Dividing Afghanistan

[Da Bannu Mazdigar]

The Tajiks i had talked to and cheap farsiwand from Afghanista.

They all are now tired of Afghan pashtuns and would want a seperate country the moment a opportunity arise.

The best Pakistan should do is to fence the border with Afghanistan as in case once the civil war in afghanistan beyond 2014.

This time we wont allow any sort of refugees.Neither would anyone help the Afghan pashtuns against the creation of Khorosan country for Tajik,Uzbek and Hazara people even if the Cheif of army staff of pak army is from FATA(Lt Gen Tariq Khan)

And Yes we Pakistani pashtuns are already enough.More than 30million in strength and growing.Everyone in Pakistan fear from us and love us aswell.

I dont think a addition of odd 8-10million afghan pashtuns would make any significant difference for Us Pakistani pashtuns.

I would also like If Govt of Pakistan give citizenship to the already Afghan refugees in Pakistan and close the chapter.As after living 3 decades in Pakistan among us.They are no different from us and we love them.

[Tiger Khan]

The Tajiks i had talked to and cheap farsiwand from Afghanista.

They all are now tired of Afghan pashtuns and would want a seperate country the moment a opportunity arise.

The best Pakistan should do is to fence the border with Afghanistan as in case once the civil war in afghanistan beyond 2014.

This time we wont allow any sort of refugees.Neither would anyone help the Afghan pashtuns against the creation of Khorosan country for Tajik,Uzbek and Hazara people even if the Cheif of army staff of pak army is from FATA(Lt Gen Tariq Khan)

And Yes we Pakistani pashtuns are already enough.More than 30million in strength and growing.Everyone in Pakistan fear from us and love us aswell.

I dont think a addition of odd 8-10million afghan pashtuns would make any significant difference for Us Pakistani pashtuns.

I would also like If Govt of Pakistan give citizenship to the already Afghan refugees in Pakistan and close the chapter.As after living 3 decades in Pakistan among us.They are no different from us and we love them.

I value all the pashtuns.. the ones in pakistan and afghanistan.. i believe both are equal in every respect.. i dont agree with bannu.. he has this inferior view of Afghanistani pashtuns... i dont stand for that.. i think pakistan pashtuns are from afghanistan orignally.. and we should all stand by each other.. Plus i think bannu was born and rasied in KPK and this why he is unable to have a broader view of the situation... he needs to look from outside of the box.

[DSM0305]

Once upon a time I was a strong supporter of Loy Afghanistan or Pashtunistan. Then something happen.... I matured.

Lets be honest.

- Uzbek from Afghanistan have nothing in common with Uzbek from Uzbekistan
- Tajik from Afghanistan have nothing in common with tajiks from Tajikistan
- The only thing Pashtuns from Pakistan have in common with Pashtuns in Afghanistan is the fact that both of them are poor and have no power in their representative country.

A common Pashtun in Pakistan have basically the same view as dude named Da Bannu Mazdigar in this forum.

To sum it all up. There wont come any border changes whatever you, me or another random person want it or not.

Also don't base your entire view upon something a random person said. Don't know who it was, but somebody here was stupid enough to think Afghanistan gonna be divided because a random Tajik who is 1 out of 13000000 said he wanted so.

I mean guys seriously be realistic, all these maps and border changes wont happen. Things will stay as they are. If anything I would predict Pashtuns in Pakistan and Afghanistan will move future away from each other both in terms of Politics and culturally as-well.

Currently our Pashto language is the only thing that we have in common. We all know the only way a language can survive the harsh world is being a national language and be taught at school. So basically the only thing we have in common will be gone as-well, it only matter of time.

[Smarty]

Aoo pashto razi, au ma punjabi hamsaya ma na yaregi. aghai ta pata da che musha pashtana yo

Sta na gawandan waley yaregi, kundey ghat brait laray?

So how exactly your family has retained pashto in punjab? do you guys maintain links with your original abode? Does your family rejects every rishta coming from your punjabi neighbors?

My questions are out of curiosity because i rarely see a pashtun family retaining pashto in second generation while settled in big cities of punjab.....they are disconnected from pashtuns, so they frequently ends up marrying local Punjabis......and ends up non-pashtuns

[Da Bannu Mazdigar]

I value all the pashtuns.. the ones in pakistan and afghanistan.. i believe both are equal in every respect.. i dont agree with bannu.. he has this inferior view of Afghanistani pashtuns... i dont stand for that.. i think pakistan pashtuns are from afghanistan orignally.. and we should all stand by each other.. Plus i think bannu was born and rasied in KPK and this why he is unable to have a broader view of the situation... he needs to look from outside of the box.

when i said they are inferior or something similar?

all i said is that since we already were sold off by them to british india and betrayed the most.

We already are more than 30millions in number with alot of influence within Pakistan and throughout south asia.Once may be the afghan pashtun known.But today from sports to entertainment industry upto the nomination of Nobel prize and scientists.In every single aspect the Pashtun of Pakistan is known throughout the world not the pashtun of afghanistan.

Here in UAE the common arabs think pashtun are only from Pakistan.They have no idea whether Afghanistan has pashtun or not.

My view for Afghanistan will only change and i may even change my view to seperate from pakistan and join Afghanistan if they kick out the tajik and uzbek from Afghanistan even if they would have to sacrify their land for this.

I read somewhere that since 2008 0.4million afghan refugees has claimed Pakistani nationality within Balochistan.

My home is just 50km from khost border and have alot of relatives in afghanistan.half of my mother side family is stil in Ghor province.

[Da Bannu Mazdigar]

And Yes I also defend Afghan alot when i am among my non pashtuns friends.Not only me but many Pashtun from KPK

couple of days before the eid in the ramadan i was on my way to bannu from peshawar in the public coach.I am sure most of the pakistan pashtun might know as before entering the kohat tunnel.There is an army checkpost.They stopped the coach and started checking everyones CNIC.coach had all the pashtun people and of them 2 were Afghan.Probably the soldier was a punjabi/Non pashtun.he took both of them out and told them to first go to peshawar and than peshawar sadar taana.Give us a written proof.To defend them one older pashtun i think from the banusi tribe as i could recoginize as he spoke.Became angry on the army guy and gave him a lecture including saying because he's pashtun and from Afghanistan is this the reason you are stopping them?

in the end the army guy stepped away and let them go :D

[Smarty]

.Neither would anyone help the Afghan pashtuns against the creation of Khorosan country for Tajik,Uzbek and Hazara people even if the Cheif of army staff of pak army is from FATA(Lt Gen Tariq Khan)

The next Army chief of Paki army is Punjabi, nawaz shareef would never appoint a pashtun COAS.
Read this news Haroon, Rashad
Your general tariq khan is 4th in seniority list so his chances of becoming next COAS is zero. He is from Tank, not FATA. By the way a non-pashtun president has never promoted pashtun general to COAS. Look at the history,
1- General yaha khan appointed by pashtun/semi-pashtun ayub khan(pashtun/semi-pashtun)
2- General gul mir hassan appointed by yaha khan (pashtun/semi-pashtun)
3- generel waheed kakar appointed by ghulam ishaq khan (pashtun from your bannu)

The selection criteria for fauji officers in ISSB is 'beghairati". No wonder fauji officers trade their wives and junior officers send their wives to seniors for night to get promotion. I wonder what general tariq khan's wife must have endured for sake of promotion of his husband.

[Da Bannu Mazdigar]

The next Army chief of Paki army is Punjabi, nawaz shareef would never appoint a pashtun COAS.
Read this news Haroon, Rashad
Your general tariq khan is 4th in seniority list so his chances of becoming next COAS is zero. He is from Tank, not FATA. By the way a non-pashtun president has never promoted pashtun general to COAS. Look at the history,
1- General yaha khan appointed by pashtun/semi-pashtun ayub khan(pashtun/semi-pashtun)
2- General gul mir hassan appointed by yaha khan (pashtun/semi-pashtun)
3- generel waheed kakar appointed by ghulam ishaq khan (pashtun from your bannu)

The selection criteria for fauji officers in ISSB is 'beghairati". No wonder fauji officers trade their wives and junior officers send their wives to seniors for night to get promotion. I wonder what general tariq khan's wife must have endured for sake of promotion of his husband.

As expected

Tariq Khan might be 4th in seniority but there are now strong rumours of him being selected because since the retirement annoucement of Kiyani officialy.Lt genral haroon aslam will most probably be CJSC.

I really dont like Haroon aslam as xeric said he's very polite and nice person.While i want anyone but agressive.

I hope the COAS is Tariq Khan but if not him than Rashid

[Tiger Khan]

Sta na gawandan waley yaregi, kundey ghat brait laray?

So how exactly your family has retained pashto in punjab? do you guys maintain links with your original abode? Does your family rejects every rishta coming from your punjabi neighbors?

My questions are out of curiosity because i rarely see a pashtun family retaining pashto in second generation while settled in big cities of punjab.....they are disconnected from pashtuns, so they frequently ends up marrying local Punjabis......and ends up non-pashtuns

i know many pashtun families like that.. and yes we rearly marry punjabies.. and in the cases we have.. the outsider had to learn pashto..

[Tiger Khan]

The next Army chief of Paki army is Punjabi, nawaz shareef would never appoint a pashtun COAS.
Read this news Haroon, Rashad
Your general tariq khan is 4th in seniority list so his chances of becoming next COAS is zero. He is from Tank, not FATA. By the way a non-pashtun president has never promoted pashtun general to COAS. Look at the history,
1- General yaha khan appointed by pashtun/semi-pashtun ayub khan(pashtun/semi-pashtun)
2- General gul mir hassan appointed by yaha khan (pashtun/semi-pashtun)
3- generel waheed kakar appointed by ghulam ishaq khan (pashtun from your bannu)

The selection criteria for fauji officers in ISSB is 'beghairati". No wonder fauji officers trade their wives and junior officers send their wives to seniors for night to get promotion. I wonder what general tariq khan's wife must have endured for sake of promotion of his husband.

you are pretty negative.. is this how you are in real life aswell? i feel sorry for you

[Tiger Khan]

Once upon a time I was a strong supporter of Loy Afghanistan or Pashtunistan. Then something happen.... I matured.

Lets be honest.

- Uzbek from Afghanistan have nothing in common with Uzbek from Uzbekistan
- Tajik from Afghanistan have nothing in common with tajiks from Tajikistan
- The only thing Pashtuns from Pakistan have in common with Pashtuns in Afghanistan is the fact that both of them are poor and have no power in their representative country.

A common Pashtun in Pakistan have basically the same view as dude named Da Bannu Mazdigar in this forum.

To sum it all up. There wont come any border changes whatever you, me or another random person want it or not.

Also don't base your entire view upon something a random person said. Don't know who it was, but somebody here was stupid enough to think Afghanistan gonna be divided because a random Tajik who is 1 out of 13000000 said he wanted so.

I mean guys seriously be realistic, all these maps and border changes wont happen. Things will stay as they are. If anything I would predict Pashtuns in Pakistan and Afghanistan will move future away from each other both in terms of Politics and culturally as-well.

Currently our Pashto language is the only thing that we have in common. We all know the only way a language can survive the harsh world is being a national language and be taught at school. So basically the only thing we have in common will be gone as-well, it only matter of time.

Dude.. nothing leads to nothing.. look at the history of this region and the rest of the world.. maps langauges, religions, cultures,, changed quiet a bit. now if you educate people, you can get a result you want or something close to it.. if you dont do anything.. things happen to you but you dont happen to things.. from your comment stating that Tajiks dont want independent land it seems you are from Afghanistan, as i am getting the same mantra. Afghanistan's pashtun should stop blaming pakistan and get thier act togather.. Moreover, understand that Pakistan has been a big supporter of Afghanistan pashtuns.. Had it not been Pakistani spport through pakistani pashtuns or direct, tajik and other ethnic groups would have had you for dinner by now, (With the support of Iran, Central Asia, India and America)... So stop blaming pakistan for your short comings and get your act togather.

[DSM0305]

Dude.. nothing leads to nothing.. look at the history of this region and the rest of the world.. maps langauges, religions, cultures,, changed quiet a bit. now if you educate people, you can get a result you want or something close to it.. if you dont do anything.. things happen to you but you dont happen to things.. from your comment stating that Tajiks dont want independent land it seems you are from Afghanistan, as i am getting the same mantra. Afghanistan's pashtun should stop blaming pakistan and get thier act togather.. Moreover, understand that Pakistan has been a big supporter of Afghanistan pashtuns.. Had it not been Pakistani spport through pakistani pashtuns or direct, tajik and other ethnic groups would have had you for dinner by now, (With the support of Iran, Central Asia, India and America)... So stop blaming pakistan for your short comings and get your act togather.

Lets get fact straight before even begin to talk.

First of all I haven't blamed anyone, but if you want to go that way, we can look at resent history.

Pashtuns were 80% of the government of Afghanistan before all these wars.

Pashtuns had every single highly ranked post in the government including presidency/royalties

Officers used uzbek and hazara soldiers to make their housework, that includes every dirty stuff that comes along with it (even changing diapers on babies)

Basically Pashtuns had 100% control of Afghanistan. That also one of the reason many fascist non-Pashtuns have so much hatred towards Pashtuns, basically it because of their humiliating past.

Now look how the situation have reversed.

When Daoud Khan tried to unit Pashtuns from both sides, that where it all went wrong. Pashtuns from Pakistan went against Afghanistan and from that day Pakistan has been supporting extremists in Afghanistan, to make sure Pashtuns in Afghanistan never try to unit with Pashtuns from Pakistan.

Now tell me where does all the hatred toward tajik, uzbek etc. comes from? I mean I can understand if a Pashtun from Afghanistan out of Political reason have some sort of hatred towards them, but why does Pashtuns in Pakistan hate them? Basically that how Pakistan have educated you. They have given a reason to Pashtuns in Pakistan to never unit with Pashtuns in Afghanistan.

To sum it all up and answer your respond in short.

- Afghanistan never needed Pakistan

- Afghanistan was all good without Pakistan

- Pashtuns ruled Afghanistan, but their attempt to unite Pashtuns was the downfall of the Pashtun rule.

- Pakistan have played it cards right so currently it impossible to unite Pasthuns (basically map/border changing is impossible)

- Afghans are extremely poor especially Pashtuns. They be better of improving their relation with the other ethnicities in Afghanistan, instead of chasing after Pasthuns in Pakistan who have made it clear that they are Pathans, not Afghans.

If you don't believe me, then look at Da Bannu Mazdigar. He is basically what a Pashtun in Pakistan is like. The vast majority if not all of them, have made it clear, that uniting with Afghans or even have a good relation with their government is a no go.

[Shamlawar Khurasani]

Can we please stop arguing about these nonsensical and counterproductive topics?

These topics only divide people and bring more hostility and hatred for no reason.

[Badlun]

Afghanistan has wise leadership and president Karzai has visited Pakistan many times and leadership of Paksitan has been many times to Afghanistan.

In the world of realism, real-politik and balance of power , there is one hard reality and that is geography. You can change your allies, your friends, your enemies but never your neighbours.

Thus in spite of many problems both Pakistan and Afghanistan, they must respect each other as neighbours as both of them need each other like any neighbour need the other. Afghanistan had the erstwhile Soviet Union invasion and that had to resort to Pakistan and if tomorrow Pakistan has such an invasion from India or elsewhere their only refuge will be Afghanistan.

Apart from political and defence ties they need each other for commerce, trade, imports, exports, exchange of delegations, experts, culture and many other areas. Let us stop the negativity and behave like good friends for the benefit of the common masses. You cannot have a neighbour as your enemy for the whole life.

[Bost Bastan News]

1. I don´t know why the admin team of this group allow such racists from Pakistan who are 100% ISI agents to fuel ethnic hatred among Afghans to comment on this forum against other Afghan tribes. I´m sure if an Iranian or a Hazara would come here and talk like this he would have been kicked out after his first post. Do we really allow a Paki Dalkhur to talk here about their Afghan masters? Ismael Yoon wrote a book about genocide and ethnic cleansing for the Taliban how to treat other tribes during their rule and what was the results, except Pashtun suffering? The most powerful tribe today in Afghanistan are Farsiwans having 10times more men, better organisations, much access to weapons, tanks. They own already defense and interior ministry, higher education, culture, many banks are run on their accounts and they control every economy knot. How you want to fight such an ''enemy'' that is even supported by the west if it comes again to civil war? It is clear! Dalkhur Pakis are using such kinds of tactics to fuel hatered among Afghan tribes so Afghanistan getting again messed up and these people can be happy. Their other goal is to send as much as possible Pashtun youth to Afghanistan to fight. The more youth join the fight in Afghanistan the weaker is the future of Pashtuns in Pakistan and in Afghanistan Pashtuns will keep suffering and remain weak.

2. Kicking people out of a country is not that easy and never worked. The Taliban backed by the Saudis and Pakis couldn´t do that and it backlashed and destroyed finally Pashtun life with hundred thousands of new Pashtun refugees in post-2001 caused in the north, thousands of rape victims, sold children to eastern Europe and neighbouring states. I don´t know in what kind of Utopia some monkies from Panjab live. Don´t think that other tribes are not dangerous in Afghanistan and only Pashtuns can harm other tribes. Before Afghanistan get devided Pakistan will be bombed to stone-age. Many provinces in your map have clearly a Tajik majority. A new civil war will overlap all other wars ever we had in Afghanistan. It would be the destruction of Afghanistan and Pashtuns. Before any Dalkhur is talking here about Afghanistan he or she should become free souls from Prostitution for Panjabis and terrorist groups of these so called minorities. On which sources does this map bases? ISI propaganda?