Talking to the Taliban?

[muhsina]

Sangar Mulaee sb

Da LZ khabaray banday lag pa sarra seena ghowr okra. Khday de okee che Taliban da Pakistan proxy jangialaan na wee kho da khabara ta sirp pa khula waelay shay sabitolay ye nashay.Tola narray ba bia lewanee zalmee ta rogh aw tata rogh lewanay waee.

[PakistaniWazir]

PakistaniWazir, with all due respect, these are the things I hear from MQM supporters.

i know very much the trouble afghanis cause in karachi they have been placed there by afghan agents to cause division in pakistan

i know the sneeky killings of fellow pakistanis so it will blaime on pashtuns and then afghanis go to other places inciting trouble and then innocent pashtuns get harmed

MQM and patrotic pakistani pashtuns should focus more on these terrorists then you will see peace poyshway!

[BLS_1919v2.0]

i know very much the trouble afghanis cause in karachi they have been placed there by afghan agents to cause division in pakistan

i know the sneeky killings of fellow pakistanis so it will blaime on pashtuns and then afghanis go to other places inciting trouble and then innocent pashtuns get harmed

MQM and patrotic pakistani pashtuns should focus more on these terrorists then you will see peace poyshway!

I would suggest therapy as soon as possible. And I would request other members here to donate, because MQM kills your pakistani pashtuns more than Afghanistan Pashtuns. Rest assured they will skin your pakistaniyath so quickly that you will be begging karzai lala for a home lolz. Don't think you can fool people.

[Dehqan]

As matter of fact those who oppose the occupation of Afghanistan are labeled "taliban". one Western TV channel has rightly said "they are farmer in a day at night they are taliban". meaning every layer of society is against the foreign occupation
to My understanding Pakistan does not want the US and NATO should leave Afghanistan because their presence in Afghanistan is benefiting Pakistan.
the US Like divided Afghan society as it is easy for them to occupy them.
So all sort of sincere dialog will be failed by other players.

[Dehqan]

i know very much the trouble afghanis cause in karachi they have been placed there by afghan agents to cause division in pakistan

i know the sneeky killings of fellow pakistanis so it will blaime on pashtuns and then afghanis go to other places inciting trouble and then innocent pashtuns get harmed

mqm and patrotic pakistani pashtuns should focus more on these terrorists then you will see peace poyshway!

mqm is the worst enemy of pushtoon in karachi.

[Saifullah]

Pakistan is scared that when americans leave because they adopted a pro-US stance...then the new govt in Afghanistan is gonna be an enemy towards them....

[eusuphxai]

‘Talking to the Taliban’ is a prevalent argument both in Afghanistan and Pakistan these days. In Pakistan, people like Sirajul Haq (Jumat-e-Islami), Imran Khan (PTI), Fazl-e-Rahman (JUI) and Hameed Gul etc. are stressing that when the Afghan Government and the US can talk to the Taliban in Afghanistan why can’t we talk to the Taliban in Pakistan? Imran Khan would even offer himself as a mediator between the Pakistani Government and the Taliban. This raises some important questions:

1. Why the above 'leaders' and parties always have a soft corner for the Taliban? And, what are their intentions behind supporting a talk with the Taliban?
2. Should the Afghan Govt. talk with the Taliban?
3. Should Pakistan talk with the Taliban too?

Firstly no actually tried to answer the questions , but as usual turned it into a normal ranting thread.

1. In my opinion (as I am not representing those people or their ideology), Taliban is not a normal enemy, they are not a regular army they disappear and regroup and attack, which makes them very difficult opponent. Also we have seen that the cost of completely eradicating taliban (if they can be removed completely ) is very high.Thirdly obviously at some level(no matter how little) they have public support. My point is all this conclude to that its not easy to defeat taliban if not impossible.

Now coming to the three parties, taliban, pak govt, and afghan govt. all very complicated, and more or less confused about their goals.

Some people conciser taliban as pakistan brain child, at same time there are people who think they are the true representatives of Islam( the afghan taliban atleast for that matter).

afghan and pakistan govt, in my opinion are puppets and the question at this stage will be. will taliban talk with them ?as apparently if they are not winning they are not losing either.

As for your question if ignore these complications and I for once think that pak and afghan govt. are genuine then firstly we have to ask what will be the agenda of talks, of course taliban will want share in power.

Personally talking to them is not a bad idea it will be interesting to see what they are saying/demanding.Talking to them for sake of peace is not bad, but accepting them as "badmashan" is not.

[Nokia_Apridy]

Nokia

Te yaw kar oka

Ta Afghanistan pregda aw Pakistan kay da Pukhtunistan Tehreek da para manday tarrray owaha. Da Pukhtano kumay seemay che da Pakistan da dawlat da landay dee haghay la barray aw azaday ogata no laka da Ajab Khan apridi pa shantay marranay ba shay. da kalam topak hum istimal kra tash pa topakko banday azadi na mundalay kegee.

Nora khwakha sta da.

sama da.........khu Mushina ka ta bya rasra da 1930 haga tura shpa

ka cha kam rasra karey wu haga bya okay ?......

da dei Zamin rata odrwa..

mannnnnnnna

[Michin Khel]

We cant kill talibans, they will re-emerge again, talibanization is an ideology. It is a monster which has the power to spoil the whole pashtun society.

We have to understand these people and the system through which they are created. Apparently they are produced from madrassas. So to eradicate it people have to bulldozer the madrassas and throw out mullahs out of their society.......an impossible job though.

[Nokia_Apridy]

Luffy KHTAK BABA wail chay

da zaro kalo Nakhtay (fight) na da Away Wrazay Jarga ghwara da...

.............khair da lag ba pam waku warta

Da JORAY khbra da cha oshey

[Yousafzai Pakhtun]

Nokia jana rogha kho ba warsara uko sta dapara kho ka saba ye taata bya "koorhey" darkrey no bya?????? laka swat k chey ye hagha jenay ta warkarey wey......who will guaranteeee that they will leave in peace.....

[Nokia_Apridy]

da ma Dwazi lala Ta Awal post wakru chay ZAMIN ba rata sok odrawi

CHA DA DI KHBRA NA BA SABA NA WAWRAY LAKA

TALIBAN PAKISTAN DA ROSS (RUSSIA) KUNG NA PASS OCHAT KRAL

AO DR NAJIB RUSSIA GHOBAL YA JOR KRU

[Dawezai]

eusuphxai, thanks for your input.

Answers to those questions would need considering the following:

1. Has the Afghan Govt. ever used or is accused of having used the Taliban against another state to achieve some political ends?

2. Can Pakistan be trusted to sincerely root out religious extremism? Keeping in view that Pakistan created and has been supporting the Taliban – from ideology to manpower to finance to weapons – to achieve strategic depth in Afghanistan. Most of the religious seminaries have been used to provide manpower support to the Taliban in Afghanistan. Accordingly, Maulana Sami-Ul-Haq alone persuaded and directed the Taliban of thirteen (13) madrassas in Pakistan to Afghanistan and 10,500 plus religious students were sent to Afghanistan to help the Taliban. About 90% of the Taliban leadership, including Mullah Umar and Mullah Abdul Mutawakel, has been created by the religious madrassa, Darul Uloom Haqqani, of Maulana Sami-Ul-Haq. However, the concrete, ideological and political support for the Taliban, both in Afghanistan and Pakistan, has so many tributaries in Pakistan some of which are JUI, JI, PTI, Lashkar-e-Omar, Lashkar-e-Taiba, Sipah-e-Sahaba, Harkat-ul-Jihad-al-Islami (HuJI), Lashkar-e-Jhangvi (LeJ) and Jaish-e-Mohammed (JeM) and the Tablighee Jumat. Support for the Taliban from Pakistani state institutions, i.e., the ISI and the Army, is also no more a secret. In fact, all the above and many more non-state actors in Pakistan are directed and used by Pakistan’s ISI to achieve strategic depth in Afghanistan.

3. Guided by its strategic depth theory, Pakistan has a threefold agenda for Afghanistan:

a) Afghanistan be the fifth province of Pakistan; Or,
b) If the first is not possible then the government in Kabul be subservient to Islamabad; Or,
c) If the first two options are not possible then there be no peace and stability in Afghanistan at all.

Support for the Taliban and talibanisation, on the part of Pakistan, has another facet as well. With the international community’s growing concern for Pakistan's nuclear arsenals, her support of religious fundamentalism and her role in destabilizing Afghanistan (and the whole region), Pakistan must be pondering over and acting on some bigger plans as well. One such plan can be radicalising the Pashtuns on both sides of the Durand Line to make them fight against the “infidels” in Afghanistan. After all, this was what worked well against the USSR so why not try it against the international community in Afghanistan now!

From Pakistan’s standpoint there are good reasons for its strategic depth theory in Afghanistan. The Durand Line Agreement of 1893 has never been accepted or ratified by any Afghan parliament. Peace and stability and a strong indigenous Afghan government in Afghanistan would mean a challenge to the infamous agreement – something not acceptable to Pakistan.

4. The Afghan policy of reconciliation with the Taliban consists of a two track policy. One track seeks to peel off and reintegrate Taliban fighters and their mid-level commanders into Afghan society. President Karzai proposes to offer them jobs, security and amnesty, if Taliban soldiers agree to lay down their arms and abide by the Afghan constitution. A second track seeks reconciliation with the senior Taliban leadership now believed to be holed up in Pakistan. Karzai would offer them amnesty, a safe return to Afghanistan and a role in Afghan politics and government. The Taliban would have to give up armed conflict, cut all ties with al-Qaida, and agree to abide by the constitution, including its guarantee of women's rights.

5. In Afghanistan, while incentives given to the deflected Taliban may include prerogatives like giving them share in government, immunity from prosecution and making them afghan citizens, incentives from Pakistan to the Pakistani Taliban, on the other hand, cannot be as logical and lucrative because the Taliban in Pakistan are mainly concerned with meddling in Afghanistan. One recent truce with the Taliban in the Mohmand Agency of Pakistan was that the Taliban would be spared only if they abandon their activities in Pakistan and start their “jihad” in Afghanistan against the international peacekeeping forces.

[Dehqan]

There is gorilla war in Afghanistan and no gorilla war can be fought without support of indigenous population. the resistance in Afghanistan is from grass root level.

[Dawezai]

Jasmine, I agree that we should realise that the Taliban exist and I believe nobody denies it. But, I have strong reservations against the synonymous use of the terms Taliban and Pashtuns.