Bone Head At It Again

[BarakzaiAbdali]

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/asia/2...ink11-20130114

Whether you support him and truly think he is the saviour of the nation, the resurrection of Ahmad Shah Baba, the unprophetic prophet of the era, I cannot FATHOM any argument in support of this.

People on here are CONSTANTLY bit-ching about how the Muslim world payes too much attention to Arab rights and Arab nationalism and Arab progression. Well, lets compare two boneheads where it matters:

Maliki (a shia puppet of Iran) vs Karzai (a puppet of 37 nations)

Maliki in the least refused to allow for any immunity for American troops. Albeit his whole existence and regime is based on the overthrow of his enemy by the Americans - even then he did not accede this basic fingerprint of autonomy.

And Karzai is saying this:

""The Afghan government can't decide on this. This is up to the Afghan nation to decide. The Loya Jirga will decide," he said, referring to the national assembly of tribal elders."

This Karzai-Thug Code for: Wait a minute, lemme go grab the guys who I pay off and the thugs I empower to stage a vote like I did the last 3 times... I know... Ill give another "Afghanistan is a Lion" speech and make everyone think I am legitimate - then all of you will pertend to vote and we will talk about strategic balancing (i.e. I will prove I am Afghanistan's equivalent of Ali Jinnah and Kiyani rolled in one) and no one can say a darn thing.

Do people understand what this means???? This means that any criminal activity done on Afghan soil by American forces (not even necessarily related to war crimes issues like the Panjawai event) will be under the equivalent of diplomatic protection and NOT prosecutable. Any crimes committed will have to be prosecuted not by the Afghan people - but by military criminal justice systems in the US if at all.

That is the LITMUS test for an autonomous nation. If you cannot implement or demand justice on your soil for crimes committed there - whether they be by the common man - the Taliban - Karzai - foreigners etc - you are in no wise independent or autonomous.

So for the folks complaining about attention and fawning over Arabian causes - think about the shame of the fact that their bonehead at least secured non immunity and this bonehead is on the way to ceding it in the most corrupt way possible.

How can you claim you have any semblance of superiority when your own thug cannot even secure that basic measure of independence???

The only tenable excuse is that an American soldier would face an unfair trial in hostile terrain. The issue with such an argument is that the Karzai crowd bases their support for him under the false guise that the Afghan nation feels at one with their "president" or "resident thug" as I prefer. How, in their warped logic, can the Afghan nation on the one hand support Mr. "Afghanistan is a Lion" Karzai and, supposedly, as they say view Americans as liberators and yet raise this notion that this same Afghan nation would be unfair to their "liberators???" The logic makes minimal to non-sense.

They surely cannot use the Pakistan bogeyman here as these would be Afghan courts packed by karzai appointed judges in all reaches and regions of the nation... so they surely must be feeling rather sheepish reaching for that joker card.

This is just a no brainer - no government of any nation should ever have to cede the right to forgo its law code for any guests on its soil. It does not matter whether that law code is secular, satanic, islamic, communist etc.

I have repeatedly warned people that Afghanistan is fast approaching becoming Pakistan next door to Pakistan. If this momentum Karzai's idiocy is building toward by his recent idiotic meanderings about surrending the right to prosecute all criminals in his own country is not proof positive then his followers are all clearly blind. To prove the point think about the lengths Pakistan went to in order to not prosecute Raymond Davis and other folks that broke the law on their soil- not to prosecute that nut job that was roaming around Bajaur thinking he was going to find the big bad wolf. That nation has also willingly ceded autonomy and Mr.(Mrs?) karzai is very adeptly showing that he can also build a mirror like failed nation state right next door to that one.

Bottom line: you cannot complain about the Arabs getting by and getting more news time when their bonehead has at least a basic understanding of the way the world works compared to our bonehead

[faye]

the tricks that get played. more of these private security said to be used in afghanistan, supposedly for security in the mining ventures,

Granting foreign contractors immunity from Iraqi law
Two days before he left Iraq, Bremer signed "Order 17"[48] giving all staff associated with the CPA and the American government immunity from Iraqi law. One of his former top aides is quoted as saying, “we wanted to make sure our military, civilians and contractors were protected from Iraqi law.”[49] This stipulation was later incorporated into Iraqi law.[50]
Since then, violent events in Iraq involving American security companies such as Blackwater have resulted in great resentment among Iraqis, who view them as private armies acting with impunity on their soil.[51][52][53][54]Granting foreign contractors immunity from Iraqi law
Two days before he left Iraq, Bremer signed "Order 17"[48] giving all staff associated with the CPA and the American government immunity from Iraqi law. One of his former top aides is quoted as saying, “we wanted to make sure our military, civilians and contractors were protected from Iraqi law.”[49] This stipulation was later incorporated into Iraqi law.[50]
Since then, violent events in Iraq involving American security companies such as Blackwater have resulted in great resentment among Iraqis, who view them as private armies acting with impunity on their soil.[51][52][53][54]Granting foreign contractors immunity from Iraqi law
Two days before he left Iraq, Bremer signed "Order 17"[48] giving all staff associated with the CPA and the American government immunity from Iraqi law. One of his former top aides is quoted as saying, “we wanted to make sure our military, civilians and contractors were protected from Iraqi law.”[49] This stipulation was later incorporated into Iraqi law.[50]
Since then, violent events in Iraq involving American security companies such as Blackwater have resulted in great resentment among Iraqis, who view them as private armies acting with impunity on their soil.[51][52][53][54]

[Admin Khan]

What alternative do you have to offer BA?

[ComradePashtun]

That is a very valid question, AdminKhan. Unfortunately non of these guys have been able to answer this since I can recall for the long time that I have been member in this forum.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

That is a very valid question, AdminKhan. Unfortunately non of these guys have been able to answer this since I can recall for the long time that I have been member in this forum.

No one has asked me. Rather, the usual asking goes something like this:

Person A: valid criticism is leveled against the Karzai government
Person B: Pakistan
Person A: how does that figure into the conversation here?
Person B: well any criticism of the Karzai government or any common sensical allusion to the fact that Pashtuns by nature are conservative and have their own culture and society that is not entirely amenable to forced Westernization protocols is ipso facto on par with Pakistan

It usually ends up being an ahistorical and nonsensical discussion that yields little in the way of progress.

Not saying that you do this, but pointing out the discussion is usually not tenable with others.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

What alternative do you have to offer BA?

Admin,

Did you read my commentary my friend? Re-read it.

Look - The Karzai crowd is obsessed with claiming that Afghanistan is in a "tough neighborhood" and that is why indefinite outside presence is a must.

The argument falls flat on its face as Iraq is not in any less of a tough neighbor hood having fought a brutally bloody war with Iran years before and with a multitude of proxies from the latter. Saudi Arabia is frightened to death of any shiite theocracy comprised of Arabs ready to give voice to its own disenfranchized shiites. The Syrian issue is well known. Other localized states and iraq have had historical squabbles.

Yet did that mandate that they have to use a strategy akin to strategic depth that Karzai seems to fancy perhaps best referred to as "strategic balancing?" This notion is that a fool and moron with no arms and no skill and no cards to deal with (Karzai) can counterbalance world and regional powers.
Iraqese could have pitched the same arguments and in fact the western technocrats who lost out were trying DESPERATELY as Faye shows above to do so.

So my answer is that this notion of no alternatives is a ruse that the failed Afghan technocrats in Kabul dreamed up to sustain their Al Capone style mafioso government that is well on its way to being called Zardaristan secondary to its massive innate corruption.

One answer is:
Why is Karzai not asking the tough questions to exact more out of his enablers? After all, as I stated above - if the kleptocrats are claiming that the Afghan people are in shangri la holding flowers out and all ready to accede to foreign presence why not ask Obama why immunity is a must have? Since the Afghan people are holding out flowers - why then the Afghan courts and Afghan people mean no ill will or injustice right??? That is the selling point Karzai puts forth in each of his speeching where he grovels for more and gets nothing.

To spring board off this - why not use the same emotional black mail that Amnesty International and the Red Cell Memos use all the time against the public of their respective nations? If Israel can mount an ad campaign in the US during an election to influence public officials why would Hamid Karzai not take the message to the respective people of the various UN nations? Its an easy pitch: run a few commercials of Aisha, Malali, and some other downtrodden girls and discuss western abandonment and then link it to the argument of how its completely unfair for any nation to ask for utter immunity in this situation. Depict it as black mail and anti women and minority rights.

Why not do what he actually thinks he is doing and leverage the supposedly trillion dollars of mineral reserves and resources to competing global powers and give them an economic stake in Afghanistan's survival?

Why not work through the UN and demand a peace keeper extension. If they can spare troops to invade Mali and make war - what inhibits them from sparing some more to make peace?

Why not demand reciprocity for his own soldiers and demand training in the US with the same EXACT right of immunity for any crimes committed?

Most of all, why not be the man he should have been 2 decades ago and stand up for the rights, dignity, and independence of his people and refuse to compromise on this crucial aspect of what defines autonomy?

The answer is simple Admin. His supporters know that this is a farcical government that does not have the support they claim it does. They had to invent a narrative where every conservative minded Pashtun who goes to a mosque or read the Quran or is part of that insurgency carries dual passports for Kabul and Islamabad.

Now, they are in a fix and are trying their best to secure untenable and indefinite protection for their gangster thievery and chicanery.

Its embarrassing just how much they are willing to part with when it comes to dignity.

As I said, up to now they have been the crowd constantly complaining like dogs in heat about stupid Arabs this and stupid Arabs that and have generated a narrative about desert warriors from Arabia.

They are simply left with their partoog down when it becomes obvious that an Arab outwitted them and that their puppet did not compromise immunity.

So then, who is the bigger prostitute - the Arab in Baghadad or Hamid Karzai?

That my friend is the real question that they need to answer before they impose such a fiend on the Afghan people any longer.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

Karzai Faces Opposition to Giving U.S. Troops Immunity- Bloomberg

Looks like even the corrupt Karzai affiliate crooks like Barekzai Kharoti, the Helmand villager is saying the same thing... Acknowledging how Such a huge concession is no small laughing matter. Let's hope Miss Hamid doesn't try another lion speech and make himself look even dumber. He already signed the SOFA agreement for godsake... How much more bending over is he willing to do? For shame... Even an Arab in Baghdad wouldn't do that much oral felatting but Karzai Bibi is all too willing to be the best at what he does ...

[Admin Khan]

I see, but isn't Iraq now an Iranian stooge, hence the tough neighbors surrounding you theory does hold true? I.e, it implies that Afghanistan might end up as
A)Iranian stooge
B)Pakistani stooge

I do agree that the US can easily arm the Afghans with tough equipment. If the US truly wants to help Afghans, they can give them 3 Nuclear weapons(3 in case 1 goes bad), an array of F16s, some nice air planes, train Afghan men in West Point, and build some CUNY or SUNY style universities. Afghans are NOT asking for the MIT, CMU, CalTech's, a CUNY style system would certainly bring Afghanistan on it's foot. Technion is credited for single-handledly bringing Israel to the forefront of science.

However, the main question here is:
Is a stable Afghanistan truly in the American interest? As an Engineer, it took me no longer than a couple of minutes to come up with a solution that will work, guaranteed. Considering the trillion dollars they wasted on the Afghan elite, with that money, what I mentioned could've easily been created, and divide the remaining money amongst the Afghan national. Each Afghan should easily end up with $50,000, which is more than enough to smile for them, and live in peace.

Your thoughts?

[ComradePashtun]

hahaha Bone Head. lol You really hate the guy, he deserves it because he is the head the second most corrupt government on the planet.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

I see, but isn't Iraq now an Iranian stooge, hence the tough neighbors surrounding you theory does hold true? I.e, it implies that Afghanistan might end up as
A)Iranian stooge
B)Pakistani stooge

I do agree that the US can easily arm the Afghans with tough equipment. If the US truly wants to help Afghans, they can give them 3 Nuclear weapons(3 in case 1 goes bad), an array of F16s, some nice air planes, train Afghan men in West Point, and build some CUNY or SUNY style universities. Afghans are NOT asking for the MIT, CMU, CalTech's, a CUNY style system would certainly bring Afghanistan on it's foot. Technion is credited for single-handledly bringing Israel to the forefront of science.

However, the main question here is:
Is a stable Afghanistan truly in the American interest? As an Engineer, it took me no longer than a couple of minutes to come up with a solution that will work, guaranteed. Considering the trillion dollars they wasted on the Afghan elite, with that money, what I mentioned could've easily been created, and divide the remaining money amongst the Afghan national. Each Afghan should easily end up with $50,000, which is more than enough to smile for them, and live in peace.

Your thoughts?

Admin I think your point about Iran/Iraq is a valid one and I think I have a fair response. Give me about 2 days to respond.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

hahaha Bone Head. lol You really hate the guy, he deserves it because he is the head the second most corrupt government on the planet.

Lets just say I had a run in with one of them at one point and got to understand a whole lot in a short amount of time.

[ComradePashtun]

Very true probably, and I respect that.

[BarakzaiAbdali]

I see, but isn't Iraq now an Iranian stooge, hence the tough neighbors surrounding you theory does hold true? I.e, it implies that Afghanistan might end up as
A)Iranian stooge
B)Pakistani stooge

I do agree that the US can easily arm the Afghans with tough equipment. If the US truly wants to help Afghans, they can give them 3 Nuclear weapons(3 in case 1 goes bad), an array of F16s, some nice air planes, train Afghan men in West Point, and build some CUNY or SUNY style universities. Afghans are NOT asking for the MIT, CMU, CalTech's, a CUNY style system would certainly bring Afghanistan on it's foot. Technion is credited for single-handledly bringing Israel to the forefront of science.

However, the main question here is:
Is a stable Afghanistan truly in the American interest? As an Engineer, it took me no longer than a couple of minutes to come up with a solution that will work, guaranteed. Considering the trillion dollars they wasted on the Afghan elite, with that money, what I mentioned could've easily been created, and divide the remaining money amongst the Afghan national. Each Afghan should easily end up with $50,000, which is more than enough to smile for them, and live in peace.

Your thoughts?

Sorry for the late response.

The issue was never Americans staying to avoid Iran dominating the shiite government in Baghdad. Instead, Maliki was installed and defended by the Americans themselves. They had a level of back room dealing and cooperation with the Iranians the whole time in order to be able to leave the place. So their very presence was the nidus and catalyst for the current situation today.

The recent spates of violence in Iraq more than prove that the surge approach advocated by Kagan, Petreus, and the Iraqi neocon equivalents was a failure... the general modus operandi of these folks that are America's adversaries in these places is to draw them in and then, when the going gets tough - to lay low and bide their time.

And time point zero was not 2003. Iraq was a stooge state one way or the other since the British protectorate. Saddam himself was an American creation.

So this actually more than proves the point - if complete autonomy is not achieved it will be thorn filled and painful path of neocolonialzation for the region.

The whole premise of Karzai's ill begotten game is that the chess pieces on the board are already not A) Iranian stooges or B) Pakistani stooges and that they can all be dominated by the King/Queen pieces on the board (America).

The reality is far different. As you have noted eloquently - none of these groups wants an empowered Afghanistan in any way shape or form.

So the Iraq example is a testament that colonial powers are in continuous collusion and will always view their former territories as fair game to intervene in unless complete autonomy is achieved. A long succession of Karzai/Saddam Husseins with sycophantic acolytes awaits should Karzai prevail (which he wont).

[Azmal]

What alternative do you have to offer BA?

lol you ask him that admin khana..we all know he is putting in the rough...comparing Iraq---with 100 of billions in gas revenue with Afghanistan that can’t even pay for its military on her own is preposterous...just for the record US troops are deployed in more than 150 countries around the world…and yet not in any of these countries US troops can be prosecuted under that countries law…we saw this few years ago when some US troops rape a Japanese girl and yet the trail were held in US militarily court…which feuled a lot of anti-Americanism there.