Why do we include Balochistan in a hypothetical Pashtunistan?

[RevolutionThroughReason]

This would explain the relationship of the Khalaj and Ghilzai pretty sufficiently

In 1040, they revolted against Mas'ud I of Ghazni, was sultan of Ghaznavids. He sent a punitive expedition but he was defeated and later dethroned and executed by Mohammad Ghaznavi. During the Ghaznavid and Ghurid rules, some of Khalaj gradually become Ghilzai tribe of Afghan. Ghurid Ghiyath al-Din Mahmud came to power at Firuzkuh with support of them. Later they were subjected by Khwarezmshahs in 1210s. During the Mongol invasion of 1221, many Khalajes joined the Mongols but others continued to Sayf al-Din Ighrak, who formed an ephemeral independent state in the valley of Kabul. Many Khalajes then went to India and served the sultans of Delhi, in western India and even in Bengal, its members were called Khilji and founded a dynasty which ruled Delhi sultanate from 1290 to 1320 and other dynasties in various places as Malwa. Despite their Turkic origins, they were considered as Afghans for Indians.

[Wahe Guru]

What you're saying is not inconsistent with what I was saying. All Ghilzais were Turks AT ONE TIME, means exactly that. I never said they were Mongoloids.

I might have made it a little confusing by quoting you first and then writing opposite to that.

What I am suggesting is that Ghilzais originally cannot have been real Turks but that they were an Iranic people who had adopted the Turkic language, Turkic names and perhaps some Turkic customs as well. My reason for saying so is because the original Turks by most evidence appear to have been a Mongoloid looking people and the Ghilzais are not Mongoloid looking. Similarly it seems even the Turkish people are not mostly descended from the original Turks. Where are the original Turks? They appear to have mostly mixed into others, but some people in and around Mongolia might have been the original Turks even if now they do not speak Turkic. People like Uighers and others like them are probably partially Turks.

Ghilzais do not seem to be real Turks even if they themselves or others called them Turks. They seem to be Iranic people by origin.

[RevolutionThroughReason]

I might have made it a little confusing by quoting you first and then writing opposite to that.

What I am suggesting is that Ghilzais originally cannot have been real Turks but that they were an Iranic people who had adopted the Turkic language, Turkic names and perhaps some Turkic customs as well. My reason for saying so is because the original Turks by most evidence appear to have been a Mongoloid looking people and the Ghilzais are not Mongoloid looking. Similarly it seems even the Turkish people are not mostly descended from the original Turks. Where are the original Turks? They appear to have mostly mixed into others, but some people in and around Mongolia might have been the original Turks even if now they do not speak Turkic. People like Uighers and others like them are probably partially Turks.

Ghilzais do not seem to be real Turks even if they themselves or others called them Turks. They seem to be Iranic people by origin.

Well that's fine I never suggested they were Mongolid Turks, Elsewhere On this forum I had a dialogue with Midnight Sun and I concurred that Ghilzais were possibly Scythian and Hephtalites. The point being is that they were merged INTO Pashtuns by way of Turkic Identity. Being iranic doesn't make one Pashtuns

even "Tajiks" are "Iranic"

[Ahmad Abdul-Rahimzai]

Loy Afghanistan can never reach the water unless the Baluch accept this. If we were Baluch we would not accept this others taking our access to the water. With the proper leadership on both sides it is possible to either purchase a small strip of land to reach the water, similar to Iraq's borders, or make a deal for mutual reliance on each other. For example Afghanistan uses Baluchistan for oceanic trade and Baluchistan uses Afghanistan for land trade with China, Central Asia, Russia and Europe.

[RevolutionThroughReason]

Loy Afghanistan can never reach the water unless the Baluch accept this. If we were Baluch we would not accept this others taking our access to the water. With the proper leadership on both sides it is possible to either purchase a small strip of land to reach the water, similar to Iraq's borders, or make a deal for mutual reliance on each other. For example Afghanistan uses Baluchistan for oceanic trade and Baluchistan uses Afghanistan for land trade with China, Central Asia, Russia and Europe.

Well Pashtuns are world class hypocrites we feel we're entitled to everything.

[Kushan Prince]

Loy Afghanistan can never reach the water unless the Baluch accept this. If we were Baluch we would not accept this others taking our access to the water. With the proper leadership on both sides it is possible to either purchase a small strip of land to reach the water, similar to Iraq's borders, or make a deal for mutual reliance on each other. For example Afghanistan uses Baluchistan for oceanic trade and Baluchistan uses Afghanistan for land trade with China, Central Asia, Russia and Europe.

Baloch people are practicly Pashtuns in disguise. Lower balochistan will become part of afghanistan one way or the other. Majority always wins over minority.

[RevolutionThroughReason]

Good thing the BLA would fight Pashtuns if they ever tried that. I would support the BLA on any attempt by Pashtuns to take something from the Baluch,. sick and tired of Pashtun arrogance.

[Kushan Prince]

Well that's fine I never suggested they were Mongolid Turks, Elsewhere On this forum I had a dialogue with Midnight Sun and I concurred that Ghilzais were possibly Scythian and Hephtalites. The point being is that they were merged INTO Pashtuns by way of Turkic Identity. Being iranic doesn't make one Pashtuns

even "Tajiks" are "Iranic"

The Pashtuns in general are believed to have come from the scythians and hephtalites. So Ghilzais were pashtun all along.

[RevolutionThroughReason]

The Pashtuns in general are believed to have come from the scythians and hephtalites. So Ghilzais were pashtun all along.

Tajiks also come from Scythians and Hephtalites so Tajiks are Pashtuns all along?

crappy logic there bro.....why are you so desperate to make Pashtuns seem like they bave some long noble history. Pashtuns being "descended" from certain people doesn't make them those people.

[Kushan Prince]

Tajiks also come from Scythians and Hephtalites so Tajiks are Pashtuns all along?

crappy logic there bro.

Lol where does it say that tajiks descend from them? first time i am hearing this. Tajiks are nothing but leftovers of the Sodighan who befriended Alexander the great.

[Kushan Prince]

Tajiks also come from Scythians and Hephtalites so Tajiks are Pashtuns all along?

crappy logic there bro.....why are you so desperate to make Pashtuns seem like they bave some long noble history. Pashtuns being "descended" from certain people doesn't make them those people.

RTR, why are you so negative against your pashtun brothers bro? You can't blame pashtuns for everything, and how come you accept the ghilzai-turk theory so easily?

[RevolutionThroughReason]

Lol where does it say that tajiks descend from them? first time i am hearing this. Tajiks are nothing but leftovers of the Sodighan who befriended Alexander the great.

Well you said Bactria was Pashtun right?

Well Soghdians ruled Bactria, so when Scythians invaded they all mixed together, TADA Modern Tajiks , Modern Pashtuns etc etc etc eventually spawned from all of that.

[RevolutionThroughReason]

RTR, why are you so negative against your pashtun brothers bro? You can't blame pashtuns for everything, and how come you accept the ghilzai-turk theory so easily?

because Pashtuns need to start being realistic and not fabricate or make up ridiculous stories about themselves just to have some false self esteem.

I accept ghilzai turk theory because it makes sense and the evidence is strong. Plus it makes sense why my Tribe ..the Hotak are called by a Turkish name and not a Pashtun one.

[SiiNii]

Baloch people are practicly Pashtuns in disguise. Lower balochistan will become part of afghanistan one way or the other. Majority always wins over minority.

Not so KP. Here is an example of a minority (15%) 'winning' over a majority:

Thai Chinese - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The present Thai royal family, the Chakri Dynasty, was founded by King Rama I who himself was partly Chinese. His predecessor, King Taksin of Thonburi dynastry, was the son of a Chinese immigrant from Guangdong Province and a Thai mother.

Thai Chinese are well represented in all levels of Thai society and make up a significant percentage of Thailand's business and upper class.[3] They are estimated to produce 50% of Thailand's overall GNP.[4] They play a leading role in the Thai business and commerce sector.[5][6][7][8] The Thai Chinese business class is also dominant in the Thai finance sector.[9] Thai Chinese are also well represented in the Thai political scene and most of Thai Prime Ministers were of (mixed) Chinese origin.[10]

So lets see, Balochis and Pashtuns are both Muslims and similar looking, respect each other and have a common foe to unite them, what is stopping peaceful conquest via intermarriage? In fact, this might be in the plans of one our new members

[khushal]

even "Tajiks" are "Iranic"

There is also a theory that states that Tajiks are persianized Turks, but its a theory.