can AFG survive economically without USA?

[Zazai]

salam,

i was discussing this with some relatives of mine, but i need some good/logical/academical reasons/answers:

1- CAN afghanistan survice economically, without the USA? How? Who is going to fund the schools, hospitals, constructions, security forces (without which the country would turn into an anarchy), ....millions of people work in offices that r funded by US dollars. Will the afghan economy collapse again, and will thousands starve to death and become refugees in Pak and Iran, like during the Taliban? do any of the anti-USA people have an economic policy, which we can look at and analyse?

2- What if another decade long civil war breaks out? looting, murder, raping etc, will become the norm. It has happened before, why wouldn't this happen again?

i don't want answers like, "we trust in God", because the person i'm discussing wants "academic", tangible answers. thanks

Wasalam,

[Khilji]

Inshallah, Allah(swt) will be mercifull

[Zazai]

Inshallah, Allah(swt) will be mercifull

Amin. No doubt about it.

.... But that doesn't answer the questions does it bro ? It's like doing nothing, and expecting God to sort out the issues by Himself.

the question is, WHAT is the economic plan for those who oppose US ? if they cut their funding, the government will collapse. it will be an anarchy.

they say: 1000 nights under oppression is better than 1 night under anarchy.

[DSM0305]

No country can survive without USA, at least not sustain their current economic growth. Even China relies on USA to buy its goods, without USA chinas economy will collapse. The same goes for every country in the world. We live in a globalized world which USA have a monopoly over. Today every country is connected in terms of economy directly or indirectly with USA.

[khushal]

Amin. No doubt about it.

.... But that doesn't answer the questions does it bro ? It's like doing nothing, and expecting God to sort out the issues by Himself.

the question is, WHAT is the economic plan for those who oppose US ? if they cut their funding, the government will collapse. it will be an anarchy.

they say: 1000 nights under oppression is better than 1 night under anarchy.

what are you talking about, its anarchy now. The anarchy exists because of US presence.

[Zazai]

No country can survive without USA, at least not sustain their current economic growth. Even China relies on USA to buy its goods, without USA chinas economy will collapse. The same goes for every country in the world. We live in a globalized world which USA have a monopoly over. Today every country is connected in terms of economy directly or indirectly with USA.

So what is the solution?

[Shamlawar Khurasani]

salam,
i don't want answers like, "we trust in God", because the person i'm discussing wants "academic", tangible answers. thanks

This suggest the person you are trying to convince believes America is his God.

Therefore you have to do what Ibrahim Alayhi Salam and other Anbya have done: convince him that he believes in a false God.

Start of with asking him what he means with "survive".

There are many third world countries around the world where there are no permanent military bases and strategic agreements with countries like America.

Yet the inhabitants of those places in Africa, Asia and South America are still surviving. They have not been exterminated by their neighbors.

So why is Afghanistan any different? Why are we such cowards who can't survive without so-called "help" form those who have invaded our homes, bombed our families and have made a large portion of our new born babies disformed due to use of depleted uranium?

Ask this person, how did America benefit us in the past 12 years? We have more drug addicts, more warlords, more corruption, more crime, more violence, more moral corruption than before.

How can America achieve anything beneficial in future if they have failed to achieve it in the last 12 years despite having the backing of more than 40 different countries and billions in aid?

Lets say, this person replies by saying that Afghans are at fault because Afghans failed to benefit from the opportunities given to them, you can reply back by asking: what guarantee do we have that Afghans won't do the same thing again?

Let's say this person says, Karzai and his team is corrupt and in future we will elect the hermaphrodite from America who pretends to be Pashtun as president because he is such a highly educated man, ask him, why didn't this hermaphrodite do anything useful in the last 12 years? Why would he be able to achieve something he couldn't achieve in the last 12 years? ( the hermaphrodite is Ashraf Ghani Ahmadzai).

If the person claims that Pakistan and Iran are Afghanistans enemies and their spies and agents prevent us from prospering, ask him why America is giving billions in military aid to Pakistan? If America really cares about Afghanistan, why does it finance and support Afghanistans biggest enemy, Pakistan?

If the person says that the strategic agreement is there to protect us, ask him why during the last 12 years of American presence in Afghanistan, Pakistanis have achieved to move forward and claim more of our land and even fire rockets at our homes along the Durrand line? If the person says: American couldn't do anything against Pakistan because there was no strategic agreement, then ask, on what grounds did America invade Afghanistan in the first place? To serve its own interests? If yes, then what changed since then? And why would the agreement force America to take action next time Pakistan attacks our borders?

I need to go now, maybe I will post more later.

[Shamlawar Khurasani]

WHAT is the economic plan for those who oppose US ? if they cut their funding, the government will collapse. it will be an anarchy. [/I]

Where does all the funding go to right now?

Only a few criminals tied to the corrupt regime benefit from it.

There are countries with larger population than Afghanistan without such economic stimulus, I don't see them starving from hunger.

Why would Afghanistan suddenly vanish from the face of the earth if America stops funding the criminal government of thieves?

The point is, you don't need an alternative economic plan to be against the current plan. Because currently there is no plan. The money that is invested does not make any positive difference, except to those on America's payroll who happen to have double nationality and large financial security in a Western country or elsewhere in the world.

[KGODB]

This suggest the person you are trying to convince believes America is his God.

Therefore you have to do what Ibrahim Alayhi Salam and other Anbya have done: convince him that he believes in a false God.

Start of with asking him what he means with "survive".

There are many third world countries around the world where there are no permanent military bases and strategic agreements with countries like America.

Yet the inhabitants of those places in Africa, Asia and South America are still surviving. They have not been exterminated by their neighbors.

So why is Afghanistan any different? Why are we such cowards who can't survive without so-called "help" form those who have invaded our homes, bombed our families and have made a large portion of our new born babies disformed due to use of depleted uranium?

Ask this person, how did America benefit us in the past 12 years? We have more drug addicts, more warlords, more corruption, more crime, more violence, more moral corruption than before.

How can America achieve anything beneficial in future if they have failed to achieve it in the last 12 years despite having the backing of more than 40 different countries and billions in aid?

Lets say, this person replies by saying that Afghans are at fault because Afghans failed to benefit from the opportunities given to them, you can reply back by asking: what guarantee do we have that Afghans won't do the same thing again?

Let's say this person says, Karzai and his team is corrupt and in future we will elect the hermaphrodite from America who pretends to be Pashtun as president because he is such a highly educated man, ask him, why didn't this hermaphrodite do anything useful in the last 12 years? Why would he be able to achieve something he couldn't achieve in the last 12 years? ( the hermaphrodite is Ashraf Ghani Ahmadzai).

If the person claims that Pakistan and Iran are Afghanistans enemies and their spies and agents prevent us from prospering, ask him why America is giving billions in military aid to Pakistan? If America really cares about Afghanistan, why does it finance and support Afghanistans biggest enemy, Pakistan?

If the person says that the strategic agreement is there to protect us, ask him why during the last 12 years of American presence in Afghanistan, Pakistanis have achieved to move forward and claim more of our land and even fire rockets at our homes along the Durrand line? If the person says: American couldn't do anything against Pakistan because there was no strategic agreement, then ask, on what grounds did America invade Afghanistan in the first place? To serve its own interests? If yes, then what changed since then? And why would the agreement force America to take action next time Pakistan attacks our borders?

I need to go now, maybe I will post more later.

The Salafist brother here speaks wisely on this issue

[Khorosani]

better to live poor in the dunya and rich in the akhira than the other way around. Remember to always have good adab and akhlaq

[Shamlawar Khurasani]

Afghanistan doesn't have a government, if it did, the government would be able to make a deal with China, India, Russia and other alternatives. But since we have no government of our own, we cannot make deals.

A deal that is based on charity is no deal. No country will give you charity. So those who are in favor of America are suggesting America is giving us charity.

We can have a much more realistic plan with other countries.

China needs electricity, we can ask China to invest in our country to build dams to produce electricity. We can receive lots of money and job opportunity with a deal like that.

We can make financial and trade agreements with other countries. We can allow others to invest in our education facilities like India or European countries in exchange for access to our natural resources.

There are many options. But since we have a bunch of prostitutes as government, we can't make any other deal than being slaves.

[Khilji]

Amin. No doubt about it.

.... But that doesn't answer the questions does it bro ? It's like doing nothing, and expecting God to sort out the issues by Himself.

the question is, WHAT is the economic plan for those who oppose US ? if they cut their funding, the government will collapse. it will be an anarchy.

they say: 1000 nights under oppression is better than 1 night under anarchy.

well hope the usa will go down with their economi this will not affect afghanistan because afghanistan has his inland economy food from the south woods from the east etc....
afghanistan will Inshallah(swt) survive and usa will go down like the soviets the british empire.

[Admin Khan]

#1) Aid makes countries, in this case Afghanistan lazy.
#2)Afghanistan would never be able to stand on its feed, if it continues to be fed, and if corruption continues to fuel the economy.

[MENTION=1772]BarakzaiAbdali[/MENTION] might be able to agree that with the current natural resources of Afghanistan, if the nation is let alone, it can stand on its own, the problem is consistent interference in her foreign affairs.

[Admin Khan]

#1) Aid makes countries, in this case Afghanistan lazy.
#2)Afghanistan would never be able to stand on its feet, if it continues to be fed, and if corruption continues to fuel the economy.

[MENTION=1772]BarakzaiAbdali[/MENTION] might be able to agree that with the current natural resources of Afghanistan, if the nation is let alone, it can stand on its own, the problem is consistent interference in her foreign affairs.

[Zazai]

Ask this person, how did America benefit us in the past 12 years? We have more drug addicts, more warlords, more corruption, more crime, more violence, more moral corruption than before.

during the discussion, he said, they've funded hospitals, schools, build bridges, airports, electrical facilities, roads are easy to travel (used to be a nightmare to travel), brought food/medicines/vaccines to villages, funded the army/police/courts, and so on!

and he said, if the "mukhalifeene dawlat" did not kill and disrupt peace, we would be financially strong like Japan and South Korea, where the US has military bases...........

There are many third world countries around the world where there are no permanent military bases and strategic agreements with countries like America. Yet the inhabitants of those places in Africa, Asia and South America are still surviving.

True.

If the person claims that Pakistan and Iran are Afghanistans enemies and their spies and agents prevent us from prospering, ask him why America is giving billions in military aid to Pakistan? If America really cares about Afghanistan, why does it finance and support Afghanistans biggest enemy, Pakistan?

Good point!

( the hermaphrodite is Ashraf Ghani Ahmadzai).

About him, i said, it was a big mistake to work with dostom. he said: in AFG, votes are bought with money. there is no real election. dostum has money. ghani is clever, and a good person. he's an economist. a technocrat. he used dostom to buy the votes, then maybe send dostom out of the country when he's in charge. he also said: sometimes you ride a donkey, to get to your destination.