again is an Awami propaganda narrative, simply because Awamites feign peace but are lethal in their own right since they usually get white men to do their fighting for them.

historically Mullah and military alliance, the notorious spy Lawrence of Arabia conspiring against Amanullah and religiously inspired jihadist backed by British to topple Amanullah government is eye opening.

Once again, classic Awami party propaganda points easily answered by the fact that an equal and opposite number of instances of appeal to religion (e.g. Amanullah's and Abdullah Achazkzai's Ghazi brigade, Taurangzai, Mir wais's fatwa, Ahmad Shah Abdali's communications with Shah Waliullah provide alternative fodder.

The reality is Amanullah tried to emulate Ataturk and impose values in a stupid and aggressive fashion. Putting petty coats and top hats on Shinwari tribesman and then trying to break the veil in Kandahar were dumb moves bound to instigate a response. Afghans are not Turks and were never going to permit such retardedness to be imposed on them by force.

x

[khushal]

The reality is Amanullah tried to emulate Ataturk and impose values in a stupid and aggressive fashion. Putting petty coats and top hats on Shinwari tribesman and then trying to break the veil in Kandahar were dumb moves bound to instigate a response. Afghans are not Turks and were never going to permit such retardedness to be imposed on them by force.

At least they learned their lesson, the American citizen president of Afghanistan with a christian wife is having his wife wear a shawl. there is "FAKE" written all over that.

[khushal]

You have no touch with reality. You live in bubble. Feel sorry for yourself brother.

Your a city boy, you have no idea what is going on in the rural areas, the place where you fear to venture. Your just mad that you couldn't create another pakistan, you have to give plenty of arse to do that which is what the pakistanis are good at. Unlike yourself, your people are not good at that.

[marwat]

Ahmad Shah Abdali's communications with Shah Waliullah

[MENTION=1772]BarakzaiAbdali[/MENTION] did you actually believe that this happened ? i think it is fantasy made up by paki since they give religious colour to everything. any credible reference? or where is the letter?

[BarakzaiAbdali]

@BarakzaiAbdali did you actually believe that this happened ? i think it is fantasy made up by paki since they give religious colour to everything. any credible reference? or where is the letter?

Yes, despite the best effort of the ANP drunkards, who quiet frankly are either too high on chars or bang or too drunk on whiskey to formulate a meaningful argument devoid of intrigues or conspiracy theories.... there is historical evidence:

Syed Athar Abbas Rizvi quotes the letter Shah Waliullah and His Times written in the 1980s. pages 308-309. Waliullah writes to Abdali: "Were the Islamic Ghazis to take up arms and annihalate two or three of the Mahratta groups in battle.... "

Additionally, there were multiple letters. Encyclopedia.com goes on to note:
"Shah Waliullah's letter to Ahmad Shah Abdali is now regarded as one of the most important historical documents related to the eighteenth century, as Shah Waliullah perceptively described the grave political circumstances in India as well as the numerous dangers the Muslim society faced from all sides."

https://books.google.com/books?id=-2...page&q&f=false

Professor Gommans also discusses the relationship and invitations in his seminal work on Ahmad Shah Abdali and the Durrani Empire.

[marwat]

Yes, despite the best effort of the ANP drunkards, who quiet frankly are either too high on chars or bang or too drunk on whiskey to formulate a meaningful argument devoid of intrigues or conspiracy theories.... there is historical evidence:

Syed Athar Abbas Rizvi quotes the letter Shah Waliullah and His Times written in the 1980s. pages 308-309. Waliullah writes to Abdali: "Were the Islamic Ghazis to take up arms and annihalate two or three of the Mahratta groups in battle.... "

Additionally, there were multiple letters. Encyclopedia.com goes on to note:
"Shah Waliullah's letter to Ahmad Shah Abdali is now regarded as one of the most important historical documents related to the eighteenth century, as Shah Waliullah perceptively described the grave political circumstances in India as well as the numerous dangers the Muslim society faced from all sides."

https://books.google.com/books?id=-2...page&q&f=false

Professor Gommans also discusses the relationship and invitations in his seminal work on Ahmad Shah Abdali and the Durrani Empire.

hahaha it can't be accepted as a credible source if it is written in 20th century after 280 years of Abdali era. do you know what is a credible and authentic source? give me some source from ahmad shah abdali era otherwise you failed.
the book you mentioned have sourced a document written in 1951. and they have clearly mentioned that some scholar doubt the authenticity of these letters.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

hahaha it can't be accepted as a credible source if it is written in 20th century after 280 years of Abdali era. do you know what is a credible and authentic source? give me some source from ahmad shah abdali era otherwise you failed.

LOOOOL. Thats about the dumbest request you've made. By such standard I could ask you for an exact reference for a 632 CE copy of the Quran. Otherwise I could allege that every copy of the Quran in the world cannot go back to the Prophet since we have no complete copy in existence till 20 years post humous.

Additionally the famous Ahmad Shah poem "Da Delhi Takhtha herawma che rayaadhkram zamaa the Shkolaay Pashtunkhwa da Ghaar saroona" also has no manuscript in existence nor does any manuscript exist from that era of any of Ahmad Shah Abdali's poems. That single poem is what half of the ANP wala drunkards rely on to justify "Pashtunkhwa."

SO by that standard did Ahmad Shah not write his poetry?

the book you mentioned have sourced a document written in 1951.

For a supposedly literate person... you have a long long way to go in understanding the basics of referencing. The 1951 reference given is to KA Nizami's actual translations of the letters.

Anne Marie Schimmel writes Islamic Literature of India: on page 48

"The Theologian who expressed the views of his contemporaries most clearly in his Arabic and Persian writings was Shah Waliullah of delhi"

In her footnote she refers to the the series of existing manuscript letters and goes on to refer to Nizami's translation done in 1951.

Pray tell, what sort of conspiracy shall the ANP wala brain hatch regarding a 1951 translation? Did Mullah Omar build a time machine to the year and invent Mr. Nizami?

For that matter, Munshi's Tarikh personally commissioned by Ahmad Shah Baba, per Gommans on page 56 writes of Ahmad Shah "Rushed to Hindustan to destroy all the rebels and unbelievers"

and Oh please, give me a break, you are going to rely on JMS Baljon's single criticism of the authenticity to dismiss the preceding 200 hundred years worth of acceptance? The same man who gets criticized subsequently by Charles Kurzman in Liberal Islam for variating in his translation of Shah Waliullah's letters?

Specifically, Baljon writes the following to justify his "criticism"

Such critical situations for the Mughal rulers induced Shâh Walî Allâh to claim: ‘The Hindus may one day obtain full power over the whole of India’ (Tafh. I, 203). We should realise however that observations of this kind are exceptional. Shâh Walî Allâh only rarely hints at the polity of the moment in his works. The small interest in political affairs apparent in his books is an additional argument in support of Muhammad Ikrâm’s doubts concerning the authenticity of the entire collection of political letters assigned to the Delhi divine and edited by K.A. Nizami under the title Shâh Walî Allâh ke siyâsî maktûbât (Aligarh 1950) (Muhammad Ikrâm, Rûd-i kaw thar, Lahore 1970, 548).

http://www.katinkahesselink.net/sufi...-dihwahli.html

Meaning your argument against the authenticity of the letters rests on a guy that says "because they were political, they are not authentic." LOOOOL. Laughable argument that requires validation my dear friend.

You seem to be alleging that Nizami "forged" these letters? Am I correct? You should be careful casting aspersions. Al Ghazali writes in detail on the subject as to WHERE THE MANUSCRIPTS used by Nizami come from.:

Shah Wall Allah also followed this tradition and frequently wrote let-ters to his students, friends and the notables of his time. Out of a large number of these letters some two hundred and eighty 7 two have been pre-served in the two volumes of collection prepared by Shah Muhammad 'Ashiq, a cousin, brother-in-law and close friend of Shah Wall Allah. This collection was further enlarged and edited by the former's son, Shah 'Abd al-Rahman, who was also a student of Shah Wall Allah. The latter brought the number of these letters to three hundred and fifty-two. 404 A useful selection of political letters had been culled out from them by late Professor Khaliq Ahmad Nizami, which he had first published in 1951 in Aligarh, India. He later brought out another enlarged and edited version of his collection, containing some forty letters, with an introduction and Urdu translation of the letters in 1969.

https://archive.org/stream/TheSocio-...azali_djvu.txt

He doesn't even waste his time with the argument that "because the letters are political letters they must therefore be forgeries or not original."

What an asinine argument, its alleging that a complex figure like Waliullah cannot somehow have both religious and political ideas at the same time.

and they have clearly mentioned that some scholar doubt the authenticity of these letters.

LOOOOL. Stick to distilling liquors ANP comrade. We have above Schimmel who references manuscripts and we have that Ghazali describing EXACTLY where the manuscripts come from and they trace to Waliullah's family who preserved his letters.

And pray tell, why would a letter be forged to Abdali that, according its direct description by Al Ghazali says:

This attitude of Shah Wall Allah appears most pronounced in his letter to Ahmad Shah Abdall (d. 1772), the founder of modern Afghanistan. Apprising him of the deplorable decay found in India, Shah Wall Allah appealed to this formidable military commander and ruler of the neighbouring Muslim country to bring his armies into India in order to suppress the forces of anarchy and disorder represented by the Jats and Marathas, the two organised and militant communities among Hindus

?????

Its complete lunacy to somehow create another Awami Sharabi wala conspiracy theory that makes no sense LOOL. How does this work? So did Professor Nizami forge the letters? And for what purpose? The Jats and Marathas were a non issue for him in the 1950s... and additionally, would he have forged the original manuscript evidence?

Epic fail on your part my friend. So we have established DIRECT manuscript evidence as you requested in the discussion above with:

"Out of a large number of these letters some two hundred and eighty 7 two have been pre-served in the two volumes of collection prepared by Shah Muhammad 'Ashiq, a cousin, brother-in-law and close friend of Shah Wall Allah.

This collection was further enlarged and edited by the former's son, Shah 'Abd al-Rahman, who was also a student of Shah Wall Allah. The latter brought the number of these letters to three hundred and fifty-two."

And we have shown the the sole criticism, when Gommans does not himself endorse by the your "critics" is that because the letters are "political" they may not be real from an author who had mistranslated Waliullahs letter in his own work.

Trust me friend, stick to being a grape fermenter, your attempt to argue this point sorely back fired because you are making an attempt to somehow turn Abdali into a drunkard ANP-ite despite his notable history and preserved "of the era" letters with the Turks to the contrary.